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That's not an accurate definition of 'the MeToo mindset'. Legolas Send a noteboard - 16/10/2018 08:24:22 PM

There is of course a range of opinions, and no doubt you may find some people who are upset enough about the prevalence of sexual assault and rape that they embrace strong rhetoric about, basically, assuming the accused party to be guilty until proven innocent. But it's still a very big step from such rhetoric to actually supporting the use of such standards in the criminal justice system, which would be blatantly illegal and unacceptable by the standards of the US or any other western nation.

However, I think I'm right in saying that for most people who embrace MeToo or BelieveAllWomen, the first priority is actually to change the way the accuser herself is treated in so many cases. Making sure that her complaint is taken seriously, that she is treated with respect and given a chance to talk about her experiences, knowing that memories from years ago are bound to be imperfect on some of the details. Hearing her out with an open mind and without trying to disprove the accusation the second some apparent discrepancy appears. In some cases, depending on who the accusations are against and how much media attention they get, protecting her from the waves of online abuse, trolling, doxxing, death threats that will inevitably follow.

None of those things would increase the risk of convicting someone who is wrongfully accused, since that requires actual proof. Sure, a person who is wrongfully accused would still suffer damage to their reputation, but then they could sue for libel or slander, if the accusation turns out in hindsight to have been intentionally false. Even so, I agree they might suffer permanent negative consequences in their social life, but then, so would the people falsely accused of any other crime who are found innocent - and, of course, the people who make accusations of sexual assault or rape that are widely disbelieved.

In the end it becomes a numbers game, what the greater risk is. If you somehow believe that the majority of sexual assault or rape accusations are plain false or wildly exaggerated, then it's normal enough that you are more concerned with the rights of the falsely accused than with ensuring that accusers are listened to in good faith. But all the evidence points the other way - that only a small minority of actual guilty people are convicted in the end, while intentionally false accusations are rare (though inevitably given a lot of attention whenever they occur).


Edit: Wanted to add that obviously it would often be impossible to prove that an accusation was intentionally false and made with malicious intent - but there, too, the principle of innocent unless proven guilty should apply, right? And since you are concerned not only with legal guilt and its legal consequences, but also with the judgements in the court of public opinion, perhaps you should also make sure not to assume that accusations are intentionally and maliciously false unless that's proven to be the case, and to persuade others to do likewise?

This message last edited by Legolas on 16/10/2018 at 10:06:21 PM
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#BelieveAllWomen - 16/10/2018 11:02:04 AM 1245 Views
I read something the other day... - 16/10/2018 07:07:29 PM 673 Views
That's not an accurate definition of 'the MeToo mindset'. - 16/10/2018 08:24:22 PM 642 Views
Most of what you are speaking of I agree with.... - 16/10/2018 10:17:09 PM 588 Views
Really? I see mostly disagreements here. Including one big one I want to focus on. - 17/10/2018 12:21:38 AM 519 Views
And I smell bullshit - 18/10/2018 12:52:40 AM 497 Views
Healing from Trauma and Such - 18/10/2018 10:23:02 PM 479 Views
you can have #believeher and say that it wasn't this about - 17/10/2018 03:30:10 AM 870 Views
You can dismiss any movement by focusing only on its extreme members or manifestations. - 18/10/2018 11:30:02 PM 520 Views
When their radical beliefs are treated as mainstream then you can and should judge them - 19/10/2018 03:36:35 PM 492 Views
So... - 19/10/2018 04:48:05 PM 488 Views
Death Penalty? - 19/10/2018 05:38:10 PM 526 Views
Re: Death Penalty? - 19/10/2018 07:18:59 PM 490 Views
So then why did you use the words "Death Penalty"? - 19/10/2018 08:50:45 PM 539 Views
Re: So then why did you use the words "Death Penalty"? - 19/10/2018 11:11:07 PM 488 Views
You are mistaken - 20/10/2018 08:46:33 PM 640 Views
So ... - 20/10/2018 08:17:19 PM 531 Views
There are also the smaller things - 17/10/2018 05:31:55 AM 686 Views
You seem pretty disingenuous here - 17/10/2018 11:08:27 PM 531 Views
If you truly want to understand any of this, read up on intersectionality. *NM* - 17/10/2018 05:48:49 PM 253 Views
I don't have to. It's a bullshit Victocrat Peerage system - 18/10/2018 05:09:46 AM 504 Views
Oh please... - 19/10/2018 05:05:10 PM 520 Views
It's 2018, friend - 18/10/2018 02:43:04 PM 551 Views
If only... - 19/10/2018 05:07:48 PM 528 Views
yeah... okay. - 19/10/2018 06:08:34 PM 695 Views
HAHAHAHA! Intersectionality is such a load of bullshit! *NM* - 19/10/2018 07:34:12 PM 267 Views
No. *NM* - 22/10/2018 07:36:38 PM 257 Views
Let's not and say we didn't. *NM* - 22/10/2018 03:22:37 PM 241 Views
Mean girls falsely accuse teenager of sexual assault because they "Just don't like him" - 17/10/2018 08:34:23 PM 660 Views
Yeah I read about this today. - 18/10/2018 12:35:41 AM 488 Views
The sadder thing is even if we does win a fortune in the suit - 20/10/2018 02:57:13 AM 645 Views
if a group of girls did this to my son... - 20/10/2018 03:33:43 AM 501 Views
Interesting... - 20/10/2018 04:35:07 PM 521 Views
If she had told her father when it happened - which she didn’t - 20/10/2018 09:54:50 PM 702 Views

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