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As it is often the case... Etzel Send a noteboard - 16/01/2010 09:30:56 AM
There are basically two views concerning, which certainly both have their problems, and everyone has to decide what seems more likely to him.

You apparently believe that there is more going on, namely that Graendal was in the house (either by coincidence or by SH's orders), Delved Elza but didn't remove the Compulsion for some reason, taught Elza the important weaves to open the box, but didn't fetch the DM herself, and left the house again. It seems that there is nothing to support your view, except for your opinion that only a channeler could give Elza the knowledge about the weaves.

On the other hand, I believe that there really was only SH and Elza, as it seems to be in the book. Also all of BS's quotes about this scene only mention SH and Elza, e.g. that Elza was essential for SH, which doesn't really fit with the idea that Graendal was there as well. We know that SH and the DO can give DF gifts and change them. It doesn't seem that far-fetched to me that he could also give certain knowledge, but couldn't remove the Compulsion, which is mentioned as being quite difficult, especially because we don't know the amount of SH's powers.

However, we can't be sure, though I would say it's your job to provide evidence that Graendal was there, since this theory differs from what we see in the book.

Would be a nice question for BS, if there was another Forsaken involved (and as others said, Cyndane, Moghedien and even Mesaana are basically as likely as Graendal then). If he answers "RAFO", there might be something to your idea.
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Elza's Compulsion - 14/01/2010 08:41:04 PM 2086 Views
I think Graendal was involved on some level in this part of the story - 14/01/2010 09:12:05 PM 1006 Views
I disagree - 14/01/2010 09:27:27 PM 886 Views
except work with Semirhage! - 14/01/2010 09:34:37 PM 810 Views
Well... - 14/01/2010 09:43:40 PM 938 Views
SH can't channel thus can't teach Elza anything *NM* - 14/01/2010 10:20:19 PM 322 Views
Yeah, but according to BS, he apparently could "give her the knowledge". *shrug* *NM* - 15/01/2010 07:16:22 AM 288 Views
that's your interpretation of the quote - 15/01/2010 05:58:30 PM 694 Views
This and the others quotes suggest that only SH and Elza were involved *NM* - 16/01/2010 09:51:24 AM 265 Views
As I said that's certainly one of of interpreting the quotes - 16/01/2010 03:46:55 PM 640 Views
The question is... - 16/01/2010 03:59:24 PM 650 Views
Re: The question is... - 16/01/2010 04:02:55 PM 643 Views
Yeah, as I said elsewhere, would be a nice question for BS, if there was another Forsaken. *NM* - 16/01/2010 04:08:05 PM 717 Views
I bet you anything he'd giva a big fat RAFO to that - 16/01/2010 04:08:58 PM 640 Views
BS spoke quite openly about this scene, though - 16/01/2010 04:16:09 PM 689 Views
always worth a try, but wasn't he asked to be less open recently? - 16/01/2010 04:31:54 PM 640 Views
Shaidar Haran can't channel. - 14/01/2010 09:34:51 PM 1020 Views
I know... - 14/01/2010 09:45:15 PM 870 Views
I agree with you, for a related but slightly different reason ... - 14/01/2010 09:58:28 PM 961 Views
That doesn't prove anything... - 14/01/2010 10:07:46 PM 891 Views
It proves enough for me ... - 14/01/2010 10:26:28 PM 805 Views
Re: That doesn't prove anything... - 15/01/2010 11:03:05 AM 611 Views
not really - 15/01/2010 05:29:25 PM 646 Views
I don't understand your theory - 16/01/2010 05:08:03 PM 617 Views
It's very simple - 16/01/2010 06:17:36 PM 609 Views
So in other words - 17/01/2010 06:31:58 PM 735 Views
no I'd continue to insist that something disproved was correct - 17/01/2010 06:43:41 PM 629 Views
Re: no I'd continue to insist that something disproved was correct - 18/01/2010 04:48:33 AM 659 Views
I'm talking about implanting knowledge into someone elses head - 18/01/2010 05:37:32 AM 645 Views
Here's Brandon's one answer - 18/01/2010 05:20:20 PM 686 Views
But... - 18/01/2010 05:48:54 PM 648 Views
Exactly my point - 18/01/2010 06:24:25 PM 666 Views
But by this logic... - 18/01/2010 06:50:43 PM 606 Views
Yes... - 18/01/2010 07:00:40 PM 662 Views
While you are right... - 18/01/2010 08:44:19 PM 649 Views
as we've discussed in another thread - 18/01/2010 09:08:56 PM 1047 Views
I mean... - 19/01/2010 02:21:39 PM 649 Views
Weren't they specifically called Weaves that haven't been seen since the AoL? - 19/01/2010 05:26:38 PM 689 Views
"Elza had been given knowledge of several rarely known weaves" is the quote. - 19/01/2010 06:14:22 PM 608 Views
Well if they were secret Ajah weaves someone would have recognized them *NM* - 19/01/2010 06:21:19 PM 288 Views
Maybe secret BA weaves... - 19/01/2010 06:37:42 PM 869 Views
Possible since she was the only BA in the area - 19/01/2010 06:40:38 PM 889 Views
See, I think there's reason for her presence to be kept secret... - 18/01/2010 09:10:43 PM 716 Views
I have a hard time... - 19/01/2010 02:17:52 PM 709 Views
I agree with you - 19/01/2010 04:45:59 PM 655 Views
and you may very well be correct - 19/01/2010 05:39:02 PM 865 Views
Yet Rand/LTT tells us only a few chapters later - 14/01/2010 10:27:57 PM 719 Views
Anything is possible ... - 14/01/2010 10:54:46 PM 726 Views
who knows - 14/01/2010 11:21:43 PM 692 Views
It's not all that convoluted, though ... - 15/01/2010 03:26:01 PM 604 Views
Cyndane/Moggy/Graendal it all amounts to the same in the end - 15/01/2010 05:57:10 PM 788 Views
Re: Cyndane/Moggy/Graendal it all amounts to the same in the end - 15/01/2010 06:25:32 PM 671 Views
Re: Cyndane/Moggy/Graendal it all amounts to the same in the end - 15/01/2010 06:44:26 PM 631 Views
Good point! - 15/01/2010 07:19:00 AM 717 Views
Re: Good point! - 15/01/2010 05:30:12 PM 607 Views
I agree - 16/01/2010 09:50:09 AM 590 Views
what doesn't make sense about this to me - 15/01/2010 06:04:45 PM 674 Views
Re: what doesn't make sense about this to me - 15/01/2010 06:29:59 PM 683 Views
damn double posting - 15/01/2010 07:04:56 PM 607 Views
As it is often the case... - 16/01/2010 09:30:56 AM 707 Views
go re-read my statements and quit putting words in my mouth please. - 16/01/2010 03:59:52 PM 665 Views
Well... - 16/01/2010 04:14:28 PM 560 Views
as I said it's also possible that SH has new abilities - 16/01/2010 04:33:30 PM 606 Views
Re: I think Graendal was involved on some level in this part of the story - 14/01/2010 09:30:53 PM 712 Views
Uhhh? - 14/01/2010 09:13:13 PM 893 Views
One point - 14/01/2010 09:20:09 PM 787 Views
Re: One point - 14/01/2010 09:32:00 PM 718 Views
Elza truly believes that... - 14/01/2010 09:38:35 PM 721 Views
Elza "found a reason to follow the Compulsion" - 14/01/2010 11:23:33 PM 778 Views
So, it came from her, and would not go when the Compulsion was removed. - 15/01/2010 05:56:32 AM 702 Views
fair enough - 16/01/2010 04:34:05 PM 752 Views
Not quite - 14/01/2010 09:38:45 PM 726 Views

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