There's a lot of ridiculous arguments here, but I'll focus on just one of them...
Legolas Send a noteboard - 11/08/2010 03:38:05 PM
Exactly. Given all the financial and legal benefits to such arrangements, it opens the door for massive amounts of fraud to cost people and the public. At least with such marriages for different sexes, there is a long-standing tradition backing up marriage that would curtail the freedom of such persons to participate in a normal relationship. With same-sex marriage, a piece of paper that creates a legal fiction of a partnership between two such people, there is no traditional or cultural impediment to each of them carrying on with the partner of his or her choice, and meanwhile transferring funds to avoid taxes, protecting coversations and transactions from testimony, gaining otherwise unauthorized residential or employment benefits and so on.
Considering that such an abuse of marriage is not a serious problem now (except perhaps in matters of immigration), it's rather unclear why it would become a problem in the future. After all, as you pointed out, everyone's allowed to get married as it is, including gay people, as long as it's to the opposite sex. So anyone who wants to get married for fraudulous purposes while carrying on with the partner of his or her choice, can do so as it is. And considering the relative rarity of homosexuality, and the amount of people who still have a problem with homosexuality, a fraudulous same-sex marriage would have the distinct disadvantage, compared to a fraudulous heterosexual marriage, of drawing attention. I'll give you points for originality, though, as I don't believe anyone's ever used the "but a mobster boss could marry his right-hand man so he can avoid having him witness against him!" argument to oppose same-sex marriage before...
And then there's the part where you mentioned "couples that will be deprived of the traditional benefits of marriage because the costs of extending them to same-sex "marriages" has forced them to be withdrawn". You do realize what kind of numbers we are talking about, yes? Gay people make up 5 to 10% of the population, and so far in the places where it's legal, gay couples are not getting married at a higher rate than straight couples or anything like that. As such, the increase in marriages and in people who are married and claim marriage benefits will be quite modest, certainly not of a kind to cause financial difficulties to those providing benefits to married couples.
Let's ban all Christian Marriage.
- 07/08/2010 06:36:13 AM
1714 Views
Nice satire, but it raises another point for me.
- 07/08/2010 07:20:49 AM
1098 Views
That would only be appropriate if Christians wanted to ban secular unions of normal people.
- 07/08/2010 11:51:29 AM
1361 Views
Hey, look! There was a point over there!
- 07/08/2010 03:46:41 PM
1178 Views
Who else should make those decisions?
- 07/08/2010 08:00:39 PM
1122 Views
I'd totally...
- 08/08/2010 04:14:15 AM
1047 Views
I'd totally...
- 08/08/2010 06:17:30 AM
1203 Views
I used to think Joel was the biggest rambler on this site. I am seriously reconsidering.
- 08/08/2010 05:24:56 AM
1146 Views
And my assessment of one poster as the most content-poor, non-contributing slug is unchanged
- 08/08/2010 07:17:02 PM
1035 Views
*Shakes Head*
- 08/08/2010 06:23:47 AM
1008 Views
I highly doubt Cannoli is "scared" of homosexuals *NM*
- 08/08/2010 06:29:54 AM
570 Views
Perhaps not in the physical sense.
- 08/08/2010 06:35:53 AM
1107 Views
Re: Perhaps not in the physical sense.
- 08/08/2010 06:46:56 AM
1064 Views
Re: *Shakes Head*
- 08/08/2010 07:43:11 PM
1053 Views
I still do not see how you think marriage is a "pointless" institution
- 08/08/2010 08:05:45 PM
1154 Views
No, I was referring to same-sex marriage. Real marriage hardly counts as a novelty. *NM*
- 11/08/2010 02:28:43 PM
476 Views
This must be the "thought out reaction" I've heard so much about.
- 08/08/2010 10:45:59 PM
996 Views
You cannot be that stupid.
- 11/08/2010 03:10:55 PM
1279 Views
There's a lot of ridiculous arguments here, but I'll focus on just one of them...
- 11/08/2010 03:38:05 PM
1199 Views
A lot of the arguments would seem to justify polygamy and incest too
- 08/08/2010 11:51:24 PM
1026 Views
Plolygamy and incest are not on the same level of bad.
- 09/08/2010 11:00:07 AM
1086 Views
Is that assumption valid?
- 09/08/2010 11:36:26 AM
1011 Views
Re: Is that assumption valid?
- 09/08/2010 11:46:42 AM
1001 Views
Re: Is that assumption valid?
- 09/08/2010 12:07:22 PM
1109 Views
Not really
- 09/08/2010 01:20:46 PM
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Re: Not really
- 09/08/2010 01:27:04 PM
1102 Views
Spoken like someone who does not have to insure an employee's six wives.
- 11/08/2010 03:11:57 PM
1141 Views
Re: A lot of the arguments would seem to justify polygamy and incest too
- 09/08/2010 11:25:39 AM
1045 Views
Re: A lot of the arguments would seem to justify polygamy and incest too
- 09/08/2010 11:51:50 AM
1008 Views
Re: A lot of the arguments would seem to justify polygamy and incest too
- 09/08/2010 01:18:35 PM
1102 Views
Re: A lot of the arguments would seem to justify polygamy and incest too
- 09/08/2010 02:54:19 PM
1121 Views
It should be noted again...
- 09/08/2010 08:59:32 PM
1129 Views
and how is it not a right?
- 09/08/2010 09:19:12 PM
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My definition of rights...
- 09/08/2010 10:47:16 PM
1130 Views
mmm, but the UN has legally stated marriage as a right.
- 10/08/2010 02:52:03 AM
893 Views
Article 16 probably not a great example
- 10/08/2010 03:44:04 AM
982 Views
- 10/08/2010 03:44:04 AM
982 Views
You could just as easily move the emphasis...
- 10/08/2010 04:08:46 AM
1130 Views
If we need a more specific resolution...
- 10/08/2010 04:22:12 AM
1315 Views
No, the choice of 'Men and Women' is too specific in the context
- 10/08/2010 05:25:57 AM
1008 Views
Re: No, the choice of 'Men and Women' is too specific in the context
- 10/08/2010 03:04:39 PM
1333 Views
That's really a ridiculous stance, you do realize.
- 10/08/2010 03:23:02 PM
943 Views
The point is that marriage IS a right, one which cannot be denied based upon sexual orientation *NM*
- 10/08/2010 07:04:16 PM
753 Views
Re: No, the choice of 'Men and Women' is too specific in the context
- 10/08/2010 03:46:56 PM
1181 Views
It doesn't say a man can only marry a woman or vice versa, though.
- 10/08/2010 04:24:17 AM
1005 Views
I know, and that's been brought up before. But that's not my point.
- 10/08/2010 06:09:32 PM
981 Views
Re: I know, and that's been brought up before. But that's not my point.
- 10/08/2010 06:33:56 PM
912 Views
It's mentioned as a right in some SC decision quoted in that Walker opinion. *NM*
- 10/08/2010 06:51:13 PM
488 Views
To clarify for you
- 10/08/2010 05:36:14 AM
981 Views
The UNSC is actually the UN's enforcement body...
- 10/08/2010 07:16:31 PM
1376 Views
I'm not sure that I would call the Security Council the 'Enforcement Body'
- 10/08/2010 08:43:02 PM
984 Views
The fact that it is capable of authorizing the use of military force makes it an enforcement body
- 10/08/2010 10:33:59 PM
1271 Views
What the UN thinks is *completely* worthless....
- 10/08/2010 06:43:15 PM
934 Views
Why don't YOU back up your assertion that the right to marry exists? *NM*
- 11/08/2010 03:16:02 PM
523 Views
The actual ruling on Prop 8 specifices marriage as a freedom, not a right.
- 10/08/2010 12:02:17 AM
1113 Views
Out of curiosity, what would you say to using the Ninth Amendment, possibly in conjunction...
- 10/08/2010 12:20:19 AM
1170 Views
Note it all you want...
- 10/08/2010 06:43:53 AM
862 Views
No, they seek to expand the terms of the partnership. Homosexuals can & do get married normally *NM*
- 11/08/2010 03:14:25 PM
557 Views
The best one yet.
- 10/08/2010 07:59:17 PM
1121 Views
Yeah, I'd agree that's pretty insane
- 10/08/2010 08:49:24 PM
979 Views
Re: Yeah, I'd agree that's pretty insane
- 10/08/2010 09:03:11 PM
1097 Views
Re: Yeah, I'd agree that's pretty insane
- 11/08/2010 04:35:03 PM
1000 Views
Re: Yeah, I'd agree that's pretty insane
- 11/08/2010 04:41:23 PM
1130 Views
Hmm - been a long time since I read my copy of the graphic novel
- 11/08/2010 05:06:47 PM
1102 Views
Re: Hmm - been a long time since I read my copy of the graphic novel
- 11/08/2010 05:09:23 PM
1054 Views
