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While you are right... Etzel Send a noteboard - 18/01/2010 08:44:19 PM
That it doesn't kill the "Graendal was there"-theory, all the quotes rather indicate that truly just SH and Elza were involved - as it seems to be the case in the book - because only these two characters are mentioned regarding the scene. It seems especially unlikely that the Compulsion expert Graendal was apparently needed to find out that Elza was under Compulsion and to teach her the necessary weaves, but that Graendal wouldn't remove the Compulsion then or simply take the DM herself (after probably checking what weaves would actually be needed for Elza to open the box ). It's even said that Elza was "essential" for SH for getting things done (since SH is limited in affecting the physical world), though one wonders why SH couldn't use Graendal, if she was anyway already involved.

Ah, well, we will see.
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Elza's Compulsion Sidious - 14/01/2010 08:41:04 PM 2143 Views
I think Graendal was involved on some level in this part of the story darius_sedai - 14/01/2010 09:12:05 PM 1067 Views
I disagree Etzel - 14/01/2010 09:27:27 PM 943 Views
except work with Semirhage! darius_sedai - 14/01/2010 09:34:37 PM 866 Views
Well... Etzel - 14/01/2010 09:43:40 PM 1007 Views
SH can't channel thus can't teach Elza anything *NM* darius_sedai - 14/01/2010 10:20:19 PM 363 Views
Yeah, but according to BS, he apparently could "give her the knowledge". *shrug* *NM* Etzel - 15/01/2010 07:16:22 AM 309 Views
that's your interpretation of the quote darius_sedai - 15/01/2010 05:58:30 PM 753 Views
This and the others quotes suggest that only SH and Elza were involved *NM* Etzel - 16/01/2010 09:51:24 AM 291 Views
As I said that's certainly one of of interpreting the quotes darius_sedai - 16/01/2010 03:46:55 PM 689 Views
The question is... Etzel - 16/01/2010 03:59:24 PM 701 Views
Re: The question is... darius_sedai - 16/01/2010 04:02:55 PM 694 Views
Yeah, as I said elsewhere, would be a nice question for BS, if there was another Forsaken. *NM* Etzel - 16/01/2010 04:08:05 PM 785 Views
I bet you anything he'd giva a big fat RAFO to that darius_sedai - 16/01/2010 04:08:58 PM 700 Views
BS spoke quite openly about this scene, though Etzel - 16/01/2010 04:16:09 PM 747 Views
always worth a try, but wasn't he asked to be less open recently? darius_sedai - 16/01/2010 04:31:54 PM 708 Views
Shaidar Haran can't channel. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 14/01/2010 09:34:51 PM 1078 Views
I know... Etzel - 14/01/2010 09:45:15 PM 923 Views
I agree with you, for a related but slightly different reason ... Shishka - 14/01/2010 09:58:28 PM 1008 Views
That doesn't prove anything... fionwe1987 - 14/01/2010 10:07:46 PM 941 Views
It proves enough for me ... Shishka - 14/01/2010 10:26:28 PM 856 Views
Re: That doesn't prove anything... Sidious - 15/01/2010 11:03:05 AM 658 Views
not really darius_sedai - 15/01/2010 05:29:25 PM 691 Views
I don't understand your theory Sidious - 16/01/2010 05:08:03 PM 665 Views
It's very simple darius_sedai - 16/01/2010 06:17:36 PM 659 Views
So in other words Sidious - 17/01/2010 06:31:58 PM 782 Views
no I'd continue to insist that something disproved was correct darius_sedai - 17/01/2010 06:43:41 PM 677 Views
Re: no I'd continue to insist that something disproved was correct Sidious - 18/01/2010 04:48:33 AM 711 Views
I'm talking about implanting knowledge into someone elses head darius_sedai - 18/01/2010 05:37:32 AM 691 Views
Here's Brandon's one answer Sidious - 18/01/2010 05:20:20 PM 740 Views
But... fionwe1987 - 18/01/2010 05:48:54 PM 699 Views
Exactly my point darius_sedai - 18/01/2010 06:24:25 PM 717 Views
But by this logic... Etzel - 18/01/2010 06:50:43 PM 660 Views
Yes... fionwe1987 - 18/01/2010 07:00:40 PM 708 Views
While you are right... Etzel - 18/01/2010 08:44:19 PM 694 Views
as we've discussed in another thread darius_sedai - 18/01/2010 09:08:56 PM 1095 Views
I mean... Etzel - 19/01/2010 02:21:39 PM 706 Views
Weren't they specifically called Weaves that haven't been seen since the AoL? darius_sedai - 19/01/2010 05:26:38 PM 733 Views
"Elza had been given knowledge of several rarely known weaves" is the quote. Etzel - 19/01/2010 06:14:22 PM 663 Views
Well if they were secret Ajah weaves someone would have recognized them *NM* darius_sedai - 19/01/2010 06:21:19 PM 309 Views
Maybe secret BA weaves... Etzel - 19/01/2010 06:37:42 PM 918 Views
Possible since she was the only BA in the area darius_sedai - 19/01/2010 06:40:38 PM 942 Views
See, I think there's reason for her presence to be kept secret... fionwe1987 - 18/01/2010 09:10:43 PM 769 Views
I have a hard time... Etzel - 19/01/2010 02:17:52 PM 763 Views
I agree with you Sidious - 19/01/2010 04:45:59 PM 712 Views
and you may very well be correct darius_sedai - 19/01/2010 05:39:02 PM 919 Views
Yet Rand/LTT tells us only a few chapters later darius_sedai - 14/01/2010 10:27:57 PM 766 Views
Anything is possible ... Shishka - 14/01/2010 10:54:46 PM 784 Views
who knows darius_sedai - 14/01/2010 11:21:43 PM 746 Views
It's not all that convoluted, though ... Shishka - 15/01/2010 03:26:01 PM 656 Views
Cyndane/Moggy/Graendal it all amounts to the same in the end darius_sedai - 15/01/2010 05:57:10 PM 837 Views
Re: Cyndane/Moggy/Graendal it all amounts to the same in the end Shishka - 15/01/2010 06:25:32 PM 726 Views
Re: Cyndane/Moggy/Graendal it all amounts to the same in the end darius_sedai - 15/01/2010 06:44:26 PM 673 Views
Good point! Etzel - 15/01/2010 07:19:00 AM 767 Views
Re: Good point! Shishka - 15/01/2010 05:30:12 PM 660 Views
I agree Etzel - 16/01/2010 09:50:09 AM 643 Views
what doesn't make sense about this to me darius_sedai - 15/01/2010 06:04:45 PM 727 Views
Re: what doesn't make sense about this to me Shishka - 15/01/2010 06:29:59 PM 739 Views
this makes my head hurt ... or maybe all that red wine I drank last night is doing that darius_sedai - 15/01/2010 07:04:23 PM 713 Views
damn double posting darius_sedai - 15/01/2010 07:04:56 PM 656 Views
As it is often the case... Etzel - 16/01/2010 09:30:56 AM 755 Views
go re-read my statements and quit putting words in my mouth please. darius_sedai - 16/01/2010 03:59:52 PM 712 Views
Well... Etzel - 16/01/2010 04:14:28 PM 605 Views
as I said it's also possible that SH has new abilities darius_sedai - 16/01/2010 04:33:30 PM 655 Views
Re: I think Graendal was involved on some level in this part of the story RugbyPlayingAshaman - 14/01/2010 09:30:53 PM 761 Views
Uhhh? fionwe1987 - 14/01/2010 09:13:13 PM 948 Views
One point darius_sedai - 14/01/2010 09:20:09 PM 835 Views
Re: One point Oberonus - 14/01/2010 09:32:00 PM 762 Views
Elza truly believes that... fionwe1987 - 14/01/2010 09:38:35 PM 775 Views
Elza "found a reason to follow the Compulsion" darius_sedai - 14/01/2010 11:23:33 PM 826 Views
So, it came from her, and would not go when the Compulsion was removed. Cannoli - 15/01/2010 05:56:32 AM 764 Views
fair enough darius_sedai - 16/01/2010 04:34:05 PM 798 Views
Not quite rAndy aL - 14/01/2010 09:38:45 PM 793 Views
But that could mean that they were to start the LB between Rand and the Great Lord immediately *NM* Voscaia Sedai - 16/01/2010 01:04:32 PM 310 Views
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