We seem to have 6 Roled Claims at the moment, including BA's. I'd not be surprised if we had a ninja hiding among the vanillas but with 4 vanilla claims they can't all be fake. We could have 4 DFs all pretending to be vanilla but I doubt it, and DK might have been one too. That kinda makes me want to look at the roles, we should take as a given that at least one, possibly 2 ninjas are hiding in there. I feel very confident in Ranagrande's claim, he knew the details of my RB on Yuna and he wouldn't even if he were my or Yuna's ally, since FT wouldn't send off details till dawn. So ranagrande pretty much has to be a townie. Now, Yuna or I could be, I could easily see myself being a scummer RBer and deciding to claim townie RBer, I would act as I have been by and large, I'm not a ninja, I'm a pirate, for the record I don't believe Fox's claim but there's that, I won't in the future answer direct questions like that, sets bad precedent, a lie detector should at least have to work for it, which I have to say I don't think Fox did, pirate or ninja, considering he'd have had a lot more logical of a LD test by using my very first message in the game, where I say I have no ninja references in my RM.., or for that matter Beetnemesis's first message in the game, where he openly says he's a pirate in the title of his message. Still, it could just be an oversight, its not like we have a long-standing plan for how to operate as a Lie Detector, the words 'lie detector' have only been used 15 times on the RAFO RPG board, 6 in this game, the previous 9 mostly focus on me and FT discussing the matter back in Gher's game, one does note that it was me and FT discussing it so that at least indicators lie detector is something he thinks about.

Realistically, Ranagrande's solid unless both Yuna and I are scummers, and I think the town should tihnk of both Yuna and I as prob-town though not def-town, which I tihnk applies to ranagrande as much as it can any living player. BA is def-town.

That leaves us two roles claims - plus WF depending on what he says, and I think one of those is a scummer claim. Its not that I particular accept Kylia's, or even Yuna's, it's just Fox's seems so unlikely. Consider, ranagrande is basically confirmed and while BA might have lied, he was town and he said he was investigatory - that's two investigatory roles in a game of 12, a third seems excessive, and Fox's exercise of that role seems, well, highly implausible. I strategize like crazy so I may be see ninja in the shadows from it, if I were a LD I'd have hunted through to find comments from players that were near certain, and even a quick scan yields a lot of them, not even including how everyone said they didn't have ninja in their message, which lets be honest, its very unlikely ninjas didn't get ninja in their RM, did anyone not get pirate? Its a pretty rare quirk when someone doesn't get their own faction mentioned in a RM. He answered no to that too, I find it really implausible he wouldn't have thought of that as a hunting ground for his detection. Add to that, if he was fixed on me, he could have scoped several of my other messages in which I discussed how I didn't have any variaiton of the word ninjas (i.e. ninjas) in my RM either, or how I didn't believe BA was a pirate, that I thought he was a ninja, since a ninja would know BA wasn't a ninja, that would have been a lie, and one confirming me as a ninja. Let's take a hypothetical statement:

"I think Darth Katie is a ninja"
If I'm a ninja, I know she's not, and I'll come up positive as a liar because the mod knows I don't think that. Some people who voted for BA expressed an opinion along those lines, I did, why didn't Fox check any of those?

So, my thinking goes, all right, a mistake, a ninja might realize that and have no motive to use a weak claim, if Fox is a ninja, he knows I'm a townie, so why not use as his hypothetical some more solid statement on the matter? Well, sure, problem is when you're a scummer you don't really want to be confirming people as town, because then you have to NK them not lynch them and prob-townies are much more likely to be protected or watched etc, not too mention I've got like special energizer bunny powers. Taking a comment from me that on LD confirms I'm town means their is zero chance for a lynch, but a comment that's ambiguous, where I say I'm roled and not standard town, well, looks good on initial mental inspection but he immediately got two replies, one form me and one from Kronin, pointing out that if I were a ninja RBer that definitely would have come up true, and arguably even if I were just a goon, since all goons are masons even if you don't count goon as a role in of itself. Heck, while context of 'roled' implies I was talking about non-vanilla and FT probably would go with that, vanilla is a role, but Fox already knew I was roled regardless since I'd already said I knew Yuna wasn't the killer, which implies a role, even if its mason talking to tracker-mason ally or something, so he had no reason to think I'd suddenly do a "HAHA! It's all a bluff, I'm vanilla!"

However, when compiling a fake RC mistakes happen - and people, especially for early forced claims like this, are much worse. People don't think through their claims to the depth someone of that role would. I haven't hunted too much yet, but I'm not seeing what I'd expect a LD to do, even barring the choice of words. Put yourself in the Lie Detector's shoes... what do you do on day 1? Easy, you try to ask questions, everything you post is aimed at getting people to make statements, anything at all you can check, and you note the comments that might be something someone would lie about, or if not true or true would confirm the person's alignment.

Examples:
"This is probably pointless since we all just said we don't have ninja in our RM's, but did everyone get pirate? I mean, anyone get buccaneer or something like that? If we're assuming BA's scum mostly off him having ninja in his RM, I'd kinda like to know if their was consistency in the messages."

"Isaac, you said you're roled, I'm just checking, did you get pirate in yours or did it say you were something else? Like Ship's cook or something?" asks LD
"No, just said I was a pirate" Say I. [By the way, no title, my power is granted via my large cache of rum, big surprise there]

Even joking open thrusts early on.
"Argh" posts X
"Argh? You claim to be a pirate then?" says Fox
"Aye, a pirate I be!" says X

So, presumably Fox should have been doing stuff like that, I see no indication of it, he did not admittedly post much, but even with that it seems he should have been hunting more. I haven't seen anything that looked like that.

Now, none of this proves he's a ninja, it could just be that he wasn't paying much attention to the game, and he was RBIRL a lot, and he seemed in touch withe vents during his posts, reading takes less time than posting, even when we're having posting slumps view counts on messages tend to be fairly normal. Yet he was the second to vote for BA, he's not normally an early voter, I wouldn't think he'd change that for BA if he weren't paying attention. Not proof of guilt, but I have to go with a FOS: Fox and Ravens, I won't vote for anyone till WF speaks up but right now Fox is on my radar.

Big think though...

Lie Detector
Each night the Lie Detector sends the Moderator a post made by another player during the previous day, and the Moderator tells the Lie Detector, to the best of his ability, whether that other player was telling the truth when they made that post. The power can be used, for example, to find out whether a role claim is true or not.

In one form of the role, the Lie Detector's ability is lost if he tells the other players, or they work out, what his ability is.

Find it very unlikely FT wouldn't have included that, also note, the role checks a whole post, not a single statement. Maybe FT mixed things up a bit? Maybe he overlooked the 'don't tell' option? By the wya, I know it says "In one form of the ability" but for mafiawiki vets, just about whenever it does that it means "Not originally part of the role, everyone does it this way now because it makes more sense", less a variation than version 2.0 or the patch that gets rid of the bugs on the beta-version.