That just has "Polish Corridor" written all over it (though, again, part of the problem with alternatives is it is not just a major port but the Palestinian States SOLE ocean access.) There are peaceful exclaves, but how many involving two groups that have been telling their kids stories about killing each other since their ancient emergence AS groups? Maybe there ARE no practical Gazan solutions: Egypt does not want it, Israel really does not either and Palestine only wants it because of its port (accepting a duty to contentious fellow citizens does not constitute "wanting" it.)

View original postI think on several points we had a fruitful discussion, and I found much less to argue with in what you say once you stopped talking about the events of two thousand years ago. Also on the issue of the Palestinians indeed being difficult "guests" in many regards, I can't blame the Jordanians for "Black September" and all that.

Fair enough, and I remain convinced that last is the core problem: If the bulk of Palestinians just trying to live their lives (or just LIVE) could be rid of terrorists "defending" their kids by making them human shields, they would be peaceful, productive and fully recognized citizens of Israel or any state. Until/unless that happens though they will remain no more welcome in Arab nations than in Israel; maybe that is another argument for a Palestinian State (Fatah is an interesting case study here because it indicates terrorists CAN be pacified, but have had no more luck than anyone else pacifying others.)

Well, perhaps the biggest problem with insurgents is that it is usually impossible to know who is a bona fide civilian, or rather, insurgents remain indistinguishable until they attack. Israel gets a lot of criticism (and often deserves it) for "anti-terrorism" so indiscriminate it incidentally kills hundreds of kids, but much of that is based on Western outrage at the notion of "murdering an innocent ten-year-old!" without acknowledging simply being ten-years-old is no guarantee of innocence: When someone is charging with an automatic rifle blazing away or straps a bomb to their chest, their lethality is independent of whether they are 10 or 110. That does not excuse Israels cavalier careless policy, but does go far toward explaining it.

So right of return remains impractical for the same reason many peaceful refugees became so in the first place: It is so ofte impossible to distinguish Palestinian terrorist from Palestinian civilian that Israel hardly TRIES. Again, removing terrorism would remove that obstacle, though removing terrorists is not exactly easier than identifying them.

Just MHO, but I think the West Bank and Israel would eventually come to an understanding, however grudging, if Gaza quit pouring gasoline on the fire each time the peace process "threatens" to extinguish it. Yes, the settlements are an issue, but at this point I am unsure how much Israel is committed to ANY West Bank settlements rather than just using them as another way to collectively punish Palestinians for the next round of terrorism. Jerusalem is the real sticking point, because so revered by both sides (though, strictly in terms of religious differences, "holiest city" trumps "THIRD holiest city:" Muslims have and prefer Medina and Mecca to Jerusalem, whose main value is from JEWISH kings Islam claims as holy men, but that principal "Islamic" value makes Jerusalem the ne plus ultra for Jews.) Yet if Jews can avoid the issue by maintaining Tel Aviv as political capital, Palestinians could do something similar and both declare Jerusalem a jointly possessed international city (that would certainly please the Orthodox and Catholic Churches.)

The really insoluble problem is Gaza, IMHO, and was even before Hamas took over there (a problem hardly improved by Fatah coming to terms with it in a coalition government: It just encourages the belief terrorism WORKS.) Egypt is probably better equipped to take it in hand than anyone except Israel though, and would not be accused of raism and genocide for doing so. But no one can force Egypt to take Gaza and, as you say, no one wants it but Palestine. The "Dred Sea" canal projects might even remove THAT desire; the progress of Israeli-Jordanian relations under King Hussein clearly show Israel can get along to mutual advantage with even the most historically hostile nations willing to forego destructive violence for constructive peace. None of that fixes Gaza though; I am unsure anything CAN.