Active Users:384 Time:03/05/2024 01:00:48 PM
Aran'gar does not, and doesn't have to represent, trangender people for your usage to be wrong fionwe1987 Send a noteboard - 13/11/2018 03:21:42 PM

You're perfectly right that if RJ wrote Aran'gar to represent gender dysphoria or transgenderism, there are all sorts of issues that would make this an extremely toxic representation. But there's no evidence this was the case, nor does it have to be.

The only issue that matters is that the character refers to herself as female, as do all her colleagues whose PoVs we have thinking of her. And from those PoVs, we see absolutely nothing indicating that they're doing so in a derogatory fashion, as could be expected from the Forsaken.

The issue is that you took the trouble to convert "she", as used by the books and the author, into "it", which is dehumanizing to any living person whatever the context.

You need have no sympathy for Aran'gar, or think of her as some kind of representation of transgender people, to see the transphobia in calling her "it". The causes and manner of her transition are literally unrealistic, as is her swift adjustment. But that is what the books show happen. Case closed.

The issue would be similarly bad if you used racially charged or sexist language about the Forsaken. Sure, they're evil and no one's idea of representation of racial minorities or women. But if you use such language about them, you'd reveal your disdain and disregard for people different from yourself.

It is a strawman to argue that abusive language directed at terrible people doesn't matter. Your usage wouldn't be any worse, and would be just as angering, if you'd used it for some hypothetical hero who was a male soul born into a female body due to something the Creator does. That valence, of whether the person is good or not, simply doesn't matter in this debate.

This message last edited by fionwe1987 on 13/11/2018 at 03:22:08 PM
Reply to message
Aran'gar and the trans issue. - 13/11/2018 12:25:48 AM 631 Views
This is exactly why the knee-jerk response was so amusing. - 13/11/2018 01:18:28 AM 348 Views
I think you could argue it's surprisingly apt. - 13/11/2018 01:31:37 AM 385 Views
I don't know what's so hard to understand about this. You don't refer to people by 'it'. - 13/11/2018 08:09:34 AM 351 Views
People are refered to by "it" all the time.... - 13/11/2018 05:26:33 PM 345 Views
But remember, human fetuses aren't people. /s *NM* - 13/11/2018 05:42:00 PM 276 Views
Your second example rather proves my point, don't you think? - 13/11/2018 07:50:39 PM 332 Views
and those of us defending Cannoli maintain - 13/11/2018 07:59:08 PM 311 Views
I'm not really commenting on Cannoli's post.... - 13/11/2018 09:20:13 PM 328 Views
FWIW mine was concerning ambiguity - 13/11/2018 11:01:03 PM 361 Views
Okay, sure. - 13/11/2018 11:26:58 PM 352 Views
Interesting.... - 13/11/2018 11:36:43 PM 335 Views
Because it is just contempt - 13/11/2018 11:45:08 PM 472 Views
I think I mostly covered that above, but I can recap. - 14/11/2018 08:02:51 AM 342 Views
Who's on the phone? - 14/11/2018 01:53:14 AM 345 Views
Sure, I agree. - 14/11/2018 07:45:58 AM 353 Views
Aran'gar does not, and doesn't have to represent, trangender people for your usage to be wrong - 13/11/2018 03:21:42 PM 355 Views
Except that it isn't a person, it is a character in a book - 14/11/2018 02:57:12 PM 337 Views
So? - 14/11/2018 07:18:10 PM 344 Views
Re: So? - 17/11/2018 02:13:37 PM 314 Views
Upon reflection, I have edited the original post - 13/11/2018 08:02:17 PM 345 Views
Thank you. *NM* - 13/11/2018 11:31:41 PM 166 Views

Reply to Message