Active Users:412 Time:05/03/2026 07:09:16 PM
Close Bramhodoulos Send a noteboard - 08/08/2011 05:41:46 PM
You're saying that, even though we can make predictions about how beneficial a trait is and study the results, there's no way to prove that our results were due to Natural Selection and not, say, the Invisible Nature Pixie or something like that? Because, regardless of the results, they can be explained by both hypotheses and therefore, no results could ever show that either of those hypotheses were wrong?


The only thing I would like to add is that you should either skip or change the phrase 'beneficial trait'.

If changed, I'd say 'a trait that is selected for'.

In some cases we can predict/suspect that certain traits will be selected for in nature, but those are usually isolated cases. In general it is impossible to make predictions.

Lets take the example 'size'. There are of cource many genes involved in determining the size of an individual, but cases are known where a small mutation can dramatically change the size of an individual. Darfism is a famous example, but there are more.

In any case, there are advantages to being big and there are advantages to being small. So a 'big' gene is not inherently 'beneficial', neither is a 'small' gene (leaving aside many disadvantages dwarfism causes aside from just a smaller size).
So a trait is only beneficial when placed in an organism, in a population, in an ecological system.

Hence there is basically no way of saying that a specific trait is beneficial. One can test a specific trait in a specific organism, population and ecological system and expect the results to replicate the next time a similar trait is introduced in the same way, but then it's still problematic to call it 'beneficial', because it is not inherently beneficial, but only 'preferably selected in the specific situation'.
Reply to message
Natural selection - 06/08/2011 03:51:26 PM 1234 Views
selection for suitability - 06/08/2011 04:18:51 PM 874 Views
Thanks for your responce - 06/08/2011 04:41:20 PM 993 Views
I can't speak for LadyLorraine and won't try, but here's how I see it: - 06/08/2011 06:49:49 PM 948 Views
Just a question - 06/08/2011 07:18:09 PM 957 Views
Yes it can - 06/08/2011 07:41:59 PM 797 Views
But how? - 06/08/2011 07:52:10 PM 1015 Views
Okay, I think I see what you're saying - 08/08/2011 05:30:43 PM 820 Views
Close - 08/08/2011 05:41:46 PM 1045 Views
Re: Just a question - 06/08/2011 07:49:21 PM 1044 Views
I'm not sure I understand you - 06/08/2011 08:20:44 PM 943 Views
All tautologies are truisms, but not all truisms are tautologies. - 06/08/2011 09:38:12 PM 985 Views
Then it is still a tautology - 06/08/2011 09:45:33 PM 995 Views
You can know it's beneifical to a particular individual, but it's harder to say for populations. - 06/08/2011 10:18:16 PM 1058 Views
Maybe... - 07/08/2011 01:55:54 PM 932 Views
As I understand it - 06/08/2011 06:04:44 PM 875 Views
Better... - 06/08/2011 06:36:38 PM 871 Views
Actually - 06/08/2011 10:13:51 PM 986 Views
Re: Actually - 06/08/2011 10:37:33 PM 1122 Views
Re: Actually - 06/08/2011 11:38:52 PM 1035 Views
Oeh - 07/08/2011 01:54:19 PM 870 Views
Hmmm... there's some truth to that - 06/08/2011 06:36:35 PM 960 Views
Re: Hmmm... there's some truth to that - 06/08/2011 07:08:25 PM 957 Views
Re: Hmmm... there's some truth to that - 07/08/2011 12:46:23 AM 944 Views
The complexity of the problem makes it all but impossible to falsify... - 06/08/2011 08:26:06 PM 968 Views
The questions go deeper - 06/08/2011 08:38:31 PM 1001 Views
Re: The questions go deeper - 06/08/2011 09:10:32 PM 980 Views
I think I know why you don't understand my question. - 06/08/2011 09:38:41 PM 1009 Views
TalkOrigins addresses this at length. - 06/08/2011 11:14:52 PM 1034 Views
Not very much, but interesting none the less - 06/08/2011 11:38:36 PM 1044 Views
Re: Natural selection - 07/08/2011 03:00:30 AM 976 Views
Thanks a lot - 07/08/2011 01:38:39 PM 1108 Views
2 things - 07/08/2011 04:00:35 PM 853 Views
Re: 2 things - 07/08/2011 04:33:00 PM 1080 Views
Re: 2 things - 07/08/2011 05:48:26 PM 905 Views
My best guess - 07/08/2011 06:00:28 PM 963 Views
Re: My best guess - 07/08/2011 06:37:58 PM 879 Views
Re: My best guess - 07/08/2011 06:47:26 PM 1030 Views
Re: My best guess - 07/08/2011 07:02:27 PM 908 Views
Re: My best guess - 07/08/2011 09:09:57 PM 1002 Views

Reply to Message