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I don't believe in striking first but, frankly, it's long been a moot point. Joel Send a noteboard - 23/11/2010 05:09:49 PM
17 years of engaging North Korea have led to absolutely no positive tangible results. Not only that, that fruitless process has given the North the opportunity to develop nuclear warheads. They now let the whole world know that there is a second nuclear facility that they had never revealed or intended to reveal throughout those 17 years, and a few days later they open up with the first artillery shelling of South Korea since the armistice.

I think it is time to mobilize and strike. We need to strike first, strike hard and strike so hard that nothing can strike back worth noting.

The map at the article Camilla linked was illustrative: It purports to show sites of 150 "incidents" between North and South Korea since the "armistice" "ended" the conflict. A total of FOUR occurred outside South Koreas land borders (all but one of those in open sea). That said, I'm still not convinced a military strike is the next logical step, but we should break off diplomatic relations until/unless North Korea demontrates some significant and tangible concessions. Simply crawling to them for another agreement they can violate with impunity while they prepare for a war of their own choosing would be stupid. How many people must they kill before the US and her allies are no longer the aggressor? We're past that point, IMHO, and should clearly say the next attack will be treated as the act of war it is, will initiate a war we will conclude on our terms.

Of course, that does mean some pretty awful things, things like North Korea shelling South Korea (because, remember, as long as we sit mutely taking this crap North Korea won't unleash an artillery barrage on South Korean civil--oh, wait, that's a proven load of horsecrap, isn't it? :rolleyes: ) and the US confronting China, but it should be clear to any objective observer by now that that day is coming whatever we do.
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This message last edited by Joel on 23/11/2010 at 09:26:59 PM
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North Korea attacks South Korea and no one mentions it? - 23/11/2010 10:56:03 AM 1297 Views
"Oh God, Oh God, we are all going to die?" - 23/11/2010 11:09:30 AM 1087 Views
Yup, but the day Beijing decides they're better off not intervening the Appeasers look very dumb. - 23/11/2010 11:23:35 AM 932 Views
The appeasers look very dumb at this point regardless. - 23/11/2010 04:11:41 PM 852 Views
yes, because we want to fight *ANOTHER* proxy war with china *NM* - 23/11/2010 04:29:18 PM 484 Views
"Wanting" has nothing to do with it. There are few alternatives. - 23/11/2010 04:50:02 PM 988 Views
Honestly, it COULD go either way. - 23/11/2010 05:14:18 PM 1130 Views
China's relations with North Korea are also worsening, though. - 25/11/2010 05:48:01 PM 1264 Views
What Tom said. - 23/11/2010 05:15:31 PM 936 Views
I don't believe in striking first but, frankly, it's long been a moot point. - 23/11/2010 05:09:49 PM 961 Views
I figured someone else would post it *NM* - 23/11/2010 11:16:44 AM 424 Views
You know I like to sleep in, remember? - 23/11/2010 11:20:33 AM 929 Views
Agreed - 23/11/2010 02:07:30 PM 1036 Views
I think most Americans are asleep until the sun rises here - 23/11/2010 11:32:28 AM 942 Views
That is 'cause everyone else is hiding out in their nuclear bunkers - 23/11/2010 11:40:33 AM 927 Views
Re: That is 'cause everyone else is hiding out in their nuclear bunkers - 23/11/2010 11:46:03 AM 978 Views
Re: That is 'cause everyone else is hiding out in their nuclear bunkers - 23/11/2010 11:57:51 AM 860 Views
The really sad part is, that along with everything else worthwhile in the British Empire... - 25/11/2010 09:49:00 AM 1106 Views
you know what they say - 25/11/2010 10:34:30 AM 955 Views
Never send an Englishman to do a man's work? - 25/11/2010 09:06:22 PM 958 Views
I actually had no clue. - 23/11/2010 01:14:20 PM 938 Views
Re: I actually had no clue. - 23/11/2010 01:15:10 PM 802 Views
Re: I actually had no clue. - 23/11/2010 04:32:17 PM 913 Views
Re: I actually had no clue. - 23/11/2010 04:36:59 PM 880 Views
Honestly, - 23/11/2010 02:36:13 PM 848 Views
you know the world doesn't exist until america wakes up in the morning, right? *NM* - 23/11/2010 04:27:27 PM 452 Views
I had an inkling. *NM* - 23/11/2010 04:37:37 PM 488 Views
OK, have had time to read it, and someone needs to fact check a very important part of that article. - 23/11/2010 04:52:02 PM 1028 Views
Fact checking: - 23/11/2010 08:38:57 PM 930 Views
The term "truce" used in a different Guardian article seems better. - 23/11/2010 09:20:19 PM 861 Views
my two bits - 23/11/2010 10:51:51 PM 988 Views
I'm glad your ex wasn't there in 1970 then. - 24/11/2010 01:10:02 AM 965 Views
Well - 23/11/2010 05:24:02 PM 967 Views
There's not going to be any all-out conflict - 24/11/2010 12:56:44 AM 1090 Views
They're getting aid from South Korea now, and killing them anyway. - 24/11/2010 01:20:33 AM 1041 Views
No kidding, that's been going on for quite some time. - 24/11/2010 02:49:50 AM 912 Views
That is the crux of it, I suppose. - 24/11/2010 03:02:40 PM 994 Views
~shrugs~ SK has lived with this a long time, and will continue to do so. - 24/11/2010 10:26:44 PM 969 Views
Parts of it have; some South Koreans stopped living with it a few days ago. - 25/11/2010 01:48:02 PM 1569 Views
They won't be the last. - 02/12/2010 12:55:20 AM 1141 Views
Re: North Korea attacks South Korea and no one mentions it? - 24/11/2010 01:50:11 AM 876 Views

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