None; if the other side frames an issue better than you, that's your fault, not theirs.
Joel Send a noteboard - 15/03/2010 07:55:57 AM
Words have always been complicated. They accrue and change meanings with little to no warning, based on time and distance. That said, there are some that I would very much like to see removed from the discourse, just in interests of getting people back on the same page.
Case numero uno? Liberal. Cut it out, burn it, send it down the river and find another way to describe the left side of American politics. The term has come to be owned almost entirely by right wing pundits, and I doubt there is any reclaiming it. It has become a bad word, and imprecise, besides. No group of people can ever be described as Monolithic, anyway, but the word Liberal has come to be this fearsome THEM that is, apparently, trying to destroy America. It's been attached to so many issues that I doubt you could find a single instance of a true "liberal" in the sense the pundits use the term.
I don't know if conservative, it's opposite number, has the same feelings for those who are most traditionally placed under it. On the whole, the word conservative seems to be a badge of pride for those who claim it. If so, they are welcome to it. I am actually curious as to whether or not that is the case.
Case numero uno? Liberal. Cut it out, burn it, send it down the river and find another way to describe the left side of American politics. The term has come to be owned almost entirely by right wing pundits, and I doubt there is any reclaiming it. It has become a bad word, and imprecise, besides. No group of people can ever be described as Monolithic, anyway, but the word Liberal has come to be this fearsome THEM that is, apparently, trying to destroy America. It's been attached to so many issues that I doubt you could find a single instance of a true "liberal" in the sense the pundits use the term.
I don't know if conservative, it's opposite number, has the same feelings for those who are most traditionally placed under it. On the whole, the word conservative seems to be a badge of pride for those who claim it. If so, they are welcome to it. I am actually curious as to whether or not that is the case.
There, you've diagnosed it right there: "conservative" isn't as widely derided as "liberal" because conservatives refuse to be ashamed of it just because the opposition says they should be. They DO proudly associate themselves with the word rather than fleeing it as most Democrats do "liberal. " It's a bad position from which to start, because when you begin by trying to rebrand positions you KNOW are liberal as something else you're conceding that the other side is right to oppose them AND being dishonest into the bargain.
Pro-Life: I say this only because so many supposedly Pro-Life people also support the death penalty, as well as cutting aid to single mothers who didn't have abortions. I think they should either be actually pro-life, or just own Pro-Fetus. As a conciliatory move, if anyone can come up with a soundbyte version of "Pro-Choice for expectant mothers over their own bodies" then feel free to make both sides change.
Yes, the left let the right out rhetoric them again; once again, whose fault is that? And they haven't even all learned their lesson; "liberals" are nearly as likely as conservatives to call late term abortions "partial birth abortions. "
Family Values: Whose Family? Yours? Mine? Your boyfriends? His boyfriends? Can we all just admit that the words "Family Values Candidate" has become one of the biggest jokes of American Politics and save some poor closeted future Senator the humiliation?
In a word, no, because I think there needs to be an accounting for the Family Values Partys devaluing families, and because valuing families is very much a part of effective politics, IMHO. Families are one of the few "demographics" to which pretty much everyone belongs, but the people who invoke the term routinely do so as a means of defining themselves in opposition to "anti-family" forces. Seriously, who is genuinely anti-family? Even the most strident critics of traditional nuclear families care about their parents, their siblings, etc. That "family values" candidates and advocates are routinely exposed as repressed/closeted hypocrites is just icing on the cake.
Intelligent Design: This one annoys the crap out of me, primarily because, technically speaking, I believe in it. I do believe in an intelligent designer. Moment I say that, of course, I have people raging at me for shoving religion down their throats and others asking me to write letters to local school boards to have the Science books changed. Ok, on the whole it refers to the supposedly scientific theory, and so is more a matter of my own annoyance than anything.
It's a phrase that means many things to many people. It does not, in itself, involve anyone taking an active ongoing role in creation beyond the first instance of existence (something I recognize so implicitly that I got into a lot of trouble when I first encountered the term on the old CMB, because a lot of its advocates seem to think it demands a constant tinkerer. ) It's also a good example of another reason I don't want to ban words or phrases: We are all better served by confronting the shades of meaning the phrase can have than by ignoring them completely. No matter far you do or don't take the concept of a Designer, the theorys unverifiable nature is enough to exclude it from science class (though not necessarily from public education altogether. ) People need to understand that to have any hope of understanding science, and that so many DON'T is the source of many tiresomely pointless debates.
"Support the Troops." This phrase should be banned from any campaigning, period. I have yet to meet a single candidate (State or National) who did not wave that flag at some point. We need to come up with easy phrases to recognize, at first glance, whether your preferred method of Troop Support involves bringing them home, offering extended resources while in combat, or offering solid resources once they come home. Anyone who claims to "support the troops" while simultaneously cutting VA funding should be put to death by firing squad.
I think it needs to stay, both so that people make clear they DO support those who put it all on the line for their freedom despite opposing how soldiers are used, and because there have been well documented cases in US history where people have condemned soldiers as much victims of politicians failures as anyone else was. Spitting on a soldier because of a war is like spitting on a meteorologist because of the weather.
And yes, I am aware that this list is leftist leaning. After all, I do lean left. Feel free to add any you feel I missed in order to make it fair and balanced.
Actually, let's add "fair and balanced" to the list. Everyone is biased. If we made everyone admit that going in, I think our Politics would be much cleaner, afterwards...
Actually, let's add "fair and balanced" to the list. Everyone is biased. If we made everyone admit that going in, I think our Politics would be much cleaner, afterwards...
"Fair and balanced" was always a joke, a denial of the obvious, so let that reminder of dishonesty endure to highlight it. Meanwhile, we need to move beyond the idea that presenting shrill minorities from both sides in any way represents the majority.
But, no, I don't believe in any censorship beyond self censorship. There's only one word I think should never be used because of its legacy, but even there I believe it should be a personal choice, although I also think anyone using it without quotes is demonstrating a failure in judgment at the very least.
Honorbound and honored to be Bonded to Mahtaliel Sedai
Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.
Love still can't be coerced.
Please Don't Eat the Newbies!
LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.
Love still can't be coerced.
Please Don't Eat the Newbies!

LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
If you could ban some words from political discourse, which would you ban?
- 13/03/2010 06:35:25 AM
1313 Views
all of them.
- 13/03/2010 04:42:02 PM
555 Views
I'm sure the one-fingered salute would turn up more frequently, then.
- 14/03/2010 02:31:34 PM
496 Views
Two: Bipartisan and progressive.
- 13/03/2010 05:14:36 PM
517 Views
"progressive" was created to get around the "liberal" label the right uses
- 13/03/2010 06:00:40 PM
534 Views
Does the right really have the power to make a word dirty?
- 13/03/2010 06:27:46 PM
548 Views
considering that "liberal" has taken the place of "communist" for "something bad" i'd say yes
- 13/03/2010 07:07:21 PM
485 Views
There's a flawed premise in there though
- 13/03/2010 10:43:58 PM
561 Views
Re: There's a flawed premise in there though
- 14/03/2010 09:34:58 AM
597 Views
Re: There's a flawed premise in there though
- 14/03/2010 02:56:45 PM
549 Views
If that's the case you should try to reclaim the word, not demonize it.
- 15/03/2010 08:14:11 AM
609 Views
It probably will be down the road
- 15/03/2010 04:59:58 PM
627 Views
Good...?
- 15/03/2010 09:17:22 PM
673 Views
- 15/03/2010 09:17:22 PM
673 Views
Re: Good...?
- 15/03/2010 10:20:53 PM
699 Views
- 15/03/2010 10:20:53 PM
699 Views
Re: Good...?
- 29/03/2010 04:15:16 PM
603 Views
- 29/03/2010 04:15:16 PM
603 Views
Joel and Isaac prepare to hijack another thread
- 30/03/2010 01:15:40 AM
735 Views
- 30/03/2010 01:15:40 AM
735 Views
As long as I get top billing.
- 03/04/2010 11:54:38 AM
686 Views
- 03/04/2010 11:54:38 AM
686 Views
Re: As long as I get top billing.
- 03/04/2010 12:50:54 PM
634 Views
- 03/04/2010 12:50:54 PM
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Re: As long as I get top billing.
- 04/04/2010 01:33:27 PM
554 Views
- 04/04/2010 01:33:27 PM
554 Views
I woulkd say the left made the word liberal dirty
- 15/03/2010 05:15:24 PM
482 Views
it must be a terrible terrible burden on you to have all the answers to everything...
*NM*
- 15/03/2010 11:08:04 PM
321 Views
*NM*
- 15/03/2010 11:08:04 PM
321 Views
just as being stupid must be a burden for you *NM*
- 16/03/2010 02:06:43 PM
243 Views
what? no sandy vagina comment? you're slipping.... *NM*
- 16/03/2010 02:51:19 PM
275 Views
How's that paranoia treating you?
- 16/03/2010 12:53:31 AM
518 Views
how is that head in sand treating you?
- 16/03/2010 02:19:54 PM
524 Views
Re: how is that head in sand treating you?
- 16/03/2010 09:07:09 PM
670 Views
Which fringe group do you believe I belong to?
- 16/03/2010 10:23:53 PM
425 Views
if all of this is true....
- 16/03/2010 11:17:19 PM
525 Views
Because strong partisanship and actual extremism are two very different things, I'd say.
*NM*
- 16/03/2010 11:27:02 PM
266 Views
*NM*
- 16/03/2010 11:27:02 PM
266 Views
I am a militant moderate
- 18/03/2010 01:45:40 PM
465 Views
Just because an idea is new DOESN'T mean it constitutes progress, agreed.
- 15/03/2010 08:03:14 AM
575 Views
hope and change
*NM*
- 14/03/2010 03:32:34 PM
391 Views
*NM*
- 14/03/2010 03:32:34 PM
391 Views
None; if the other side frames an issue better than you, that's your fault, not theirs.
- 15/03/2010 07:55:57 AM
610 Views
Words/phrases that I would abolish:
- 15/03/2010 02:41:51 PM
647 Views
Re: Words/phrases that I would abolish:
- 15/03/2010 04:27:21 PM
628 Views
leave to a liberal to want to ban words they don't like *NM*
- 15/03/2010 05:10:19 PM
263 Views
Re: leave to a liberal to want to ban words they don't like
- 15/03/2010 05:38:24 PM
502 Views
That was weak
- 15/03/2010 05:48:34 PM
490 Views
at least it mirrored your original comment. *NM*
- 15/03/2010 05:53:34 PM
285 Views
to bad it didn't mirror reality
- 15/03/2010 08:33:18 PM
448 Views
you misspoke
- 16/03/2010 12:36:23 AM
586 Views
that is often true but I don't think it is true now
- 16/03/2010 04:12:18 PM
637 Views
Re: that is often true but I don't think it is true now
- 16/03/2010 09:34:42 PM
680 Views
Al Franken is a joke right?
- 16/03/2010 10:31:41 PM
486 Views
Re: Al Franken is a joke right?
- 17/03/2010 05:34:25 PM
529 Views

Heh. It's not what you say, it's how you say it. *edit*