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Funny. nossy Send a noteboard - 04/04/2013 09:18:15 PM

Point by point.


View original postPeople can live comfortably if they live frugally.

I am not handicapped, stupid, lazy or any number of other very human things that you are ignoring. I worked my ASS off for years and still could rarely afford any amenities. Hell, I frequently had to choose between food and paying bills. I know what it is to live frugally and survive, but not be able to afford things most americans take for granted -- that was without any of the problems you so quickly dismiss. What if any ONE of them had happened to me? Do you really think it's that simple?
I know there are people who simply don't have the brain power to amount to anything, but should they just give up? Are you telling me there's not one stupid person making a comfortable living that doesn't require being smart?

Why do you think I'm suggesting they "give up?" I'm saying that it's sheer blindness to assume that they may not need help, or that they aren't trying. You have NO idea how much effort people are putting in, unless you think only people with money are trying. That's blind and horrible - there are millions of people who live in the gray area between lazy-giver-uppers and comfortably-not-poor.
As far as disabilities go, their families will have to take care of them. Seeing how they will never have a normal life, they are irrelevant to this discussion.

... I don't think you're trolling? This comment is ridiculous, and I don't understand how you can think it's so easily dismissed. Where does that money come from? You think people can work a full-time job while being full-time caregivers? Maybe several jobs? This is exactly what you can't so conveniently ignore.
I'm talking about the poor who aren't handicapped (other than being dumb). I grew up dirt poor thanks to horrible parents, so I know what I'm talking about here.

I was fairly dirt poor too (steel mill family), and I'm proud of me for making it. Hell, I'm proud of you too, if you did it. However, this does not on any level mean that everyone else can do what we did. It's rude and abusively myopic to assume such a thing.

None of this says I think people shouldn't be pushed, or that we shouldn't have expectations like what we had for ourselves. It's more that you cannot assume that just because someone is struggling (or failing) that he/she isn't trying. And trying. And trying.

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Liberalism has officially failed - Poverty reaches 1960 levels - Anonymous2000 - 04/04/2013 12:33:15 AM 1198 Views
As has Conservatism. Dannymac - 04/04/2013 12:37:23 AM 700 Views
I know it hurts.....but the truth about liberalism will set you free! Anonymous2000 - 04/04/2013 12:42:57 AM 805 Views
That's a flawed analogy these days, since conservative policies are anti-education spending. Burr - 04/04/2013 01:24:22 AM 811 Views
Have you ever tried to fish when really hungry? Dannymac - 04/04/2013 06:32:17 AM 728 Views
HA! HA! In your dreams that's how liberalism works. How about..... Anonymous2000 - 04/04/2013 04:59:33 PM 665 Views
and lo, Jesus said unto the poor gathered to him: "begone freeloaders! the wealthy need more money" moondog - 04/04/2013 06:43:32 PM 752 Views
Interestingly enough.... Jeordam - 04/04/2013 09:20:06 PM 710 Views
Re: Interestingly enough.... nossy - 04/04/2013 09:31:27 PM 729 Views
Well here is where theology gets fun.... Jeordam - 04/04/2013 09:48:50 PM 772 Views
The entire post...as well as many of the sub-threads....prompts the question of: Jeordam - 04/04/2013 09:39:16 PM 774 Views
it depends on what your definition of "succeed" is i guess.... moondog - 04/04/2013 10:27:30 PM 822 Views
And that is certainly your opinion.... Jeordam - 04/04/2013 10:54:08 PM 819 Views
Re: And that is certainly your opinion.... moondog - 04/04/2013 11:57:34 PM 892 Views
Hmm good questions Nighthawk - 04/04/2013 10:29:45 PM 807 Views
you contradicted yourself moondog - 04/04/2013 10:44:47 PM 726 Views
Re: you contradicted yourself Nighthawk - 04/04/2013 10:54:35 PM 795 Views
i think i understand where you're coming from.... moondog - 05/04/2013 07:33:32 PM 776 Views
I see the problem random thoughts - 04/04/2013 06:45:53 PM 729 Views
since you don't trust the gov't, what are you doing to help the poor survive? moondog - 04/04/2013 12:58:49 AM 802 Views
A few serious answers, if you can handle them..... Anonymous2000 - 04/04/2013 04:15:32 AM 703 Views
Re: A few serious answers, if you can handle them..... moondog - 04/04/2013 06:42:00 PM 828 Views
Perhaps its time to try a little fact checking. heartbreak - 04/04/2013 03:34:44 AM 975 Views
I'm happy you agree with me, liberalism has failed and it's time for something different. Anonymous2000 - 04/04/2013 03:47:17 AM 690 Views
Oh the cleverness of you. heartbreak - 04/04/2013 03:52:07 AM 855 Views
Wow, I'm shocked. Yes, let's stick with the failed status quo. Good plan! Anonymous2000 - 04/04/2013 04:17:32 AM 647 Views
Who said anything about the status quo? I just said I didn't agree with your solution. *NM* heartbreak - 04/04/2013 04:19:37 AM 434 Views
Then time to step up, what's your idea? Anonymous2000 - 04/04/2013 04:22:58 AM 646 Views
As you might say, "What do you expect, a free ride?" heartbreak - 04/04/2013 11:45:02 AM 868 Views
How typicaly conservative! And no. Dannymac - 04/04/2013 02:05:00 PM 688 Views
Variaitons of this plan have been tried elsewhere with lesser or negligible resistance Isaac - 04/04/2013 03:31:22 PM 780 Views
Agreed and this is how we will finance such a move Roland00 - 04/04/2013 04:01:46 AM 765 Views
I'm glad you agree! Anonymous2000 - 04/04/2013 04:21:25 AM 720 Views
No, in Europe, liberalism is generally successful Sports_Gambler - 04/04/2013 06:15:34 AM 706 Views
Liberalism & Conservatism 'officially fail' about ever other year I've noticed, still around though *NM* Isaac - 04/04/2013 09:02:42 AM 337 Views
Yes. I wonder if there will ever be an age of fiscally responsible/conservative liberals. Avendesora - 05/04/2013 03:41:09 AM 771 Views
I guess it depends on how you define the terms Isaac - 05/04/2013 08:52:25 AM 918 Views
*nod* Avendesora - 05/04/2013 01:30:47 PM 772 Views
Re: *nod* Isaac - 05/04/2013 03:12:17 PM 681 Views
Off topic: are you gardening yet? Avendesora - 05/04/2013 02:25:06 PM 624 Views
Initial stuff Isaac - 05/04/2013 03:21:25 PM 615 Views
Re: Initial stuff moondog - 05/04/2013 07:10:57 PM 686 Views
Re: Initial stuff Avendesora - 05/04/2013 08:19:16 PM 737 Views
Re: Initial stuff Isaac - 05/04/2013 11:21:56 PM 746 Views
I didn't know they make LED grow lights! Avendesora - 06/04/2013 12:18:25 AM 884 Views
It's a bit newer because of the price, that's been dropping Isaac - 06/04/2013 01:20:10 AM 754 Views
Re: Initial stuff Isaac - 05/04/2013 11:11:12 PM 864 Views
Re: Initial stuff Avendesora - 05/04/2013 07:56:47 PM 746 Views
Re: Initial stuff Isaac - 06/04/2013 12:36:10 AM 877 Views
Re: Initial stuff Avendesora - 06/04/2013 02:01:59 AM 785 Views
Re: Initial stuff Isaac - 06/04/2013 03:19:39 AM 633 Views
Yes, the logical step is to go for Nordic style socialism. jh - 04/04/2013 03:19:17 PM 753 Views
well that and a tiny homogenous population funded by large oil reserves random thoughts - 04/04/2013 06:57:51 PM 711 Views
Eh, you're describing norway. jh - 04/04/2013 08:11:25 PM 677 Views
The Economist (of all people) was singing the praises of the Nordic countries recently. Legolas - 04/04/2013 08:49:36 PM 729 Views
Hey, guess what? nossy - 04/04/2013 08:55:59 PM 684 Views
Awesome. Legolas - 04/04/2013 09:22:13 PM 600 Views
Oh my gosh! nossy - 04/04/2013 09:27:17 PM 616 Views
Yes! Legolas - 04/04/2013 09:33:45 PM 653 Views
Yay! nossy - 04/04/2013 09:37:40 PM 674 Views
We're Maryland, actually, as I recall. Legolas - 04/04/2013 10:15:49 PM 652 Views
You need to vist Dallas or LA and tell me what qualifes for a large immigrant population random thoughts - 05/04/2013 03:23:13 AM 676 Views
Eh survival of the fittest Nighthawk - 04/04/2013 06:18:52 PM 768 Views
Excuse me? nossy - 04/04/2013 08:42:24 PM 701 Views
Cry me a river Nighthawk - 04/04/2013 08:55:40 PM 726 Views
Funny. nossy - 04/04/2013 09:18:15 PM 721 Views
Re: Funny. Nighthawk - 04/04/2013 10:19:35 PM 733 Views
good for you for making it but you are so full of bullshit moondog - 04/04/2013 10:38:45 PM 738 Views
Re: good for you for making it but you are so full of bullshit Nighthawk - 04/04/2013 10:49:14 PM 718 Views
Wow. nossy - 04/04/2013 11:27:06 PM 733 Views
Re: Wow. Nighthawk - 05/04/2013 12:18:08 AM 834 Views
congrats on being part of the problem.... *NM* moondog - 05/04/2013 04:48:58 AM 379 Views
It's pointless to argue with those who don't understand the psychology of generational poverty. *NM* Avendesora - 05/04/2013 03:43:40 AM 358 Views
Clearly. *NM* nossy - 05/04/2013 07:32:21 PM 323 Views
Oh the "it's nobody's fault excuse" Nighthawk - 05/04/2013 08:56:51 PM 694 Views
Get back to me when you know wtf you're talking about. *NM* Avendesora - 05/04/2013 09:03:08 PM 357 Views
I'm back *NM* Nighthawk - 06/04/2013 01:40:47 AM 337 Views
You're over-generalizing a bit Isaac - 06/04/2013 01:49:02 AM 812 Views
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