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Probably, I don't know why that surprises you Isaac Send a noteboard - 27/03/2013 02:02:54 AM

View original posti think we are just going to have to leave this where it is, because it's becoming increasingly difficult to continue having a reasoned dialogue when anything i could possibly say on the subject is met with "typical left response" or "that's a favorite of the liberals".

When that applies it is what I'm going to say. You don't claim that the things I said are untrue or that they aren't common arguments from the left, you just object to me calling a spade a spade. Well I have heard these arguments I labeled as common quite frequently, some are new, or new-ish, common thought thread but different flavor, and I don't label them, and label or not I explained my objections.


View original postfor the record, my opinions on how to deal with the gun culture in this country are from years of my own musings on the subject, and my own experiences with actual street level violence, and any similarity to any "official" positions you disagree with are probably due to others reaching similar conclusions.

Most people feel that way, not sure how true it really is or that its an admirable thing. Anecdotal experience is often a very bad basis for drawing conclusions off of, and certainly bad to prove cases from.


i could easily go through all of your posts here and add "that's a favorite argument from right wing gun nuts" but i don't think it accomplishes anything other than denigrating your opinions out of hand without actually considering whether they have merit. if that is how this is going to go, then i am ending it now. good day...

You wouldn't need to, you regularly insulted various right wing beliefs and I outright said I agreed with them, I am very unclear on why it is deemed offensive to use 'common arguments'. I called out one of yours on the grounds that it was common and used what I consider to be very flawed logic, which I explained. It wasn't that it was common, it's that I consider it flawed and something said so often people no longer try to consider it critically, it 'just is' to them. I happen to believe life begins at conception, more or less, you wouldn't offend me by saying that was a common right wing argument. I'd object to the 'gun nuts' bit, I don't recall having said anything equivalent but I might have.

Still I agree this is a good place to call it quits. As I said a long way back I didn't expect us to make any real headway, you can exit when you please and this is probably as good a time as any other.

The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.
- Albert Einstein

King of Cairhien 20-7-2
Chancellor of the Landsraad, Archduke of Is'Mod
This message last edited by Isaac on 27/03/2013 at 02:05:11 AM
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US Senate Democrats - already cave-in on the gun control bill - 19/03/2013 10:44:55 PM 1279 Views
right wingers are always point out there is no point legislating cosmetics - 19/03/2013 11:52:28 PM 697 Views
Late Term Abortion, Terry Schavio? *NM* - 19/03/2013 11:57:25 PM 347 Views
You know, what you are hoping for will not make any difference whatsoever..... - 20/03/2013 01:07:58 AM 546 Views
"if at first you don't succeed..... fuck it...." - 20/03/2013 04:10:47 AM 571 Views
I can agree with some of what you stated, though I prefer "logical" to "right winger" - 20/03/2013 01:56:34 AM 587 Views
you are correct. i forget sometimes that there **is** some common ground here.... - 20/03/2013 04:19:13 AM 532 Views
There'd be more common ground if anything were ever offered in exchange for concessions - 20/03/2013 02:20:26 PM 562 Views
Ben Franklin said it best... - 20/03/2013 04:14:45 PM 564 Views
interesting how that quote always applies to so many things, isn't it? - 20/03/2013 05:14:30 PM 523 Views
Absolutely - 21/03/2013 12:20:45 AM 597 Views
if there have to be concessions, what do you recommend? - 20/03/2013 05:10:53 PM 626 Views
That would depend, something of equal value - 20/03/2013 09:13:23 PM 523 Views
when very little is being given up, how do we determine equal value? - 20/03/2013 10:31:59 PM 800 Views
Outside of legislature people do it all the time, its called negotiation and bargaining - 21/03/2013 10:53:22 AM 553 Views
Re: Outside of legislature people do it all the time, its called negotiation and bargaining - 21/03/2013 07:16:57 PM 603 Views
Re: Outside of legislature people do it all the time, its called negotiation and bargaining - 21/03/2013 08:53:20 PM 692 Views
some answers - 21/03/2013 10:04:45 PM 923 Views
Re: some answers - 21/03/2013 11:33:21 PM 691 Views
Re: the NRA - 22/03/2013 07:44:06 PM 528 Views
This is a matter of POV bias - 22/03/2013 09:04:25 PM 484 Views
we will have to agree to disagree then - 22/03/2013 10:12:02 PM 534 Views
I already knew we disagreed, that's why I suggested bargaining - 22/03/2013 11:11:04 PM 489 Views
i am merely taking the NRA at their word(s) - 23/03/2013 12:13:18 AM 484 Views
Re: i am merely taking the NRA at their word(s) - 23/03/2013 02:04:39 AM 740 Views
i am not trying to sway, just come to an understanding - 23/03/2013 03:03:14 PM 706 Views
I think you've actually managed to widen our gap - 23/03/2013 03:53:55 PM 716 Views
yes, because it was a failed attempt to re-boot and start the debate from the beginning..... - 24/03/2013 03:33:05 AM 887 Views
I've difficulty seeing the point of going back to first principles but I'm willing to try - 24/03/2013 02:13:29 PM 529 Views
this has been more insightful than our previous tit-for-tat responses, actually - 26/03/2013 07:40:27 PM 511 Views
There's always room for reaosnable dialogue - 26/03/2013 10:09:58 PM 803 Views
even so, we are at yet another impasse.... - 26/03/2013 11:37:04 PM 605 Views
Probably, I don't know why that surprises you - 27/03/2013 02:02:54 AM 490 Views
I can see the argument for limiting magazine capapcity but it would be hard to enforce - 20/03/2013 05:11:51 PM 530 Views
It would be a stupid meaningless "feel good" law as changing magazines takes almost no time. *NM* - 21/03/2013 01:05:34 PM 287 Views
I can't argue that - 21/03/2013 06:14:09 PM 545 Views
canada's magazine restrictions are credited with reducing fatalities in a mass shooting - 21/03/2013 07:22:45 PM 614 Views
what is high capacity? - 21/03/2013 11:09:09 PM 503 Views
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Regarding guns sold which are used in crimes - 20/03/2013 10:41:21 PM 521 Views
Your specified legal requirements already exist. *NM* - 21/03/2013 02:05:12 AM 263 Views
So what other stipulations would you put into effect? *NM* - 21/03/2013 02:42:53 AM 280 Views
none- I'd simply actually punish criminals instead of trying to "reform" them. *NM* - 21/03/2013 01:13:29 PM 299 Views
Criminals need to be punished AND reformed for their inevitable release back into society *NM* - 21/03/2013 11:58:20 PM 276 Views
I've always been rather partial to the criminal justice system in Heinlein's Starship Troopers novel - 22/03/2013 02:42:09 AM 629 Views
Yeah you're right. Let's just kill everybody who commits a crime - 22/03/2013 02:46:49 AM 532 Views
*NM* - 22/03/2013 10:55:36 AM 300 Views
That's not in Starship Troopers - 22/03/2013 12:51:44 PM 548 Views
Yeah, there was a small number of capital offenses (13 I think), most not specified. - 22/03/2013 05:27:11 PM 525 Views
14 then, he lists stupidity as one in another book - 22/03/2013 07:35:13 PM 567 Views
That's why we NEED to reform prisoners - 22/03/2013 10:33:08 PM 508 Views
It is probably an option we should work harder to develop - 23/03/2013 12:38:33 AM 564 Views
Out of curiosity. Is anyone against background checks at gun shows, and if so, why? *NM* - 21/03/2013 09:38:59 AM 284 Views
Not in principle but somewhat in practice - 21/03/2013 11:25:25 AM 668 Views
For what its worth.... - 21/03/2013 03:13:44 PM 507 Views
Personally, I am worried about criminals with guns. BUT... - 22/03/2013 03:44:47 PM 788 Views
What you are not factoring into your though process is that most criminals feels the same way. - 24/03/2013 12:56:04 PM 817 Views
I realize that can be the case. But... - 25/03/2013 03:32:59 PM 701 Views
Twice I was almost robbed, and my parents were robbed several times. - 26/03/2013 01:35:11 PM 421 Views

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