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Re: Pretty good. Cannoli Send a noteboard - 06/09/2009 01:19:22 AM
An irony is that because of Brandon's own style, his descriptive paragraphs are actually longer than Jordan! The long opening survey of Tar Valon, for instance. Jordan would have been more succinct, perhaps much more. The grammar and prose are different, but - at least in the sample of one chapter only - Brandon defintely got the spirit of Jordan's descriptions. It reads like the way RJ uses descriptions, but written by someone else.

That's my real complaint - he's not as good with it. He's trying to describe things the way RJ does, but I don't think his vocabulary is up to it. There's cases of settling for what my teachers in grade school used to call overworked words, or falling back on the word we might use in contemporary speech, but not one that Rand would use when describing something.

Which is fine. Big fans of the prose (as I am, so is Cannoli) have undeniably lost something big (and not because Brandon isn't good, but because for it's not Jordan) but it's not something we had expected to get with AMOL after RJ died.

Well, those of us stupid enough to trust Jason did.

Reading pseudo-Robert Jordan would have been terrible, anyway. After a few chapters, when the story intensifies, that should be barely noticeable. It may get more irritating on multiple re reads, once you're less captivated by the story itself - especially full ones preceeded by 11 books by RJ.

Here's hoping.

Out of "voice" here and there, but not out of character. Nothing major. Rand pays too much attention suddenly to things he hasn't in some time, that sort of things. The only line that came off really weird to me is Cadsuane using a metaphor about painting when speaking of torture. The association felt odd in her mouth. Too Questioner-like.

Agreed. Cadsuane was the biggest problem for me. Sanderson's abuse of the pronoun "one" was grating (I kept thinking of Liza Doolittle at the racetrack), and I found her addressing Nynaeve as "child" to be gratuitous and out of character. Cadsuane would simply call her "girl." Calling someone "child" is a trick of the typical Aes Sedai, whose attitude of superiority derives entirely from her status as such. Cadsuane's attitude of superiority is subtly different, but profound - it is grounded entirely on her own qualities. She has no false modesty and knows her own worth and capabilities, and measures people by her own standards. She almost never falls back on her office as a means of garnering respect. Cadsuane is not better than you because she's Aes Sedai (or a "real" Aes Sedai), she's better than you 'cause she's Cadsuane! It might be nit-picking, but that is the difference implied in the choice of words to me. And Cadsuane doesn't stride. The use of the word stride implies physical expression of emotion completely at odds with her normal deportment. She is seldom even described as moving - stillness and calmness and unextraordinary physical activity are the hallmarks of Cadsuane's appearances. Nynaeve, Egwene, Siuan, Birgitte, Elaida, Elayne, Faile, even Moiraine can stride. Cadsuane should not, or at least not unless it is intended to convey something off or unsettling or strongly affecting her. Simply entering Rand's room is not the appropriate place for such a word.

And I realize that such things are nit-picky or perhaps too subtle to make a fuss over for most people, but these are the only sorts of things that should pass muster for the editors and publishers of WoT. If anything more serious had gone through, I would be calling for heads on platters. As it is, there are a lot of subtle problems, which add up to a dissonance in the style, but I have hopes that it will go down easier over time.

But he's doing well enough. I didn't expect Brandon to be able to study everything to the most minute details, for instance study the subtleties in the progression of Rand's voice through the books to the point he can reproduce it to perfection. He would have needed not a few months but a year or more of research and analysis to get there. Between his re read and Harriet's guidance, he's done more than well enough as it is. So Rand is not exactly as distanced as he felt from his entourage in recent books, and speaks of clothes like Elayne or Mat would do. Big deal. The plot points, the core psychology of the character are all there. That was essential, and it's there.

More or less. I don't have specifics, but I got the impression he whined more, and articulated thoughts that belonged in the background descriptions.

Totally Adam. The irony is that quite a few of those who have made those accusations don't even know their Jordan well enough to know what they're talking about (eg: saying it reads like FF because Cadsuane speaks of paintings and painters and it's barely in the series at all. Jeez. A simple keyword search show there are dozens and more references to art, painting, the new style in favour (oil on canvas)- there is a fledging 'renaissance' ongoing in fine arts in the series - RJ just mostly kept it to background descriptions or minor plot point (like Elaida commissioning a painting) etc. But it's there. Fan fiction, indeed.

Let's not go that far. I've come across some fairly horrible examples of such on the internet. I'm not exactly thrilled with what we've got so far, and Jason's blather didn't help, but I'd rather have what we're getting now, than something a few degrees closer next year. Sanderson was not going to hit his stride vocabulary-wise for years if ever, so the real problems I have would not be solved with more time to familiarize himself with the characters, even if I do think his expressed understanding of them to date has been distressingly shallow and superficial, resulting in the "off" portrayal of Cadsuane such as I described above. Even if he totally got all of that, I think his own writing style suggests I would still have problems with that sort of thing. I can't even be sure whether the Cadsuane issue is a problem of characterization or simply that he expresses the same concept in a different manner than I would understand it.

It could be worse. To wit:
1. Kevin J Anderson
2. Joe Torre (just because he craps up everything)
3. Sara DouglAss
4. No more WoT at all
5. George RR Martin (we wouldn't see aMoL OR DwD for about five more years at best)
Cannoli
"Sometimes unhinged, sometimes unfair, always entertaining"
- The Crownless

“Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” GK Chesteron
Deus Vult!
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Your thoughts on TGS - Chapter 1 - 05/09/2009 05:23:47 PM 6215 Views
For all of those whining about it not sounding like RJ: - 05/09/2009 05:47:07 PM 2085 Views
Agreed. If anything, it's a tribute to RJ - 05/09/2009 06:17:36 PM 1944 Views
You're forgetting one thing. - 06/09/2009 12:13:03 AM 2111 Views
And if he were to off Egwene? What would your opinion be? *NM* - 07/09/2009 05:38:36 AM 1120 Views
He dislikes Sanderson's prose. Plot content is irrelevant here. *NM* - 08/09/2009 06:44:42 PM 1118 Views
Who cares? That would have been RJs decision anyway. - 09/09/2009 06:15:16 AM 1714 Views
not impressed - 05/09/2009 06:24:02 PM 2057 Views
all recap, no meat - 14/09/2009 12:33:35 PM 1729 Views
Pretty good. - 05/09/2009 07:35:41 PM 45476 Views
Re: Pretty good. - 05/09/2009 09:13:44 PM 2057 Views
Re: Pretty good. - 06/09/2009 01:19:22 AM 2291 Views
Re: Pretty good. - 06/09/2009 08:08:38 AM 1934 Views
Re: Pretty good. - 13/09/2009 01:22:22 PM 1650 Views
I found it well-written, but rather uninteresting story-wise *NM* - 05/09/2009 08:04:15 PM 1181 Views
because there should totaly be massive plot development in the first chapter - 05/09/2009 08:29:18 PM 1824 Views
I'm tired of passive story telling. - 05/09/2009 08:57:13 PM 1797 Views
On the other hand... - 05/09/2009 08:58:21 PM 1883 Views
Re: I'm tired of passive story telling. - 05/09/2009 10:42:57 PM 1730 Views
Which escape? - 05/09/2009 11:10:01 PM 1739 Views
I'm tired of mindless readers - 06/09/2009 01:54:14 AM 1874 Views
Re: I'm tired of mindless readers - 06/09/2009 04:01:56 AM 2018 Views
Your best yet Dom! *NM* - 06/09/2009 02:04:40 PM 1055 Views
Re: I'm tired of mindless readers - 07/09/2009 04:39:36 AM 1738 Views
Re: I'm tired of mindless readers - 07/09/2009 10:42:29 PM 1720 Views
I was over critical. - 06/09/2009 04:56:48 AM 1665 Views
It's been happening since Book IV btw. - 16/09/2009 05:30:52 PM 1511 Views
A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 05/09/2009 09:34:44 PM 1996 Views
I think Lews Therin's comments to Rand were the most hugely significant part of the chapter. - 06/09/2009 01:15:05 AM 1701 Views
I don't really agree... - 06/09/2009 03:50:08 AM 1691 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 06/09/2009 02:52:47 AM 2415 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 06/09/2009 07:08:08 AM 1653 Views
Just answer one question... - 06/09/2009 07:53:12 AM 2174 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 06/09/2009 10:31:20 AM 2239 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 08/09/2009 10:19:13 PM 1709 Views
If I may make a few somewhat irrelevant interjections... - 09/09/2009 04:44:45 AM 1646 Views
Re: If I may make a few somewhat irrelevant interjections... - 14/09/2009 04:46:29 PM 1771 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 10/09/2009 06:20:56 AM 2002 Views
On Egwene... - 10/09/2009 04:33:58 PM 1702 Views
Nynaeve - 08/09/2009 05:43:43 AM 1816 Views
Re: Nynaeve - 08/09/2009 08:06:20 AM 1604 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 07/09/2009 04:41:47 AM 1783 Views
Answers, short, long and longer. - 07/09/2009 11:27:53 PM 1736 Views
I think you missed some things. (spoilers) - 16/09/2009 05:21:43 PM 1493 Views
People who still have their wotmania SNs draw mine.... - 21/09/2009 05:25:15 PM 1556 Views
Good post, but I have an alternative explanation for the saidin barrier - 28/09/2009 12:53:41 AM 1505 Views
First thought...a typo! ner vous = nervous. *NM* - 05/09/2009 09:55:28 PM 1124 Views
I loved it! - 05/09/2009 10:52:17 PM 1752 Views
I didn't like the opening sequence. - 05/09/2009 10:58:17 PM 1791 Views
Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 06/09/2009 12:02:13 AM 1738 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 06/09/2009 12:44:11 AM 1759 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 07/09/2009 09:08:21 AM 1690 Views
This is what RJ said. - 06/09/2009 12:47:26 AM 1703 Views
Re: This is what RJ said. - 06/09/2009 01:24:36 AM 1902 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 06/09/2009 05:12:25 PM 1572 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 06/09/2009 07:20:45 PM 1571 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 07/09/2009 04:05:09 AM 1591 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 07/09/2009 09:33:25 AM 1601 Views
I found it...interesting --spoilers-- - 06/09/2009 01:33:11 AM 1898 Views
Re: I found it...interesting --spoilers-- - 06/09/2009 01:42:07 AM 1758 Views
Re: I found it...interesting --spoilers-- - 06/09/2009 02:54:17 PM 1798 Views
I'm excited. (Here be spoilers) - 06/09/2009 03:29:59 AM 1687 Views
six questions and nine statements - 06/09/2009 04:47:52 AM 1742 Views
Re: Your thoughts on TGS - Chapter 1 - 06/09/2009 04:51:04 AM 1696 Views
Re: Your thoughts on TGS - Chapter 1 - 06/09/2009 07:30:53 AM 1752 Views
I liked it - 06/09/2009 07:58:09 AM 1693 Views
Some questions... - 06/09/2009 08:04:30 AM 1694 Views
Re: Some questions... - 06/09/2009 08:11:08 AM 1796 Views
Re: Some questions... - 06/09/2009 08:53:20 AM 1692 Views
Re: I liked it - 06/09/2009 09:55:41 PM 1698 Views
Theory: Rand and Egwene. What is up? - 06/09/2009 07:59:58 AM 2598 Views
Also - 06/09/2009 08:24:45 AM 1705 Views
A simpler answer - 06/09/2009 03:04:04 PM 1781 Views
Really? - 06/09/2009 03:38:59 PM 1621 Views
are we already at the location of the book cover? - 06/09/2009 11:49:06 AM 1662 Views
Re: are we already at the location of the book cover? - 06/09/2009 02:43:24 PM 1667 Views
I still think it's Aviendha - 07/09/2009 05:14:50 AM 1523 Views
Omniscient narrator not neutral enough, for one... - 06/09/2009 04:17:51 PM 1860 Views
Yip - 06/09/2009 04:29:40 PM 1783 Views
Yes... - 06/09/2009 04:39:00 PM 1647 Views
I totally agree...the narration was the biggest put-off for me - 09/09/2009 09:51:52 PM 1510 Views
Two Things - 07/09/2009 12:25:31 AM 1707 Views
Moiraine - 07/09/2009 01:19:08 AM 1793 Views
The Moiraine thing is dumb - 09/09/2009 09:53:51 PM 1671 Views
She fell through the doorway with Lanfear - 09/09/2009 10:18:55 PM 1609 Views
uh - 09/09/2009 10:57:17 PM 1640 Views
Timeline? - 07/09/2009 05:10:16 AM 1689 Views
Re: Timeline? - 07/09/2009 05:52:50 PM 1640 Views
So what chapter symbol is it going to have? *NM* - 07/09/2009 08:09:54 AM 977 Views
the dragon in COT chap 23 ornaments *NM* - 07/09/2009 01:28:58 PM 969 Views
The Seanchan are up to something - 07/09/2009 10:26:23 AM 1678 Views
Red stone doorway. - 07/09/2009 03:27:22 PM 1552 Views
The whole thing was explained by Rand in KoD. So no, not new. - 07/09/2009 06:35:01 PM 1561 Views
No - 07/09/2009 07:57:57 PM 1554 Views
Questions, Comments Thoughts and Theories about tGS - 07/09/2009 09:09:05 PM 1747 Views
My thoughts are that the main page is being crowded by too many duplicate threads - 07/09/2009 10:23:41 PM 1689 Views
Hrm... - 08/09/2009 05:28:19 AM 1753 Views
Enjoyed it - 08/09/2009 01:35:03 AM 1664 Views
Ready for More - 08/09/2009 04:25:19 PM 1691 Views
... - 08/09/2009 07:24:46 PM 1610 Views
Not sure what I expected, but not this... - 09/09/2009 04:07:10 PM 1702 Views
I know why Rand is mad at Egwene...read inside to find out - 11/09/2009 03:15:00 AM 1747 Views
It's his increasing paranoia and dehumanization. - 15/09/2009 03:03:53 AM 1654 Views
Re: Your thoughts on TGS - Chapter 1 - 16/09/2009 06:20:14 AM 1444 Views
Semirhage isn't scaring anyone - 28/09/2009 02:32:34 PM 1966 Views
Indeed... - 28/09/2009 03:36:55 PM 1566 Views
Will the Chosen pass that edict down or just not act themselves? - 28/09/2009 10:29:53 PM 1545 Views

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