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Re: I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking Datakim Send a noteboard - 26/05/2010 09:49:24 PM

If it didn't Moghedien would have found a Black Sister and gotten herself free... or would have pulled Nynaeve or Elayne into TAR at some point and gotten revenge ... too many options for her if it didn't stop her.

But it seems likely that death or madness akin to Machin Chin eating your soul would be the outcome if you left TAR in Spirit form.


This seems likely.

I wonder if this might also explain the other bizarre thing with the whole Moghedien episode that I have often wondered about. When Nynaeve imagined the a'dam collar around Moghediens neck while they were both in TAR, why is it that Moghedien did not just imagine the a'dam into nothingness? I mean we know that is possible, we have seen people change their clothes or imagine things such as bushes or other items into vanishing.

Why did Moghedien who is supposedly such a master of TAR not just get rid of the collar with her mind. For that matter, why did she not just choose to wake up in the real world and free herself from the collar that way. We know that dreamers can wake up at-will.

This would all be explained if the a'dam has some inbuilt block that neutralises all dream-abilities. Once Nynaeve imagined the thing around Moghedien's neck, Moghedien was no longer able to influence TAR in any way, or leave TAR willingly. Maybe dreamers were a lot more common in Seanchan and something like this was required to prevent the damane from forcibly pulling the sul'dam to TAR and killing her in her dreams or something.
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Help me out with a TAR problem Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:10:07 PM 1596 Views
Re: Help me out with a TAR problem Datakim - 26/05/2010 08:28:34 PM 993 Views
No I don't mean that Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:37:27 PM 1023 Views
Re: No I don't mean that darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 08:39:42 PM 875 Views
Re: No I don't mean that Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:52:22 PM 806 Views
I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 09:26:20 PM 728 Views
Re: I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking Datakim - 26/05/2010 09:49:24 PM 735 Views
And it seems the woman wearing the bracelet has strange dreams too darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 10:54:26 PM 834 Views
Re: I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 06:46:42 PM 716 Views
I think it would be the latter RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 07:11:17 PM 828 Views
I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/05/2010 11:39:14 PM 761 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. Datakim - 26/05/2010 11:50:56 PM 726 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 12:06:55 AM 734 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. Datakim - 27/05/2010 12:21:53 AM 813 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 02:58:36 PM 787 Views
I disagree darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 03:21:05 PM 767 Views
Re: I disagree RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 07:08:41 PM 802 Views
If she could enter TAR she could drag an AS in with her, compell them and make them take it off darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 07:14:26 PM 842 Views
Re: If she could enter TAR she could drag an AS in with her, compell them and make them take it off RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 09:21:11 PM 937 Views
I think we are saying pretty much the same thing here darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 09:24:37 PM 788 Views
We are close to the same idea, but different in where we think her ability will stop. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 09:37:28 PM 766 Views
*nods* *NM* darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 11:29:10 PM 360 Views
But channelling is not a requirement to enter TAR BlackAdder - 27/05/2010 08:31:21 AM 704 Views
The a'dam affects things in Channelers other than the ability itself darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 01:58:34 PM 899 Views
I don't agree. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 03:02:08 PM 764 Views
you are misreading me I think darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 03:11:50 PM 902 Views
Re: you are misreading me I think RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 06:30:29 PM 831 Views
Re: you are misreading me I think HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 06:42:36 PM 807 Views
That's the point. darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 06:57:35 PM 783 Views
Re: That's the point. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 07:10:25 PM 760 Views
Re: That's the point. darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 07:16:49 PM 740 Views
We may never know! RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 09:21:48 PM 791 Views
I would be very surprised if it came up in the books darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 09:25:29 PM 741 Views
Interesting idea. Datakim - 26/05/2010 09:38:04 PM 724 Views
Fascinating Idea #4 on this thread. Thanks, Sid! *NM* newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 10:31:48 PM 370 Views
Channeler heal thyself Datakim - 26/05/2010 11:40:25 PM 858 Views
There may be a clue to this in the descriptions of astral projection in comics and psychic studies RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/05/2010 11:59:42 PM 769 Views
Re: Help me out with a TAR problem cmoorejr - 26/05/2010 08:35:49 PM 757 Views
Doesn't work entyti - 26/05/2010 08:37:40 PM 962 Views
we've seen this fail darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 08:38:06 PM 710 Views
I don't mean that Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:39:32 PM 707 Views
I'd say you either die or just wake up if you tried that darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 08:40:31 PM 722 Views
As far as I know... Etzel - 26/05/2010 08:38:36 PM 762 Views
This could work DomA - 26/05/2010 08:43:21 PM 928 Views
Thanks Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:51:17 PM 755 Views
Re: Thanks DomA - 26/05/2010 09:12:10 PM 719 Views
So I think this disproves it newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 08:49:55 PM 1003 Views
Is that really true? Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:53:45 PM 780 Views
Sid, I made some edits, but really nothing's certain. Look again, pls. *NM* newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 08:55:30 PM 379 Views
I would generally agree with your edits Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:57:32 PM 746 Views
yes and no darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 09:31:53 PM 654 Views
Re: yes and no Datakim - 26/05/2010 09:55:46 PM 701 Views
5+ entries for "Book 4-6 Thing " now... Funny that we wrote slight variations simultaneously newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 10:24:03 PM 702 Views
well Moghedien somehow managed to create a whole Body for Birgitte darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 10:36:45 PM 767 Views
Could Rahvin turn Rand into a fishman if he was just there in Spirit? newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 10:19:05 PM 731 Views
And I agree with your response newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 09:49:00 PM 730 Views
You have to enter TAR in the Flesh to leave it in the Flesh. krassos - 26/05/2010 10:06:02 PM 828 Views
Re: You have to enter TAR in the Flesh to leave it in the Flesh. darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 10:57:06 PM 701 Views
The short answer to Birgitte krassos - 27/05/2010 02:37:13 AM 712 Views
I think this is possible. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/05/2010 11:28:51 PM 765 Views
Dream gateway! Datakim - 27/05/2010 12:05:31 AM 718 Views
I think the problem is that you can only channel Spirit through your T'A'R form RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 03:05:13 PM 682 Views
if you dream yourself into T'A'R then you're just a creation of your own mind Jim - 27/05/2010 12:02:38 AM 657 Views
aren't we all? *NM* newyorkersedai - 27/05/2010 12:04:08 AM 323 Views
if that was true you couldn't die in T'A'R Foxhead - 27/05/2010 12:08:10 AM 677 Views
Why not? krassos - 27/05/2010 03:41:10 PM 847 Views
if it's just a creation of your mind? Foxhead - 27/05/2010 04:03:29 PM 791 Views
is it possible to Travel in T'A'R when dreaming? Foxhead - 27/05/2010 12:06:57 AM 713 Views
I don't think anybody has said this before... Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 04:01:28 AM 788 Views
Your real body can only channel Spirit. Gher - 27/05/2010 05:25:08 AM 805 Views
Yes, but you need real One Power to affect the real world. Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 06:46:21 AM 766 Views
Yes, I agree with that, but I was mostly just replying to your question about sleep-channeling. Gher - 27/05/2010 06:56:18 AM 700 Views
The only real situation we have to compare... Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 06:59:51 AM 697 Views
That's a weird situation. Gher - 27/05/2010 07:09:21 AM 742 Views
Well, yes. The Birgitte situation can't be compared directly to Sidious' Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 08:01:38 AM 768 Views
Re: The only real situation we have to compare... HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 07:11:45 PM 789 Views
If something that didn't exist before existed after... Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 08:58:55 PM 730 Views
Re: If something that didn't exist before existed after... HyogaRott - 28/05/2010 02:09:01 PM 812 Views
Actually I don't think so.. darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 02:31:27 PM 696 Views
Plus, their ability to affect reality comes from the magic of the Horn of Valere. Fanatic-Templar - 28/05/2010 06:14:21 PM 651 Views
your dream self couldn't exit TAR... Onarishma - 27/05/2010 06:39:26 AM 767 Views
TAR constructs cannot leave it. fionwe1987 - 27/05/2010 04:57:12 PM 919 Views
Not just constructs ... anything reflected in TAR cannot leave it ... Shishka - 27/05/2010 10:05:37 PM 848 Views
Re: Help me out with a TAR problem HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 06:58:18 PM 702 Views
shucks everyone already thought of this... *NM* HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 07:08:50 PM 329 Views
problem solved... sort of? lummox - 28/05/2010 02:48:13 AM 840 Views
I agree with those saying that if you don't physically enter TAR... TaskmasterJack - 29/05/2010 09:32:40 PM 749 Views
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