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One thing to consider .. fionwe1987 Send a noteboard - 22/01/2019 12:22:25 AM

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The polls are clear that the public as a whole is blaming Trump, and rightly, but of course it's also true that Pelosi and the Dems could end this crisis and help the affected people at any time they chose, by giving up something that's pretty insignificant in reality, however big a political symbol it may have become. They are prioritizing their political victory over those people's livelihoods, just like Trump is doing. And of course just like the British government is doing in their own crisis.

Not really sure how this is going to end, but it might take quite a while before we get to that end.


I suspect another reason the Dems aren't compromising is that this is a fairly unique situation where it's the President causing the shutdown. If you give Trump a 5 billion plus wall because he's holding federal workers hostsge, what's he going to ask for next time?

I suspect negotiations would have been underway but for Trump explicitly stating, on TV, that he'd happily take credit for the shutdown. After that, and given that this was the very first piece of legislation post their election, the Dems have no real way to say yes.

Had Trump been cleverer about this, he could have gotten his initial 1.3 billion dollar ask in exchange for the protection for Dreamers he's now offering. It's a ridiculous ask, but it might have worked. Now, I don't know. I think both sides see the humiliating defeat of the other as the only possible way to "win". That's not a standoff with a quick resolution.

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For about five minutes just now, I found myself thinking something very unusual... - 17/01/2019 08:40:46 PM 1230 Views
The second link doesn't work. *NM* - 17/01/2019 09:23:02 PM 261 Views
Thanks, it should work now. *NM* - 17/01/2019 09:30:18 PM 231 Views
I guess it depends on how you look at it.... - 17/01/2019 09:46:30 PM 499 Views
I'd have to bet on Pelosi there. - 17/01/2019 10:23:38 PM 668 Views
They're both disgusting... - 18/01/2019 02:38:55 AM 482 Views
The game "itself" (politics) is disgusting... - 18/01/2019 02:47:52 AM 489 Views
But Trump can deliver the State of the Union from the Oval Office if he wants to - 18/01/2019 03:58:08 AM 525 Views
Head deep up Trump's ass, I see - 18/01/2019 06:54:50 AM 485 Views
Presidents between Adams (1800) to Wilson (1913) delivered a written copy of the SOTU - 18/01/2019 02:28:55 PM 758 Views
That's interesting. I wasn't aware of that. - 18/01/2019 06:39:46 PM 503 Views
It can't just be delivered to the Senate. - 18/01/2019 08:18:56 PM 495 Views
Just use the Senate..... - 18/01/2019 08:18:07 PM 493 Views
It's could have been decent countermove - 18/01/2019 06:58:14 AM 565 Views
Re: It's could have been decent countermove - 18/01/2019 06:12:53 PM 510 Views
True enough. - 18/01/2019 08:19:43 PM 554 Views
you are probably correct thay it wouldn't have been covered, the media is that biased *NM* - 18/01/2019 08:52:41 PM 251 Views
Biased against what? - 18/01/2019 09:38:22 PM 477 Views
The speaker of the house leaving the country during a government shutdown? - 21/01/2019 07:25:32 PM 481 Views
That has to do with where she was going, I'd think - 21/01/2019 08:10:35 PM 714 Views
Sorry but hiding behind the troops doesn't fly - 22/01/2019 12:59:40 PM 492 Views
I kind of agree. - 21/01/2019 08:35:01 PM 569 Views
One thing to consider .. - 22/01/2019 12:22:25 AM 531 Views
Once the pain hits enough people the blame shield will get thin - 22/01/2019 01:20:42 PM 481 Views
The Dems may be over playing theri hands in the blame game - 22/01/2019 01:18:20 PM 593 Views
So what about the second link disgust you? - 18/01/2019 12:55:34 PM 486 Views
An aspect of this I hadn't thought about - 18/01/2019 09:49:24 PM 487 Views
That's kind of like saying.... - 18/01/2019 11:05:22 PM 443 Views
what I find most problematic about the proposed wall - 19/01/2019 12:24:30 AM 497 Views
That's... weird - 19/01/2019 07:29:32 PM 555 Views
apparently the government prevailed in other states, so there's precedent. - 19/01/2019 07:57:48 PM 475 Views
Fuck 'em - 19/01/2019 11:19:25 PM 511 Views
Fuck the histrionics dumbass - 20/01/2019 03:26:31 AM 499 Views
Wow. - 21/01/2019 05:08:28 PM 494 Views
They'd tie up the amount of money owed, maybe. Not the taking. - 24/01/2019 04:41:39 AM 522 Views
Sorry, it is not. - 19/01/2019 07:21:44 AM 485 Views
Wow. - 21/01/2019 05:14:11 PM 487 Views
That's it. You convinced me. - 21/01/2019 05:51:23 PM 509 Views
Wow. - 24/01/2019 06:14:15 AM 467 Views
Why are you so angry? - 22/01/2019 10:29:51 PM 468 Views
It IS kinda striking - 24/01/2019 06:21:14 AM 436 Views
Takification - like... to make tacky? *NM* - 19/01/2019 07:33:44 PM 230 Views
if anyone would know it should be you - 19/01/2019 08:05:03 PM 559 Views
I don't really work in manufacturing, but yeah - 20/01/2019 04:32:33 PM 582 Views

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