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But it is a material artifact of a culture Larry Send a noteboard - 07/12/2009 12:47:45 AM
I'm just merely acknowledging that and that literature is one of several ways that people relate their hopes, fears, dreams, and aspirations (among other things) for others to interpret and to consider. If that is hubris...strange...



It is when you reduce it to the material conditions that I get a problem.


When I say "material culture," I'm not thinking of materialism in the same sense that a traditional Marxist would. I'm referring to it being a physical manifestation of societal concerns, goals, etc. Nothing more than that. I'm too religious to be a materialist, after all :P
Illusions fall like the husk of a fruit, one after another, and the fruit is experience. - Narrator, Sylvie

Je suis méchant.
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Since people are weighing in on that best fantasy list I posted, how many on this list have ya read? Larry - 06/12/2009 05:22:40 AM 2374 Views
A lot of those books aren't fantasy. Tom - 06/12/2009 05:34:18 AM 899 Views
Most of those depend upon how loosely one defines it Larry - 06/12/2009 06:41:50 AM 889 Views
Up next, fantasy fans attempt to co-opt Carl Sagan's Pale Blue Dot. *NM* Ghavrel - 06/12/2009 07:20:03 AM 311 Views
Actually, considering who put that list together, I'd at least look into their rationales Larry - 06/12/2009 07:42:11 AM 815 Views
Mmm... there's been a pronounced tendency among spec ficcers, from what I've seen, Ghavrel - 06/12/2009 09:09:26 AM 1070 Views
I agree Camilla - 06/12/2009 09:35:32 AM 804 Views
I'm a bit different than that Larry - 06/12/2009 09:20:09 PM 890 Views
Re: I'm a bit different than that Ghavrel - 07/12/2009 02:04:47 AM 919 Views
Then what should it be defined as? Larry - 07/12/2009 02:28:55 AM 959 Views
What, didn't you major in Fixing Up Confusions and other Issues? Ghavrel - 07/12/2009 02:49:30 AM 656 Views
I majored in raising more questions and doubting absolutes Larry - 07/12/2009 02:50:35 AM 777 Views
You majored in being a pain in the butt is what you majored in. Ghavrel - 07/12/2009 02:52:00 AM 830 Views
No, that was my second minor Larry - 07/12/2009 02:54:53 AM 730 Views
In that case, I trust my definition more than theirs. Ghavrel - 07/12/2009 03:05:32 AM 804 Views
Re: I majored in raising more questions and doubting absolutes The_Last_Gunslinger - 08/12/2009 10:59:03 PM 842 Views
Not really Larry - 08/12/2009 11:19:46 PM 1179 Views
Fantasy has no easy definition. Werthead - 07/12/2009 02:46:33 AM 860 Views
That's true. Ghavrel - 07/12/2009 02:50:37 AM 835 Views
But the Song of Soloman is certainly akin to that *NM* Larry - 07/12/2009 02:51:21 AM 285 Views
No, that's just porn. *NM* Ghavrel - 07/12/2009 02:52:24 AM 382 Views
If you redefine fatasy as fiction, the category loses its value Camilla - 06/12/2009 12:33:03 PM 839 Views
Remember what I studied for my grad degree Larry - 06/12/2009 04:10:08 PM 863 Views
Re: Remember what I studied for my grad degree Camilla - 06/12/2009 04:33:58 PM 888 Views
Really? Larry - 06/12/2009 09:22:21 PM 994 Views
Re: Really? Camilla - 06/12/2009 10:49:36 PM 939 Views
Literature does not exist in a vacuum Larry - 06/12/2009 10:53:58 PM 639 Views
Obviously I know that Camilla - 06/12/2009 11:30:55 PM 812 Views
But it is a material artifact of a culture Larry - 07/12/2009 12:47:45 AM 714 Views
But that is not all it is. Camilla - 07/12/2009 08:16:32 AM 914 Views
Indeed. A lot of them are science fiction. Werthead - 06/12/2009 04:32:26 PM 830 Views
Re: Indeed. A lot of them are science fiction. Camilla - 06/12/2009 05:01:55 PM 734 Views
Several dozen contributed to the suggestion list Larry - 06/12/2009 09:23:21 PM 671 Views
I've read 34. Legolas - 06/12/2009 10:53:38 AM 702 Views
Well, when individual preferences affect listings, such things happen, I guess Larry - 06/12/2009 09:24:39 PM 711 Views
78 that I have finished, but that is really not the point. Camilla - 06/12/2009 11:55:16 AM 854 Views
Definitions of "fantasy" vary considerably Larry - 06/12/2009 09:25:35 PM 804 Views
According to the one you just applied, my master's thesis was one... Camilla - 06/12/2009 10:47:25 PM 716 Views
It's just a state of mind, I suppose Larry - 07/12/2009 12:50:22 AM 823 Views
Re: It's just a state of mind, I suppose Camilla - 07/12/2009 08:17:09 AM 848 Views
I've read 28. Linda - 06/12/2009 03:42:40 PM 916 Views
89... but in general, that is many by the same author. jh - 06/12/2009 06:17:06 PM 704 Views
46. This is an idiotic list. A Confederacy of Dunces just IS NOT fantasy. Ghavrel - 06/12/2009 08:34:07 PM 932 Views
You say that, based on having read maybe 2% of the list? Larry - 06/12/2009 09:27:32 PM 634 Views
Jane Eyre? Napoleon62 - 07/12/2009 12:00:36 AM 784 Views
It plays upon the Gothic novel precepts Larry - 07/12/2009 12:51:31 AM 665 Views
Larry...come on...if it's Fantasy I have a bridge in Brooklyn for you to buy Tom - 07/12/2009 04:17:38 AM 834 Views
Devise a better? Larry - 07/12/2009 04:34:46 AM 749 Views
It would be much shorter Tom - 07/12/2009 02:20:05 PM 1020 Views
It should be shorter than some of the ones you listed Larry - 08/12/2009 11:26:35 PM 754 Views
Argh. Your quoting skills need work. *NM* Ghavrel - 09/12/2009 08:58:15 AM 391 Views
You seem to be misunderstanding Tom's post. Legolas - 09/12/2009 10:57:08 AM 770 Views
No,I was just just commenting on my likes/dislikes of that list Larry - 09/12/2009 01:21:45 PM 905 Views
I think you are misunderstanding again... jh - 09/12/2009 01:46:49 PM 870 Views
Yes. What Jonte said. *NM* Legolas - 09/12/2009 02:41:41 PM 420 Views
Oh,that Larry - 09/12/2009 06:07:11 PM 956 Views
Re: It should be shorter than some of the ones you listed Camilla - 21/12/2009 09:35:11 AM 1161 Views
I read it very recently. He masturbates to a dog. Fetishes != fantasy. Ghavrel - 07/12/2009 01:58:57 AM 681 Views
Like I said, it's been years for me Larry - 07/12/2009 02:30:58 AM 883 Views
No worries. That one just got me a little testy. Ghavrel - 07/12/2009 02:48:01 AM 775 Views
96... but so many books are missing that i can think of... i mean, really! temeraire - 07/12/2009 02:07:18 AM 748 Views
It's an interesting experiment of a list, miki, and I think it's little more than that Larry - 07/12/2009 02:29:56 AM 676 Views
I've read about 90 of them ranagrande - 18/12/2009 03:37:49 PM 1082 Views
It would be a more interesting list if it contained more books that fantasy fans would want to read random thoughts - 30/12/2009 06:35:18 PM 899 Views
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