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Re: actually self-sacrifice is one of the Dragon's principle virtues Fanatic-Templar Send a noteboard - 10/03/2012 06:40:00 PM
Well I'm not sure if I totally agree. I think that the Shadow has often been seen to screw its self. I can't think of anything more satisfying than Rand preventing another taint on the One Power using the Dark One's own magic against him. I'm not saying it will happen, but thematically I don't see a problem. I'm not saying that Rand must be evil, but it could be similar to Verin infiltrating the BA to destroy them. Sometimes the Light gets to be smug too..


It's the entire point of Shadar Logoth and Padan Fain. It's also the reason why Dark Rand was wrong, despite the fact that people on this board were advocating things like "the risk of annihilating the entire universe is a price you just have to pay if you want to destroy one of Shai'tan's pawns", or "Rand is the saviour of the world, and everyone who refuses to serve him deserves to be destroyed". This isn't "the Shadow screwing itself", it's fighting pure evil with pure evil. And I'm not sure what to say if you think that this series will conclude with pure evil granting victory over Shai'tan.

I don't agree. The text says that he suddenly becomes so black that he even soaks up the light of Callandor. Until then, the text clearly stated that he had no chance against Rand with the sa'angreal. It's a sign that he has suddenly gained equal footing, and its reflected in his triumphant look.


Yes, because he started using the True Power.

I agree with you that he was dreamwalking until then. Well, mostly. I think his initial attacks of balefire were channeled, but after that he travelled and most likely went to TAR where Rand chased after him. I think you probably could do all of those things with the OP if you had the aptitudes, but Ishamael is strong in TAR, its logical he'd go there if being chased by a strong channeler.

Apart from that, I'm not sure if you're contending that Ishamael used saidin mostly and had to beg for TP use? I find that completely unlikely. I think his appearance is more than evidence enough that he is an exclusive TP user and has been since the War of Power.

I guess he asked the DO to aid him directly. That's sort of like having your patron god come down and defend you.


I know that's what you're asserting, but do you have anything to support that claim?
The first rule of being a ninja is "do no harm". Unless you intend to do harm, then do lots of harm.
~Master Splinter

Victorious in Bergioyn's legendary 'Reverse Mafia'. *MySmiley*
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What's so special about Callandor? - 06/03/2012 07:31:40 PM 2230 Views
Honestly, I'm more curious about the "Dragon-only" barrier that surrounded it - 06/03/2012 09:16:15 PM 1178 Views
I also think the flaw might be deliberate - 06/03/2012 09:56:02 PM 1247 Views
Re: I also think the flaw might be deliberate - 07/03/2012 04:11:21 AM 1295 Views
Re: I also think the flaw might be deliberate - 07/03/2012 10:31:39 AM 1137 Views
Re: I also think the flaw might be deliberate - 07/03/2012 10:55:56 PM 1164 Views
RJ addressed this ... I had a similar thought several years back and this quote was floated my way - 07/03/2012 04:18:01 AM 1178 Views
Hmm.... - 07/03/2012 01:50:07 PM 1118 Views
Very similar to what you are getting at as I recall - 07/03/2012 02:00:56 PM 1010 Views
Using the True Power to win Tarmon Gai'don goes against every moral in the series. - 07/03/2012 07:00:02 AM 1045 Views
actually self-sacrifice is one of the Dragon's principle virtues - 07/03/2012 10:36:03 AM 937 Views
Re: actually self-sacrifice is one of the Dragon's principle virtues - 07/03/2012 06:02:48 PM 1033 Views
Re: actually self-sacrifice is one of the Dragon's principle virtues - 07/03/2012 06:18:16 PM 966 Views
If anything the Dark One WANTS Lews Therin to use the TP *NM* - 07/03/2012 09:43:20 PM 617 Views
Re: actually self-sacrifice is one of the Dragon's principle virtues - 07/03/2012 11:38:56 PM 1154 Views
Re: actually self-sacrifice is one of the Dragon's principle virtues - 10/03/2012 11:52:23 AM 1151 Views
Re: actually self-sacrifice is one of the Dragon's principle virtues - 10/03/2012 06:40:00 PM 1019 Views
Have to agree with you on this - 12/03/2012 01:17:06 AM 1007 Views
Re: Have to agree with you on this - 12/03/2012 02:36:13 PM 983 Views
Fain has become so much more than human. We have no real sense of the limits of his power - 18/03/2012 11:21:54 PM 895 Views
Shai'tan is the opposite half of the Creator. - 19/03/2012 01:44:31 AM 869 Views
I actually don't see it that way - 19/03/2012 03:37:26 AM 1037 Views
depends how you look at it - 19/03/2012 10:41:28 AM 1079 Views
Re: depends how you look at it - 19/03/2012 01:07:21 PM 817 Views
Re: depends how you look at it - 19/03/2012 08:12:17 PM 947 Views
Odds are you are correct - 19/03/2012 11:45:03 PM 812 Views
Re: depends how you look at it - 20/03/2012 12:51:48 PM 783 Views
The DO did not not destroy Mashadar alone - 19/03/2012 11:42:21 PM 845 Views
That's not correct. - 20/03/2012 01:55:05 AM 846 Views
Saidin and the True Power both touched Mashadar - 20/03/2012 01:11:17 PM 1117 Views
Re: Saidin and the True Power both touched Mashadar - 20/03/2012 04:27:33 PM 767 Views
Re: Saidin and the True Power both touched Mashadar - 20/03/2012 04:57:08 PM 1121 Views
You explantion is - 20/03/2012 06:17:52 PM 878 Views
Agreed *NM* - 19/03/2012 11:40:40 PM 450 Views
RJ Quote: - 19/03/2012 06:52:12 PM 834 Views
Exactly - 19/03/2012 08:54:22 PM 1143 Views
Personally I view it more as Creation v. Destruction - 19/03/2012 11:48:20 PM 813 Views
Re: Personally I view it more as Creation v. Destruction - 20/03/2012 01:06:20 PM 849 Views
My point with imagination is simply that destruction only does 1 thing - 20/03/2012 01:14:55 PM 998 Views
Re: Personally I view it more as Creation v. Destruction - 20/03/2012 04:35:17 PM 833 Views
Re: Personally I view it more as Creation v. Destruction - 20/03/2012 04:59:13 PM 822 Views
Re: Personally I view it more as Creation v. Destruction - 20/03/2012 08:57:35 PM 934 Views
Re: Personally I view it more as Creation v. Destruction - 21/03/2012 01:09:13 PM 876 Views
Yep . - 21/03/2012 04:51:15 PM 836 Views
Re: actually self-sacrifice is one of the Dragon's principle virtues - 14/03/2012 12:15:36 PM 964 Views
except the TP is not just a tool. - 14/03/2012 01:41:17 PM 1030 Views
No, the Choedan Kal was a tool. - 14/03/2012 05:20:53 PM 766 Views
Sounds like the One Ring - 04/05/2012 03:55:01 PM 972 Views
I totally agree with you on both issues Ben - 07/03/2012 11:44:42 PM 1094 Views
No, I don't agree - 10/03/2012 12:11:37 PM 1045 Views
That makes no sense... - 10/03/2012 09:21:19 PM 888 Views
Re: That makes no sense... - 11/03/2012 12:25:53 AM 898 Views
Name an existing well that has that much power, though. - 11/03/2012 01:11:40 AM 855 Views
He makes a good point though. - 11/03/2012 05:49:59 AM 882 Views
Yes, but... - 11/03/2012 06:17:25 AM 826 Views
Re: Yes, but... - 11/03/2012 06:47:43 PM 862 Views
I found a couple of quote - 12/03/2012 12:00:36 AM 1043 Views
Yeah, I looked through Terez' quote database. - 12/03/2012 12:46:38 AM 864 Views
Re: That makes no sense... - 11/03/2012 08:54:11 AM 1007 Views
Re: That makes no sense... - 12/03/2012 02:15:19 PM 1072 Views
Re: No, I don't agree - 12/03/2012 01:49:10 PM 1058 Views
How the Three can become One using the True Power...mindtraps of Moggy and Cyndane... - 12/03/2012 06:04:22 PM 945 Views
Whether it happens or not, it might explain the choice of mind trap victims - 13/03/2012 06:43:45 AM 1110 Views
Re: Whether it happens or not, it might explain the choice of mind trap victims - 13/03/2012 05:19:21 PM 869 Views
That's what I meant - 18/03/2012 11:13:19 PM 970 Views

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