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She very well... Jeordam Send a noteboard - 01/02/2010 11:13:50 PM
could be dead. From the way that the book reads at face value, she is dead. However I am not convinced. Why? There's an old saying that you can never be too sure that someone's dead unless you see a body.

This plays true for pretty much every show that I've seen, or book that I've read. Many of the Forsaken that we know are dead, we've seen them die.

Moiraine actually balefires Be'lal.
What was left of Ishmael's corpse after Rand killed him was in the Heart of the Stone.
Nynaeve sees Rand balefire Rhavin.
Graendal actually kills Asmodean in the hallway in the palace in Camelyn.
Moiraine actually pulls the angreal out of Lanfear's hands and tumbles through the Finn doorway.
Cadsuane actually identifies the burned body of "a rebel Asha'man" who we know is Osan'gar/Aginor.
Min actually witnesses Rand balefire Semirhage.

The only exceptions to this are the apparent death of Sammael and Graendal. There is a much better case for Sammael being dead, as Rand was within eyeshot of where his death took place. He looked at him...looked away for a heartbeat...and looked back. There was no physical means of escape for Sammael (unless the guy is Usane Bolt with manuvering skills like Darren Sproles), and Rand specifically didn't feel him channel saidin . So unless Sammael busted out a random weave of the True Source & Gateway-ed out of there in a heartbeat...Sammael is toast.

As for Graendal...the non-presense of the Compulsion weave/residue is just not enough evidence for dead for me. No first had account of actually seeing her go all "black to white" balefire-y...no body...no tangible event to point to. Just Nynaeve's testimony that there is no compulsion weaves there anymore...and that the guy was obviously not "compulsed" since he wasn't a slobbering, shell of a man. Let us remember that Graendal is superior in her ability to use Compulsion. She can do it so that the guy would have no side effects. And lets be honest...Nynaeve's ability to Delve may be awsome, but she can't read residues like Aviendha.

Is Graendal dead? I'm not sure...but since its near the end of the series, I'm gonna say yes. Would I be suprised if she just appeared in the next book? Not in the least.

~Jeordam
ex-Admin at wotmania (all things wot & art galleries)
Saving the Princess, Humanity, or the World-Entire since 1985
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So your name is Graendal.... - 01/02/2010 09:18:00 PM 1733 Views
one of the reasons I'm at a loss with her death ... along with the lead-up being clumsy *NM* - 01/02/2010 09:36:29 PM 740 Views
She very well... - 01/02/2010 11:13:50 PM 1045 Views
Exactly how I feel ... to the letter! *NM* - 01/02/2010 11:17:57 PM 601 Views
Re: She very well... - 02/02/2010 08:42:17 AM 1054 Views
Ha! "Graendal actually kills Asmodean". A very bold claim. *NM* - 02/02/2010 10:51:40 AM 640 Views
Bold like saying that water is wet.... - 02/02/2010 05:46:54 PM 688 Views
I am now split with a 80% belief it's Graendal and 20% that it's Moghedien *NM* - 02/02/2010 06:11:47 PM 421 Views
Moghedien.... - 02/02/2010 06:15:41 PM 779 Views
The a'dam doesn't limit your ability to enter T'A'R - 02/02/2010 06:36:26 PM 777 Views
Yeah..... - 02/02/2010 06:46:50 PM 940 Views
Re: Yeah..... - 02/02/2010 07:42:59 PM 727 Views
This brings up a very intersting question... - 02/02/2010 09:30:49 PM 951 Views
Re: This brings up a very intersting question... - 02/02/2010 09:57:24 PM 709 Views
Moghedien? Really? - 02/02/2010 07:56:33 PM 819 Views
when was Semirhage in an a'dam? *NM* - 02/02/2010 08:48:27 PM 427 Views
Re: Moghedien? Really? - 02/02/2010 09:03:54 PM 757 Views
Egwene was faintly forkrooted, not heavily. - 02/02/2010 10:24:55 PM 733 Views
It was heavy enough to nullify her ability almost completely by TGS - 02/02/2010 10:38:04 PM 656 Views
That's still extremely faint. - 02/02/2010 11:07:10 PM 738 Views
Re: That's still extremely faint. - 03/02/2010 03:34:06 PM 783 Views
Re: Moghedien? Really? - 03/02/2010 01:02:13 AM 727 Views
Re: Moghedien? Really? - 03/02/2010 03:31:21 PM 911 Views
The chance that Moggy killed Asmo is actually 0 % - 02/02/2010 09:32:03 PM 809 Views
*nods* - 02/02/2010 09:36:04 PM 646 Views
Well, I completely disagree, but that's another discussion. *NM* - 02/02/2010 07:07:05 PM 402 Views
Yes, I agree. *NM* - 02/02/2010 03:26:13 PM 551 Views
As bad as Sammael's death. *NM* - 03/02/2010 02:00:02 AM 427 Views
Yes, pretty much. - 01/02/2010 11:21:31 PM 808 Views
Couple of flaws in that reasoning - 02/02/2010 07:56:35 AM 1071 Views
Graendal already has a massive inverted ward around the palace. - 02/02/2010 03:23:44 PM 850 Views
Come on now.... - 02/02/2010 04:58:34 PM 965 Views
IMO - 02/02/2010 05:58:10 PM 786 Views
This could go either way.... - 02/02/2010 06:14:21 PM 929 Views
RE: Strength and Compulsion - 02/02/2010 06:31:13 PM 938 Views
I never figured that Verin was weak....or even middling. - 02/02/2010 06:57:11 PM 808 Views
Re: I never figured that Verin was weak....or even middling. - 02/02/2010 07:51:15 PM 811 Views
Verin was using her angreal when she compelled. *NM* - 02/02/2010 08:00:50 PM 455 Views
Danke for clarification. - 02/02/2010 08:15:39 PM 662 Views
The thing is... - 02/02/2010 09:39:18 AM 805 Views
Its still a game... - 02/02/2010 05:09:42 PM 821 Views
I could buy... - 02/02/2010 07:16:43 PM 771 Views
Please, - 02/02/2010 10:42:00 AM 774 Views
*ha* - 02/02/2010 05:10:41 PM 742 Views
My name is Graendal? My parents will be so confused. - 02/02/2010 02:19:26 PM 751 Views
So what would you say... - 02/02/2010 05:12:09 PM 731 Views
Wow. - 02/02/2010 06:00:11 PM 797 Views
Never underestimate.... - 02/02/2010 06:08:42 PM 706 Views
"Oh, no... Rand is totally going to balefire me!" *NM* - 03/02/2010 08:50:26 PM 397 Views
A conclusion with an explanation built around it. - 02/02/2010 10:22:29 PM 836 Views
Hah! - 02/02/2010 10:38:38 PM 664 Views
I miss Diomedes . *NM* - 02/02/2010 11:07:45 PM 367 Views
So...like the theory of Macro Evolution? People seem to believe that..... - 02/02/2010 11:22:41 PM 835 Views
... - 03/02/2010 01:23:06 AM 728 Views
Ok...I'm just saying... - 03/02/2010 04:00:46 PM 897 Views
That's ridiculous - 02/02/2010 11:39:41 PM 775 Views
Hold on now.... - 02/02/2010 11:51:32 PM 940 Views
Re: Hold on now.... - 03/02/2010 02:52:07 AM 769 Views
Re: Hold on now.... - 03/02/2010 08:59:44 PM 774 Views
Re: Hold on now.... - 04/02/2010 04:44:31 AM 705 Views
Your theory breaks down because of something Brandon said. - 03/02/2010 03:49:58 AM 705 Views
Kind of - 03/02/2010 04:10:04 AM 791 Views
I disagree. - 03/02/2010 05:31:39 AM 662 Views
But how many previously unseen weaves have had such huge implications? - 03/02/2010 01:29:15 PM 936 Views
Two things come to mind... - 03/02/2010 03:50:38 PM 853 Views
I don't really think this is relevant - 03/02/2010 05:03:51 PM 770 Views
There's a difference.... - 03/02/2010 06:01:30 PM 805 Views
I know there is. You're the one who brought up the weaves being picked apart - 03/02/2010 06:37:40 PM 800 Views
*grins* - 03/02/2010 06:42:54 PM 817 Views
But again... - 03/02/2010 06:59:18 PM 735 Views
sure we do - 03/02/2010 07:03:40 PM 684 Views
Each of them was at the very least confused/disoriented afterwards. - 03/02/2010 07:14:24 PM 669 Views
But here's the thing... - 03/02/2010 07:36:42 PM 778 Views
I think we disagree with what "subtle" means here. - 03/02/2010 07:46:20 PM 705 Views
Kerb was more subtle than most, but we've seen subtler. - 04/02/2010 05:16:33 PM 920 Views
Re: Each of them was at the very least confused/disoriented afterwards. - 03/02/2010 07:37:58 PM 656 Views
... - 03/02/2010 07:42:07 PM 735 Views
Re: ... - 03/02/2010 07:59:26 PM 712 Views
But - 03/02/2010 08:04:27 PM 812 Views
I think it would be obvious if Ituralde was acting different - 03/02/2010 08:18:50 PM 978 Views
Hrm - 03/02/2010 08:36:12 PM 884 Views
It happens in WH when they go to tell her that Moridin is N'B - 03/02/2010 08:43:11 PM 753 Views
Thanks *NM* - 03/02/2010 08:47:29 PM 403 Views
Now try and not lynch me... - 03/02/2010 04:08:11 PM 778 Views
But that's not how it happened - 03/02/2010 08:18:59 PM 768 Views

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