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I hear what you're saying, but... Tom Send a noteboard - 16/03/2017 11:53:19 PM

It's a highly subjective point. I mean, was Lenin committed to the Revolution because he thought it would make peoples' lives better, or was he motivated by the same hatred and envy that motivates the Left today? And does that make it any less selfish?

Sure, there's a bit more attenuation between cause and effect when the person is engaging in a level of lying to oneself. At the same time, Lenin's formative event was the fact that his older brother was executed for being part of a plot to kill the Tsar.

To bring it all full circle, there's a joke about Georgians that goes as follows:

"I want to drink to Givi," says the first Georgian. "When his father was murdered, he went out and found the three men who did it and killed them."

"No, let's drink to Gogi," says the second one. "When his brother was killed, he went out and found the men who did it and killed them and all their families."

"In that case," says the third one, "Let's drink to Lenin. He got revenge on the entire country when they killed his brother!"

Political correctness is the pettiest form of casuistry.

ἡ δὲ κἀκ τριῶν τρυπημάτων ἐργαζομένη ἐνεκάλει τῇ φύσει, δυσφορουμένη, ὅτι δὴ μὴ καὶ τοὺς τιτθοὺς αὐτῇ εὐρύτερον ἢ νῦν εἰσι τρυπώη, ὅπως καὶ ἄλλην ἐνταῦθα μίξιν ἐπιτεχνᾶσθαι δυνατὴ εἴη. – Procopius

Ummaka qinnassa nīk!

*MySmiley*
This message last edited by Tom on 16/03/2017 at 11:53:57 PM
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The February Revolution and Kerensky’s Missed Opportunity - 13/03/2017 09:37:00 PM 674 Views
Fascinating stuff - 13/03/2017 10:52:58 PM 317 Views
Who knows? It could have been worse off. - 13/03/2017 11:37:54 PM 408 Views
What's your opinion on Lenin? - 14/03/2017 02:06:59 AM 352 Views
Lenin. A monster. - 14/03/2017 12:55:18 PM 381 Views
Thanks. I'll ask him too. *NM* - 14/03/2017 03:01:36 PM 185 Views
Lenin, Stalin and Trotsky were all bloodthirsty mass murderers. - 14/03/2017 08:59:06 PM 405 Views
That's fascinating. But give me a book recommendation! - 14/03/2017 09:15:57 PM 318 Views
Start with a general history of Russia - 14/03/2017 10:17:22 PM 429 Views
Excellent. Thank you. It's next on the list. - 15/03/2017 02:11:14 AM 387 Views
Russian history is as depressing as they come. - 15/03/2017 12:08:15 PM 389 Views
Read Figes first, I suppose. - 14/03/2017 10:55:23 PM 344 Views
Thanks, Tom. I've been putting off reading good literature because of my unfamiliarity with Russia. *NM* - 15/03/2017 02:12:10 AM 176 Views
Which books have you put off reading? *NM* - 15/03/2017 12:05:32 PM 162 Views
DEMONS and THE BROTHERS KARAMAZOV are the big two. - 15/03/2017 02:58:13 PM 326 Views
You don't necessarily need to know the history. - 15/03/2017 03:15:38 PM 364 Views
I'm always afraid I'm missing something critical, though! - 15/03/2017 03:50:59 PM 316 Views
Annotations are amazing. My eBook version of War and Peace was the same. - 15/03/2017 04:03:59 PM 337 Views
My High School English teacher neglected Russian literature. - 16/03/2017 01:46:29 AM 295 Views
Hmmmm. - 16/03/2017 01:18:14 PM 332 Views
Tolstoy was a reprehensible human being - 15/03/2017 04:02:52 PM 318 Views
I had no idea. I was under the impression he was deeply devout. - 16/03/2017 01:47:43 AM 335 Views
Here's one example: - 16/03/2017 02:06:45 AM 330 Views
Good lord. The man sounds deranged. But that's fascinating! Is there a good biography on him? *NM* - 16/03/2017 07:50:10 AM 165 Views
Pavel Basinsky's bio is best - 16/03/2017 02:46:47 PM 483 Views
Getting it now. Thanks. *NM* - 16/03/2017 11:06:25 PM 168 Views
For what it's worth, I read Lenin & Trotsky as genuine idealists, while Stalin as just a thug - 15/03/2017 11:16:36 AM 371 Views
I think that's entirely incorrect. - 15/03/2017 04:00:54 PM 372 Views
I didn't mean stupid or brutish, I meant more like a mafia don than a statesman - 16/03/2017 12:18:34 PM 281 Views
Well if you want to completely redefine the phrase "just a thug", perhaps you're right - 16/03/2017 02:43:38 PM 324 Views
Good point - 16/03/2017 09:52:29 PM 410 Views
I hear what you're saying, but... - 16/03/2017 11:53:19 PM 342 Views
Attempt at clarification - 17/03/2017 12:55:03 AM 403 Views
Hehehe..."Fuck off" - 19/03/2017 05:23:49 PM 346 Views
Seems kind of nonsensical - 14/03/2017 01:33:49 AM 419 Views
Good reply. - 14/03/2017 12:57:47 PM 400 Views
They weren't really wrong - 14/03/2017 01:30:07 PM 425 Views
I do enjoy historical "what if" situations. - 14/03/2017 01:47:27 AM 345 Views
Hi there. - 14/03/2017 01:02:44 PM 303 Views
I still think democracy among those insidiously intrusive Western values Russia resists so fiercely - 14/03/2017 02:37:39 PM 337 Views
Is it your persistant anti-Russia bias that makes you so dogmatic? - 14/03/2017 02:51:23 PM 337 Views
I have no problem with Russia, only its government - 14/03/2017 03:07:14 PM 360 Views
Really? - 14/03/2017 03:15:10 PM 354 Views
What a terrible article - 14/03/2017 08:04:50 PM 307 Views
I thought you would think this way. - 15/03/2017 12:04:57 PM 392 Views
I can't decide what I think about Evans - 15/03/2017 04:10:05 PM 309 Views

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