If she could enter TAR she could drag an AS in with her, compell them and make them take it off
darius_sedai Send a noteboard - 27/05/2010 07:14:26 PM
But she let Chesmal heal her and only Liandrin (who she expected) tried to betray her. It wouldn't be particularly difficult for her to find a BA Sister to free her. If she could enter TAR she could snag them from their dreams and kill them if they disobeyed her or tried to make her a prisoner. Once she was free she'd likely kill them anyway. We also know Compulsion in TAR is actually stronger than in the waking world, so all she'd need do is set a Compulsion on a Sister and she's free as a bird with no one the wiser.
The issue is simple: how could she maintain obedience when she will be showing weakness in front of her minions not once but twice. Furthermore, if any of the Black Ajah saw that collar (keeping in mind that many of them actually know what an a'dam does and may be able to recognize it), they would realize that she is entirely under their control. This is an organization full of evil people - trust is not something that they practice that often, and we know from the way the a'dam works, that you may very well be unable to draw upon the will necessary to destroy the one who holds your leash. Perhaps this weakened will would be enough to guarantee your destruction should you be trapped in a nightmare or their particular dream. From all descriptions we have received, being leashed is a draining experience and not something that keeps your willpower and sense of self (extremely important factors when manipulating T'A'R) intact.
This would take a few minutes of fumbling at most! Any number of characters have figured it out pretty quickly so I don't think it would be too tough for an AS to manage. If she has a woman from the camp handy it wouldn't take much time and no one would even notice. Worse case she has the woman Travel away with her until they can get it off.
Yet Egwene was completely unable to even initiate the attempt, nor could the Aes Sedai or Windfinders, all capable women of above average intelligence, figure out a way to remove the collars.
It may seem easy to us, as the readers, but I doubt if the collar were real, any one of us could figure out how it clasped, based upon the description of it we've gotten.
I'm not saying Moghedien would be able to take it off, but a Compelled AS under her control would be able to figure it out in minutes.
She wouldn't need to maintain control over them ... just bring them to TAR against their will and do exactly what she told Nynaeve she was going to do to her and Elayne when Nynaeve captured her. Evil or not Sheriam (for arguments sake) would do everything Moghedien wanted her to do without even knowing why.
Domani Drag Queen in the White Tower ... Aran'gar watch out!
Help me out with a TAR problem
- 26/05/2010 08:10:07 PM
1640 Views
Re: Help me out with a TAR problem
- 26/05/2010 08:28:34 PM
1025 Views
No I don't mean that
- 26/05/2010 08:37:27 PM
1054 Views
Re: No I don't mean that
- 26/05/2010 08:39:42 PM
912 Views
Re: No I don't mean that
- 26/05/2010 08:52:22 PM
843 Views
I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking
- 26/05/2010 09:26:20 PM
759 Views
Re: I'm inclined to think the a'dam stops Dream Walking
- 26/05/2010 09:49:24 PM
769 Views
And it seems the woman wearing the bracelet has strange dreams too
- 26/05/2010 10:54:26 PM
875 Views
I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that.
- 26/05/2010 11:39:14 PM
794 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that.
- 26/05/2010 11:50:56 PM
772 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that.
- 27/05/2010 12:06:55 AM
767 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that.
- 27/05/2010 12:21:53 AM
841 Views
Re: I have a few mundane my reasons as to why Moghedien probably wouldn't and couldn't do that.
- 27/05/2010 02:58:36 PM
825 Views
I disagree
- 27/05/2010 03:21:05 PM
804 Views
Re: I disagree
- 27/05/2010 07:08:41 PM
843 Views
If she could enter TAR she could drag an AS in with her, compell them and make them take it off
- 27/05/2010 07:14:26 PM
870 Views
Re: If she could enter TAR she could drag an AS in with her, compell them and make them take it off
- 27/05/2010 09:21:11 PM
971 Views
I think we are saying pretty much the same thing here
- 27/05/2010 09:24:37 PM
828 Views
We are close to the same idea, but different in where we think her ability will stop.
- 27/05/2010 09:37:28 PM
796 Views
But channelling is not a requirement to enter TAR
- 27/05/2010 08:31:21 AM
736 Views
The a'dam affects things in Channelers other than the ability itself
- 27/05/2010 01:58:34 PM
933 Views
I don't agree.
- 27/05/2010 03:02:08 PM
792 Views
you are misreading me I think
- 27/05/2010 03:11:50 PM
930 Views
Re: you are misreading me I think
- 27/05/2010 06:30:29 PM
864 Views
That's the point.
- 27/05/2010 06:57:35 PM
820 Views
Re: That's the point.
- 27/05/2010 07:10:25 PM
788 Views
Re: That's the point.
- 27/05/2010 07:16:49 PM
770 Views
Interesting idea.
- 26/05/2010 09:38:04 PM
758 Views
There may be a clue to this in the descriptions of astral projection in comics and psychic studies
- 26/05/2010 11:59:42 PM
799 Views
we've seen this fail
- 26/05/2010 08:38:06 PM
742 Views
So I think this disproves it
- 26/05/2010 08:49:55 PM
1030 Views
Is that really true?
- 26/05/2010 08:53:45 PM
808 Views
Sid, I made some edits, but really nothing's certain. Look again, pls. *NM*
- 26/05/2010 08:55:30 PM
392 Views
I would generally agree with your edits
- 26/05/2010 08:57:32 PM
776 Views
yes and no
- 26/05/2010 09:31:53 PM
684 Views
Re: yes and no
- 26/05/2010 09:55:46 PM
732 Views
5+ entries for "Book 4-6 Thing " now... Funny that we wrote slight variations simultaneously
- 26/05/2010 10:24:03 PM
743 Views
well Moghedien somehow managed to create a whole Body for Birgitte
- 26/05/2010 10:36:45 PM
810 Views
Could Rahvin turn Rand into a fishman if he was just there in Spirit?
- 26/05/2010 10:19:05 PM
764 Views
You have to enter TAR in the Flesh to leave it in the Flesh.
- 26/05/2010 10:06:02 PM
863 Views
I think this is possible.
- 26/05/2010 11:28:51 PM
801 Views
Dream gateway!
- 27/05/2010 12:05:31 AM
753 Views
I think the problem is that you can only channel Spirit through your T'A'R form
- 27/05/2010 03:05:13 PM
719 Views
if you dream yourself into T'A'R then you're just a creation of your own mind
- 27/05/2010 12:02:38 AM
689 Views
if that was true you couldn't die in T'A'R
- 27/05/2010 12:08:10 AM
718 Views
I don't think anybody has said this before...
- 27/05/2010 04:01:28 AM
823 Views
Your real body can only channel Spirit.
- 27/05/2010 05:25:08 AM
836 Views
Yes, but you need real One Power to affect the real world.
- 27/05/2010 06:46:21 AM
795 Views
Yes, I agree with that, but I was mostly just replying to your question about sleep-channeling.
- 27/05/2010 06:56:18 AM
723 Views
The only real situation we have to compare...
- 27/05/2010 06:59:51 AM
730 Views
That's a weird situation.
- 27/05/2010 07:09:21 AM
781 Views
Well, yes. The Birgitte situation can't be compared directly to Sidious'
- 27/05/2010 08:01:38 AM
808 Views
Re: The only real situation we have to compare...
- 27/05/2010 07:11:45 PM
823 Views
If something that didn't exist before existed after...
- 27/05/2010 08:58:55 PM
760 Views
Re: If something that didn't exist before existed after...
- 28/05/2010 02:09:01 PM
846 Views
Actually I don't think so..
- 28/05/2010 02:31:27 PM
723 Views
Plus, their ability to affect reality comes from the magic of the Horn of Valere.
- 28/05/2010 06:14:21 PM
682 Views
TAR constructs cannot leave it.
- 27/05/2010 04:57:12 PM
942 Views
Not just constructs ... anything reflected in TAR cannot leave it ...
- 27/05/2010 10:05:37 PM
882 Views
I agree with those saying that if you don't physically enter TAR...
- 29/05/2010 09:32:40 PM
783 Views


