Active Users:244 Time:28/03/2024 05:53:14 PM
There are so many (partial)-solutions and no single one is going to solve it. Roland00 Send a noteboard - 26/05/2022 09:03:10 PM

View original post

For example why those 3 cities? Why not other cities?


Why not those three cities? I picked three cities at random from what I remember hearing in the news; your other examples are a great illustration of my point: none of those other cities are experiencing murder on a great scale with AR-15s. It's just more proof to my central thesis: selective outrage. Certain political groups freak out when 22 kids are murdered with an AR-15 style rifle, but they don't care about the children killed or maimed daily by handguns, in ALL of those cities you mentioned. So thanks!



And there are about 50 different ways we can reduce gun deaths on the margins. Stuff involving guns but also stuff like locating more hospitals that treat gun related injuries at the sites and cities of high amount of gun deaths.

Please don't tell me your solution to gun violence is to build more hospitals in high gun crime areas? Good point actually, tons of doctors and nurses with expensive cars and high net worth in areas that are flush with violent gun crime; I can't possibly see what would go wrong with that idea.



In sum these conversations are never fruitful, never satisfying, never provide Catharsis with the releasing of tension. For we are talking about inside and outside, with things that penetrate the inside and that is inherently full of tension.

I'm not saying remove emotion from the debate, but hyperbole, which is an entirely different concept.

I'm also saying to address the root cause of so many violent gun deaths: gangs, drugs, cartels and criminals. There will always, always be the lone wolf mass shooter we can't stop. That is something as a society we have to accept.

What we don't have to accept is the daily gun violence and children murdered by criminals and gangs that could be prevented.


I already explained why with the whole overdetermination thing. Instead solving it is to circle around it many times and each small thing chipping away at things.

------

We really do not know how many guns are being sold in the year due to it being illegal to research and track it due to federal law. That said the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives thinks about 11.3 million guns per year were made and sold to consumers in the United States. Note this is only domestic production and consumption, we / the United States also import several millions gun a year for consumer use. I can provide statistics from other sources but I am do not want to mix and match statistics from different sources for they use different methodologies but it is in the several million.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/17/us/politics/gun-manufacturing-atf.html

Lots of graphs for what we are talking about with breakdown for types of guns
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/report/2021-firearms-commerce-report/download

Now how many American guns being made for American commercial use was about 3.9 million in 2000 vs 11.3 million in 2020. I picked that year for it is a nice 20 year number but also it is the year after Columbine. We have almost triple the amount of new guns per year (it is 2.9x the amount) and I do not feel any safer.

And do not twist my words with providing those stats I just provided. Yes we have more guns on the streets and I do not have a magical fix that can fix them and just removing them from the streets is not going to fix the problem. But when you increase the number of guns you do not just increase crime you also increase all other forms of gun deaths such as accidental family member deaths, suicides', domestic violence that is deadly and non deadly, etc. I am signifying we tripled the amount of guns being bought per year to signify we have a big problem and it seems to be getting worse not better.

(note from other sources we think the 2021 gun sales are similar to the 2020 gun sales, though a small decrease compared to 2020 but still much higher than 2019.)

-----

As for me being mad about all the other types of gun deaths, I am frickin mad about them too but me voicing it will not change anything even if I am infuriated by them. Ones heart can break only so many times that one does not even voice the fury. But one should not turn to nihlism.

If you want to hear my thoughts on the matter (not my voice but he is a casual friend of mine) then listen to Pat Blanchfield talk about Guns almost 3 years ago on this podcast.

https://player.fm/series/know-your-enemy/gunpower-w-patrick-blanchfield

(and yes Pat's book they mentioned still has not come out, he has rewritten it and the world kind sucks right now)

Reply to message
If no one else wants to open this can of worms, I guess I’ll have to do it - 26/05/2022 02:07:18 AM 874 Views
Unfortunately, there's not much to say. - 26/05/2022 04:26:10 PM 186 Views
You are not going to get a non emotional discussion about guns, it will never ever be rational - 26/05/2022 08:04:55 PM 149 Views
Re: You are not going to get a non emotional discussion about guns, it will never ever be rational - 26/05/2022 08:36:34 PM 165 Views
There are so many (partial)-solutions and no single one is going to solve it. - 26/05/2022 09:03:10 PM 148 Views
Unfortunately every time there is a mass shooting, gun sales spike. - 26/05/2022 09:26:09 PM 182 Views
Yes - 26/05/2022 09:55:14 PM 150 Views
Re: There are so many (partial)-solutions and no single one is going to solve it. - 26/05/2022 09:56:23 PM 160 Views
You understand two things can both be true, right? - 26/05/2022 10:19:56 PM 163 Views
In such a way - 26/05/2022 10:27:52 PM 160 Views
What Mookie said, Sense and Sensibility with Perspective - 26/05/2022 10:29:04 PM 148 Views
Oh yes, everyone is to blame, and hence no one - 26/05/2022 04:58:37 PM 173 Views
You obviously don't know anything about Canada's gun laws. - 26/05/2022 05:20:25 PM 167 Views
Remarkable - 27/05/2022 03:55:54 AM 162 Views
4% PAL acquisition is, in essence, a ban. - 27/05/2022 04:13:45 AM 154 Views
Well, that was a load of chickenshit - 27/05/2022 05:08:29 AM 154 Views
He said, running away. - 27/05/2022 11:34:19 AM 155 Views
He said, running away. - 27/05/2022 11:34:20 AM 147 Views
You are the RAFO poster child for inability to hold a rational discussion that includes disagreement - 26/05/2022 06:50:11 PM 175 Views
No, we're just disagreeing on what is rational, that is all... - 27/05/2022 03:42:23 AM 157 Views
You just don’t get it. - 27/05/2022 04:22:55 AM 182 Views
I think the same of you... - 27/05/2022 05:05:43 AM 171 Views
Article VI, Clause II - 27/05/2022 05:17:40 AM 159 Views
You're like a broken record. - 27/05/2022 05:23:52 AM 161 Views
Bro you literally come from a country that plays nuclear chicken with Pakistan. - 27/05/2022 11:40:07 AM 164 Views
And? - 27/05/2022 02:24:09 PM 161 Views
Lol Parody account confirmed. - 27/05/2022 04:04:56 PM 153 Views
Your repertoire of insults needs expansion. Keep trying. - 27/05/2022 04:27:35 PM 153 Views
He said, not coming up with any retort of his own. - 27/05/2022 09:58:30 PM 148 Views
whooops *NM* - 27/05/2022 09:58:03 PM 107 Views
Oh, fuck off. - 27/05/2022 06:21:45 PM 175 Views
Why is liking the Constitution a binary thing? - 27/05/2022 08:36:12 PM 149 Views
As you point out, it isn’t binary at all. - 27/05/2022 09:16:18 PM 169 Views
*NM* - 27/05/2022 09:55:28 PM 105 Views
It is not - 28/05/2022 07:19:32 AM 152 Views
Re: Oh, fuck off. - 28/05/2022 06:53:38 AM 157 Views
That's a lot of words to say absolutely nothing. - 28/05/2022 06:56:05 PM 160 Views
When you shut your eyes, of course you can only see nothing - 28/05/2022 09:43:13 PM 153 Views
A dead child for freedom is the choice made every abortion. - 30/05/2022 08:16:18 PM 149 Views
Oh really? Then explain to me... - 31/05/2022 08:41:09 PM 154 Views
That baby isn't a baby, but that man is a woman - 01/06/2022 01:57:40 AM 145 Views
How would the world be different - 26/05/2022 07:03:22 PM 149 Views
Yes and if my aunt had balls she would be my uncle - 26/05/2022 07:14:08 PM 140 Views
I do not believe the original thread was made with curiosity or charity in mind. - 26/05/2022 07:24:20 PM 141 Views
Well isn’t this the pot calling the kettle black. - 26/05/2022 07:33:12 PM 131 Views
Well it is about respectability politics you see - 26/05/2022 07:38:59 PM 159 Views
You're one of those men. - 26/05/2022 08:27:53 PM 152 Views
Hypocrisy - 26/05/2022 08:42:17 PM 130 Views
I don't know whether English is your first language - 26/05/2022 10:00:04 PM 139 Views
Your attempt at mind reading is an abject failure. - 26/05/2022 07:58:07 PM 134 Views
You started with Foreclosure - 26/05/2022 08:08:36 PM 127 Views
Foreclosure, huh - 26/05/2022 08:48:50 PM 135 Views
My advice is listen to the podcast I linked Dragonsoul *NM* - 26/05/2022 09:05:13 PM 76 Views
One more thing - 26/05/2022 07:25:22 PM 139 Views
And I guess this post proves my point, lol. - 26/05/2022 07:34:48 PM 139 Views
Did I trigger you? - 26/05/2022 07:50:02 PM 124 Views
Never owned a gun, but I support gun rights. But... - 27/05/2022 02:51:26 AM 156 Views
I pretty much agree. - 27/05/2022 03:18:38 AM 166 Views
Yep, what Tyr said *NM* - 27/05/2022 03:27:33 AM 79 Views
The NY Yankees are now tweeting about guns. - 27/05/2022 03:26:45 AM 134 Views
Bah - 27/05/2022 04:25:25 AM 138 Views
Baseball twitter is bad - 27/05/2022 04:29:15 AM 130 Views
UPDATE on the shooter, Salvador Ramos - 27/05/2022 03:27:59 PM 157 Views
Can't be more of a disgrace than waiting an hour to go in and kill him. - 27/05/2022 04:05:58 PM 139 Views
Re: Can't be more of a disgrace than waiting an hour to go in and kill him. - 27/05/2022 04:15:22 PM 148 Views
I disagree. - 27/05/2022 10:02:23 PM 132 Views
It's funny how the left thinks only cops should have guns, but also ACAB. - 27/05/2022 06:15:23 PM 146 Views
They already lost their balls. - 27/05/2022 06:52:52 PM 142 Views
I am glad you protect your family - 27/05/2022 08:46:05 PM 129 Views
But see, this is why the death of community and religion is bad for America. - 27/05/2022 10:12:49 PM 141 Views
Charles Whitman took his rifles to the tower at UT Austin in 1966 and killed 14 random people. - 27/05/2022 10:21:42 PM 146 Views
And in May 1928, a maniac bombed a school in Michigan, killing 44. - 27/05/2022 11:46:34 PM 131 Views
I think the presence of visual imagery provides a mimetic response - 27/05/2022 11:52:32 PM 139 Views
Reasonable, but even then, that's merely another condemnation for the modern world. - 28/05/2022 12:06:30 AM 146 Views
I agree - 28/05/2022 12:56:10 AM 140 Views
I haven't said "bAn GuNs!1" - 27/05/2022 11:33:43 PM 140 Views
This is taken from the late Justice Scalia’s majority opinion in 2008’s DC vs. Heller - 27/05/2022 11:50:40 PM 143 Views
Please do not relitigate Heller with me - 27/05/2022 11:59:21 PM 144 Views
I wasn’t and will not. - 28/05/2022 01:01:59 AM 140 Views
We would scare them off that is what - 28/05/2022 01:43:11 AM 134 Views
You chose wisely - 28/05/2022 02:59:47 AM 149 Views
You did not. My apologies. - 28/05/2022 12:03:43 AM 139 Views
Why not 'harden' all schools and kindergartens with armed guards ? - 30/05/2022 03:40:06 PM 139 Views
You're completely right and I hate it. - 30/05/2022 08:24:29 PM 125 Views
Another podcast I enjoyed - 27/05/2022 08:26:56 PM 137 Views
This thread is reminiscint of the classic Wotmania debates from the aughts. - 29/05/2022 12:22:47 AM 161 Views
Nobody would like my idea, but personally, I think Korea's 2 year mandatory service would do us good - 30/05/2022 08:30:37 PM 127 Views
Yep there is zero chance that will happen. - 31/05/2022 10:32:06 PM 135 Views
Interesting - 31/05/2022 10:56:53 PM 147 Views
Re: Yep there is zero chance that will happen. - 01/06/2022 01:50:37 AM 131 Views
Believe it or not I am not always a Grump - 01/06/2022 03:38:16 AM 143 Views
Hot damn, Moolin Rouge was fantastic! *NM* - 01/06/2022 09:36:04 PM 132 Views
What about trans-men - 31/05/2022 10:07:21 PM 151 Views
an intriguing question - 31/05/2022 10:34:39 PM 157 Views
It's all tongue-in-cheek, and isn't that dumb? - 01/06/2022 02:01:04 AM 138 Views
Can the 21 year olds - 01/06/2022 03:44:08 AM 145 Views
Something tells me this won't factor in anyone's favor... - 01/06/2022 09:08:31 PM 153 Views
Wait, the *late* conservative Justice Alito? - 01/06/2022 03:56:19 PM 140 Views
my bad - 01/06/2022 05:09:22 PM 141 Views
Until the existing gun laws are actually enforced, I am not willing to entertain any new ones - 09/06/2022 09:55:41 PM 168 Views
Oh yeah, and I am sick of the hyperbolic gaslighting by both sides - 09/06/2022 10:02:25 PM 167 Views
Anarchy, the State, and UTOPIA ! - 10/06/2022 08:25:05 PM 138 Views
It gets darker and darker - 22/06/2022 02:10:08 AM 139 Views
It's so bad dude. So bad. Those poor souls... *NM* - 30/06/2022 05:04:56 PM 81 Views

Reply to Message