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Re: I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking Datakim Send a noteboard - 26/05/2010 09:49:24 PM

If it didn't Moghedien would have found a Black Sister and gotten herself free... or would have pulled Nynaeve or Elayne into TAR at some point and gotten revenge ... too many options for her if it didn't stop her.

But it seems likely that death or madness akin to Machin Chin eating your soul would be the outcome if you left TAR in Spirit form.


This seems likely.

I wonder if this might also explain the other bizarre thing with the whole Moghedien episode that I have often wondered about. When Nynaeve imagined the a'dam collar around Moghediens neck while they were both in TAR, why is it that Moghedien did not just imagine the a'dam into nothingness? I mean we know that is possible, we have seen people change their clothes or imagine things such as bushes or other items into vanishing.

Why did Moghedien who is supposedly such a master of TAR not just get rid of the collar with her mind. For that matter, why did she not just choose to wake up in the real world and free herself from the collar that way. We know that dreamers can wake up at-will.

This would all be explained if the a'dam has some inbuilt block that neutralises all dream-abilities. Once Nynaeve imagined the thing around Moghedien's neck, Moghedien was no longer able to influence TAR in any way, or leave TAR willingly. Maybe dreamers were a lot more common in Seanchan and something like this was required to prevent the damane from forcibly pulling the sul'dam to TAR and killing her in her dreams or something.
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Help me out with a TAR problem Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:10:07 PM 1529 Views
Re: Help me out with a TAR problem Datakim - 26/05/2010 08:28:34 PM 943 Views
No I don't mean that Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:37:27 PM 967 Views
Re: No I don't mean that darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 08:39:42 PM 831 Views
Re: No I don't mean that Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:52:22 PM 745 Views
I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 09:26:20 PM 687 Views
Re: I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking Datakim - 26/05/2010 09:49:24 PM 681 Views
And it seems the woman wearing the bracelet has strange dreams too darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 10:54:26 PM 770 Views
Re: I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 06:46:42 PM 667 Views
I think it would be the latter RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 07:11:17 PM 773 Views
I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/05/2010 11:39:14 PM 701 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. Datakim - 26/05/2010 11:50:56 PM 656 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 12:06:55 AM 678 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. Datakim - 27/05/2010 12:21:53 AM 739 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 02:58:36 PM 736 Views
I disagree darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 03:21:05 PM 698 Views
Re: I disagree RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 07:08:41 PM 744 Views
If she could enter TAR she could drag an AS in with her, compell them and make them take it off darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 07:14:26 PM 789 Views
Re: If she could enter TAR she could drag an AS in with her, compell them and make them take it off RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 09:21:11 PM 885 Views
I think we are saying pretty much the same thing here darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 09:24:37 PM 717 Views
We are close to the same idea, but different in where we think her ability will stop. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 09:37:28 PM 719 Views
*nods* *NM* darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 11:29:10 PM 327 Views
But channelling is not a requirement to enter TAR BlackAdder - 27/05/2010 08:31:21 AM 660 Views
The a'dam affects things in Channelers other than the ability itself darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 01:58:34 PM 849 Views
I don't agree. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 03:02:08 PM 711 Views
you are misreading me I think darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 03:11:50 PM 856 Views
Re: you are misreading me I think RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 06:30:29 PM 759 Views
Re: you are misreading me I think HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 06:42:36 PM 763 Views
That's the point. darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 06:57:35 PM 739 Views
Re: That's the point. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 07:10:25 PM 706 Views
Re: That's the point. darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 07:16:49 PM 702 Views
We may never know! RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 09:21:48 PM 741 Views
I would be very surprised if it came up in the books darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 09:25:29 PM 703 Views
Interesting idea. Datakim - 26/05/2010 09:38:04 PM 670 Views
Fascinating Idea #4 on this thread. Thanks, Sid! *NM* newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 10:31:48 PM 343 Views
Channeler heal thyself Datakim - 26/05/2010 11:40:25 PM 795 Views
There may be a clue to this in the descriptions of astral projection in comics and psychic studies RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/05/2010 11:59:42 PM 719 Views
Re: Help me out with a TAR problem cmoorejr - 26/05/2010 08:35:49 PM 701 Views
Doesn't work entyti - 26/05/2010 08:37:40 PM 913 Views
we've seen this fail darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 08:38:06 PM 662 Views
I don't mean that Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:39:32 PM 651 Views
I'd say you either die or just wake up if you tried that darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 08:40:31 PM 667 Views
As far as I know... Etzel - 26/05/2010 08:38:36 PM 699 Views
This could work DomA - 26/05/2010 08:43:21 PM 879 Views
Thanks Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:51:17 PM 708 Views
Re: Thanks DomA - 26/05/2010 09:12:10 PM 669 Views
So I think this disproves it newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 08:49:55 PM 949 Views
Is that really true? Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:53:45 PM 732 Views
Sid, I made some edits, but really nothing's certain. Look again, pls. *NM* newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 08:55:30 PM 355 Views
I would generally agree with your edits Sidious - 26/05/2010 08:57:32 PM 690 Views
yes and no darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 09:31:53 PM 609 Views
Re: yes and no Datakim - 26/05/2010 09:55:46 PM 654 Views
5+ entries for "Book 4-6 Thing " now... Funny that we wrote slight variations simultaneously newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 10:24:03 PM 651 Views
well Moghedien somehow managed to create a whole Body for Birgitte darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 10:36:45 PM 716 Views
Could Rahvin turn Rand into a fishman if he was just there in Spirit? newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 10:19:05 PM 678 Views
And I agree with your response newyorkersedai - 26/05/2010 09:49:00 PM 673 Views
You have to enter TAR in the Flesh to leave it in the Flesh. krassos - 26/05/2010 10:06:02 PM 766 Views
Re: You have to enter TAR in the Flesh to leave it in the Flesh. darius_sedai - 26/05/2010 10:57:06 PM 656 Views
The short answer to Birgitte krassos - 27/05/2010 02:37:13 AM 661 Views
I think this is possible. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 26/05/2010 11:28:51 PM 717 Views
Dream gateway! Datakim - 27/05/2010 12:05:31 AM 662 Views
I think the problem is that you can only channel Spirit through your T'A'R form RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 03:05:13 PM 631 Views
if you dream yourself into T'A'R then you're just a creation of your own mind Jim - 27/05/2010 12:02:38 AM 606 Views
aren't we all? *NM* newyorkersedai - 27/05/2010 12:04:08 AM 294 Views
if that was true you couldn't die in T'A'R Foxhead - 27/05/2010 12:08:10 AM 632 Views
Why not? krassos - 27/05/2010 03:41:10 PM 778 Views
if it's just a creation of your mind? Foxhead - 27/05/2010 04:03:29 PM 727 Views
is it possible to Travel in T'A'R when dreaming? Foxhead - 27/05/2010 12:06:57 AM 653 Views
I don't think anybody has said this before... Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 04:01:28 AM 738 Views
Your real body can only channel Spirit. Gher - 27/05/2010 05:25:08 AM 754 Views
Yes, but you need real One Power to affect the real world. Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 06:46:21 AM 723 Views
Yes, I agree with that, but I was mostly just replying to your question about sleep-channeling. Gher - 27/05/2010 06:56:18 AM 643 Views
The only real situation we have to compare... Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 06:59:51 AM 643 Views
That's a weird situation. Gher - 27/05/2010 07:09:21 AM 705 Views
Well, yes. The Birgitte situation can't be compared directly to Sidious' Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 08:01:38 AM 714 Views
Re: The only real situation we have to compare... HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 07:11:45 PM 741 Views
If something that didn't exist before existed after... Fanatic-Templar - 27/05/2010 08:58:55 PM 678 Views
Re: If something that didn't exist before existed after... HyogaRott - 28/05/2010 02:09:01 PM 764 Views
Actually I don't think so.. darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 02:31:27 PM 643 Views
Plus, their ability to affect reality comes from the magic of the Horn of Valere. Fanatic-Templar - 28/05/2010 06:14:21 PM 582 Views
your dream self couldn't exit TAR... Onarishma - 27/05/2010 06:39:26 AM 703 Views
TAR constructs cannot leave it. fionwe1987 - 27/05/2010 04:57:12 PM 868 Views
Not just constructs ... anything reflected in TAR cannot leave it ... Shishka - 27/05/2010 10:05:37 PM 795 Views
Re: Help me out with a TAR problem HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 06:58:18 PM 644 Views
shucks everyone already thought of this... *NM* HyogaRott - 27/05/2010 07:08:50 PM 308 Views
problem solved... sort of? lummox - 28/05/2010 02:48:13 AM 778 Views
I agree with those saying that if you don't physically enter TAR... TaskmasterJack - 29/05/2010 09:32:40 PM 704 Views
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