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Its still a game... Jeordam Send a noteboard - 02/02/2010 05:09:42 PM
Graendal would never expect Rand to simply balefire her whole palace out of existence. When Rand sent his messenger, Graendal figured that Rand wanted to "play", while he actually just planned to use brute force.

I agree...there's no reason why she would expect to get nuked. But there is absolutely no reason to believe that she wouldn't have a fast way to get out of dodge.

This is the point of Rand's analogy of two people sitting on a table, one thinks the game starts, but the other just punches the opponent in the face.

But see...Rand did more than sit at that table. He played the first piece & then *waited* for her reaction. There is, what, 20 minutes...maybe more...between when the guy left Graendal & Rand nukes the palace. Are you saying that she couldn't have gotten out of there in that time?


Any other interpretation, namely that Graendal outsmarted Rand, while he was trying to outsmart her, gives the Forsaken too much credit and the Dragon Reborn too less credit.


Not at all. Just because the vast majority of the Forsaken are complete incompetants, doesn't mean that Graendal is. In the grand scheme of the Forsaken, I would put her at the very top of them all when it came to raw brain power. Her only other competitor in the whole thing would be Ishmael, but he's always been a bit too philosophical. Don't look at the titles of the people, but look at who they are. Graendal in and of her own right was an accomplished person who dealt with problems of the mind which channeling couldn't heal. That's *huge*. She was accomplished outside of her channling abilities. How many others can say that among the Forsaken?

So over to Rand. Yes, he's got Lews Therin in his brain, but its not as though the transition is smooth or even...real? Instead, you have the sheep herder & the past life of an awsome man. I think that you give him too much credit in thinking that he could completely out think one of the greatest minds from the Age of Legends. After all...it can be very much said that Graendal actually does know Rand/LT better than he knows himself.

~Jeordam
ex-Admin at wotmania (all things wot & art galleries)
Saving the Princess, Humanity, or the World-Entire since 1985
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So your name is Graendal.... Jeordam - 01/02/2010 09:18:00 PM 1721 Views
one of the reasons I'm at a loss with her death ... along with the lead-up being clumsy *NM* darius_sedai - 01/02/2010 09:36:29 PM 732 Views
She very well... Jeordam - 01/02/2010 11:13:50 PM 1030 Views
Exactly how I feel ... to the letter! *NM* darius_sedai - 01/02/2010 11:17:57 PM 594 Views
Re: She very well... jiggy - 02/02/2010 08:42:17 AM 954 Views
Ha! "Graendal actually kills Asmodean". A very bold claim. *NM* Etzel - 02/02/2010 10:51:40 AM 633 Views
Bold like saying that water is wet.... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 05:46:54 PM 672 Views
I am now split with a 80% belief it's Graendal and 20% that it's Moghedien *NM* RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 06:11:47 PM 412 Views
Moghedien.... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 06:15:41 PM 764 Views
The a'dam doesn't limit your ability to enter T'A'R RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 06:36:26 PM 739 Views
Yeah..... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 06:46:50 PM 923 Views
Re: Yeah..... RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 07:42:59 PM 710 Views
This brings up a very intersting question... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 09:30:49 PM 934 Views
Re: This brings up a very intersting question... RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 09:57:24 PM 697 Views
Moghedien? Really? fionwe1987 - 02/02/2010 07:56:33 PM 801 Views
when was Semirhage in an a'dam? *NM* darius_sedai - 02/02/2010 08:48:27 PM 418 Views
Re: Moghedien? Really? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 09:03:54 PM 727 Views
Egwene was faintly forkrooted, not heavily. Fanatic-Templar - 02/02/2010 10:24:55 PM 718 Views
It was heavy enough to nullify her ability almost completely by TGS RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 10:38:04 PM 639 Views
That's still extremely faint. Fanatic-Templar - 02/02/2010 11:07:10 PM 719 Views
Re: That's still extremely faint. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2010 03:34:06 PM 769 Views
Re: Moghedien? Really? fionwe1987 - 03/02/2010 01:02:13 AM 669 Views
Re: Moghedien? Really? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2010 03:31:21 PM 883 Views
The chance that Moggy killed Asmo is actually 0 % Etzel - 02/02/2010 09:32:03 PM 794 Views
*nods* Jeordam - 02/02/2010 09:36:04 PM 630 Views
Well, I completely disagree, but that's another discussion. *NM* Etzel - 02/02/2010 07:07:05 PM 395 Views
Yes, I agree. *NM* RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 03:26:13 PM 543 Views
As bad as Sammael's death. *NM* Kieran - 03/02/2010 02:00:02 AM 414 Views
The lead up was clumsy because her death scene was rather forced. Libby - 09/02/2010 11:11:21 PM 872 Views
Yes, pretty much. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 01/02/2010 11:21:31 PM 786 Views
Couple of flaws in that reasoning Lord Haart - 02/02/2010 07:56:35 AM 1048 Views
Graendal already has a massive inverted ward around the palace. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 03:23:44 PM 837 Views
Come on now.... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 04:58:34 PM 952 Views
IMO Sareitha Sedai - 02/02/2010 05:58:10 PM 770 Views
This could go either way.... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 06:14:21 PM 917 Views
RE: Strength and Compulsion RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 06:31:13 PM 923 Views
I never figured that Verin was weak....or even middling. Jeordam - 02/02/2010 06:57:11 PM 796 Views
Re: I never figured that Verin was weak....or even middling. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 07:51:15 PM 795 Views
Verin was using her angreal when she compelled. *NM* fionwe1987 - 02/02/2010 08:00:50 PM 449 Views
Danke for clarification. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 08:15:39 PM 647 Views
The thing is... Etzel - 02/02/2010 09:39:18 AM 784 Views
Its still a game... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 05:09:42 PM 804 Views
I could buy... Etzel - 02/02/2010 07:16:43 PM 754 Views
Please, Artsapat - 02/02/2010 10:42:00 AM 757 Views
*ha* Jeordam - 02/02/2010 05:10:41 PM 726 Views
My name is Graendal? My parents will be so confused. TaskmasterJack - 02/02/2010 02:19:26 PM 738 Views
So what would you say... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 05:12:09 PM 712 Views
Wow. Sareitha Sedai - 02/02/2010 06:00:11 PM 776 Views
Never underestimate.... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 06:08:42 PM 691 Views
"Oh, no... Rand is totally going to balefire me!" *NM* TaskmasterJack - 03/02/2010 08:50:26 PM 389 Views
A conclusion with an explanation built around it. Fanatic-Templar - 02/02/2010 10:22:29 PM 816 Views
Hah! RugbyPlayingAshaman - 02/02/2010 10:38:38 PM 648 Views
I miss Diomedes . *NM* Fanatic-Templar - 02/02/2010 11:07:45 PM 361 Views
So...like the theory of Macro Evolution? People seem to believe that..... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 11:22:41 PM 816 Views
... Fanatic-Templar - 03/02/2010 01:23:06 AM 714 Views
Ok...I'm just saying... Jeordam - 03/02/2010 04:00:46 PM 880 Views
I don't mean to make any generalisations about you, and I'm sorry if that's what I sounded like. Fanatic-Templar - 04/02/2010 12:24:34 AM 745 Views
That's ridiculous rAndy aL - 02/02/2010 11:39:41 PM 760 Views
Hold on now.... Jeordam - 02/02/2010 11:51:32 PM 925 Views
Re: Hold on now.... Lord Haart - 03/02/2010 02:52:07 AM 752 Views
Re: Hold on now.... darius_sedai - 03/02/2010 08:59:44 PM 758 Views
Re: Hold on now.... Lord Haart - 04/02/2010 04:44:31 AM 690 Views
Your theory breaks down because of something Brandon said. Logain - 03/02/2010 03:49:58 AM 696 Views
Kind of Lord Haart - 03/02/2010 04:10:04 AM 781 Views
I disagree. Gher - 03/02/2010 05:31:39 AM 645 Views
But how many previously unseen weaves have had such huge implications? Lord Haart - 03/02/2010 01:29:15 PM 922 Views
Two things come to mind... Jeordam - 03/02/2010 03:50:38 PM 840 Views
I don't really think this is relevant Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 05:03:51 PM 756 Views
There's a difference.... Jeordam - 03/02/2010 06:01:30 PM 784 Views
I know there is. You're the one who brought up the weaves being picked apart Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 06:37:40 PM 785 Views
*grins* Jeordam - 03/02/2010 06:42:54 PM 804 Views
But again... Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 06:59:18 PM 719 Views
sure we do darius_sedai - 03/02/2010 07:03:40 PM 670 Views
Each of them was at the very least confused/disoriented afterwards. Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 07:14:24 PM 653 Views
But here's the thing... Jeordam - 03/02/2010 07:36:42 PM 765 Views
I think we disagree with what "subtle" means here. Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 07:46:20 PM 685 Views
Kerb was more subtle than most, but we've seen subtler. Gher - 04/02/2010 05:16:33 PM 906 Views
Re: Each of them was at the very least confused/disoriented afterwards. darius_sedai - 03/02/2010 07:37:58 PM 642 Views
... Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 07:42:07 PM 717 Views
Re: ... darius_sedai - 03/02/2010 07:59:26 PM 695 Views
But Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 08:04:27 PM 787 Views
I think it would be obvious if Ituralde was acting different darius_sedai - 03/02/2010 08:18:50 PM 961 Views
Hrm Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 08:36:12 PM 868 Views
It happens in WH when they go to tell her that Moridin is N'B darius_sedai - 03/02/2010 08:43:11 PM 735 Views
Thanks *NM* Sareitha Sedai - 03/02/2010 08:47:29 PM 394 Views
Now try and not lynch me... Jeordam - 03/02/2010 04:08:11 PM 764 Views
But that's not how it happened BlackAdder - 03/02/2010 08:18:59 PM 753 Views
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