Just wanted to make it clear that I'm more strongly weighted towards Graendal, but I edited my original before you read it, I think:
Anyway, I'm strongly in favor of Graendal, but I just thought I'd throw Moghedien out there since, given what we know of Power Levels, it would be consistent with Moghedien being seen as the weakest to get the reaction from Asmodean she would have (ie: "You?" as in disbelief and scorn mixed together. Then "No!" As he is pulled into T'A'R or balefired).
Anyway, I'm strongly in favor of Graendal, but I just thought I'd throw Moghedien out there since, given what we know of Power Levels, it would be consistent with Moghedien being seen as the weakest to get the reaction from Asmodean she would have (ie: "You?" as in disbelief and scorn mixed together. Then "No!" As he is pulled into T'A'R or balefired).
Being....Is Moghedien a Dreamer? Walking around in Tel'aran'rhiod is one thing....Dreamwalking is a total other. Can Moghedien go to the in between place (looks like a starry sky) and walk around? Can she enter another's dreams. Does she have dreams which fortell the future?
If anything...I think this is the one Dreaming-ish type ability that Lanfear had over Moghedien. We actually see that Lanfear was able to enter into Rand's dreams. She subsequently pulled him into the dreamworld, but she was able to get him and pull him in. For the life of me, I don't remember Moghedien being able to do that.
But you bring up a very good question. If someone who is dreaming into TAR , can they open up a gateway into the real world? If so, can they channel out through that gateway into the real world?
I'm going to go with "no" to both questions. We know from Moghedian's own words that the rules of what happens & what can be done in the Dreamworld are a bit different from those who dream their way there and who are there in the flesh.
So lets say that someone is there in the flesh. They open up a gateway to the real world, and attempt to toss a fireball or whatever through. Will it make it? I'm going to go with yes. Because in this instance, the channeling is as a product of the channeler's ability & the one power (which is constant through both reality & dreamworld). If they dreamed up a rock and threw it at someone through the gateway...would it make it? No. Althrough the rock is a product of a person's will, the rock itself only exists inside the dreamworld. [note: this can go into a very good debate if you want...I have a counter-example in my head]
So lets say that someone dreams into TAR . Can they open up a gateway to the real world? Don't know. We've never even seen someone in TAR make a gateway (as there is no need). To make a gateway, the channeler needs to know the place that they are (physically)....for a man...to fold the pattern & drill a hole....for a woman, to make a singularity where one place in the pattern is alike to another. Neither of those will work in the dreamworld, as TAR exists as the place between and connecting every reality. We have seen two major examples of a person entering the dreamworld in the flesh & exiting out. We have never seen a dream-self making a gateway into reality for a flesh person. I don't think that it can be done.
~Jeordam
ex-Admin at wotmania (all things wot & art galleries)
Saving the Princess, Humanity, or the World-Entire since 1985
Saving the Princess, Humanity, or the World-Entire since 1985
So your name is Graendal....
01/02/2010 09:18:00 PM
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one of the reasons I'm at a loss with her death ... along with the lead-up being clumsy *NM*
01/02/2010 09:36:29 PM
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She very well...
01/02/2010 11:13:50 PM
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Ha! "Graendal actually kills Asmodean". A very bold claim. *NM*
02/02/2010 10:51:40 AM
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Bold like saying that water is wet....
02/02/2010 05:46:54 PM
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I am now split with a 80% belief it's Graendal and 20% that it's Moghedien *NM*
02/02/2010 06:11:47 PM
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Moghedien....
02/02/2010 06:15:41 PM
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The a'dam doesn't limit your ability to enter T'A'R
02/02/2010 06:36:26 PM
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Yeah.....
02/02/2010 06:46:50 PM
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Re: Yeah.....
02/02/2010 07:42:59 PM
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This brings up a very intersting question...
02/02/2010 09:30:49 PM
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Moghedien? Really?
02/02/2010 07:56:33 PM
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Re: Moghedien? Really?
02/02/2010 09:03:54 PM
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Egwene was faintly forkrooted, not heavily.
02/02/2010 10:24:55 PM
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It was heavy enough to nullify her ability almost completely by TGS
02/02/2010 10:38:04 PM
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The lead up was clumsy because her death scene was rather forced.
09/02/2010 11:11:21 PM
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Couple of flaws in that reasoning
02/02/2010 07:56:35 AM
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Come on now....
02/02/2010 04:58:34 PM
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IMO
02/02/2010 05:58:10 PM
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This could go either way....
02/02/2010 06:14:21 PM
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RE: Strength and Compulsion
02/02/2010 06:31:13 PM
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I never figured that Verin was weak....or even middling.
02/02/2010 06:57:11 PM
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Re: I never figured that Verin was weak....or even middling.
02/02/2010 07:51:15 PM
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The thing is...
02/02/2010 09:39:18 AM
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My name is Graendal? My parents will be so confused.
02/02/2010 02:19:26 PM
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A conclusion with an explanation built around it.
02/02/2010 10:22:29 PM
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So...like the theory of Macro Evolution? People seem to believe that.....
02/02/2010 11:22:41 PM
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...
03/02/2010 01:23:06 AM
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Ok...I'm just saying...
03/02/2010 04:00:46 PM
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I don't mean to make any generalisations about you, and I'm sorry if that's what I sounded like.
04/02/2010 12:24:34 AM
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That's ridiculous
02/02/2010 11:39:41 PM
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Hold on now....
02/02/2010 11:51:32 PM
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Re: Hold on now....
03/02/2010 02:52:07 AM
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Your theory breaks down because of something Brandon said.
03/02/2010 03:49:58 AM
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I disagree.
03/02/2010 05:31:39 AM
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But how many previously unseen weaves have had such huge implications?
03/02/2010 01:29:15 PM
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Two things come to mind...
03/02/2010 03:50:38 PM
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I don't really think this is relevant
03/02/2010 05:03:51 PM
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There's a difference....
03/02/2010 06:01:30 PM
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I know there is. You're the one who brought up the weaves being picked apart
03/02/2010 06:37:40 PM
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*grins*
03/02/2010 06:42:54 PM
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But again...
03/02/2010 06:59:18 PM
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sure we do
03/02/2010 07:03:40 PM
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Each of them was at the very least confused/disoriented afterwards.
03/02/2010 07:14:24 PM
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But here's the thing...
03/02/2010 07:36:42 PM
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Re: Each of them was at the very least confused/disoriented afterwards.
03/02/2010 07:37:58 PM
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...
03/02/2010 07:42:07 PM
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Re: ...
03/02/2010 07:59:26 PM
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But
03/02/2010 08:04:27 PM
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I think it would be obvious if Ituralde was acting different
03/02/2010 08:18:50 PM
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Hrm
03/02/2010 08:36:12 PM
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