Active Users:333 Time:17/06/2025 05:18:48 PM
I don't really agree... lilltempest Send a noteboard - 06/09/2009 03:50:08 AM
Rand asks Lews Therin, "Why did you remake the prison with a flaw?" and Lews Therin basically replies that the female Aes Sedai condemned his plan and wouldn't go along with it, and tries to blame them but then goes off on one of his Ilyena tangents.

I think this is massively significant. Ever since the world book came out, there seems to have been this assumption that the information in it was known to Rand and co, since the world book was apparently a historical text written in Rand's time. However this turns out not to be the case. Rand has no idea about the Fateful Concord, Latra Posae Decume or the split in the Hall of the Servants that led Lews Therin to take only men to attack Shayol Ghul.

This to me confirms that the 'flaw' in the prison is because the prison was made out of the combined, full might of the One Power: saidin and saidar together. And saidin by itself could not repair the Bore, only tighten it closed and give the Dark One the chance to eventually break through again (and taint saidin at the same time), albeit not for 3500 years.

So that gives us the answer to the entire situation: Rand cannot re-seal the Dark One's prison by himself, not without re-tainting saidin. He needs to take female channelers with him when he does the Assault on Shayol Ghul II or it's game over. And if the women try to do it solo, saidar will be tainted next time.


I really don't think that's the flaw. I think the flaw is that LTT put band-aids over the Bore instead of truly repairing it. Seals made from both sides of the Power would have had the same problem - the Bore would still exist, it would just be patched. For the Wheel to come full circle, the Bore has to cease to exist at some point and I think the end of the Third Age is that point.

If there was anything useful from LTT's rantings about Latra Posae's refusal to help LTT with his plan, then IMO it is that Rand needs to work with women channelers to achieve his ends instead of things being like they were between the men and women in the AoL. Not all of them (he doesn't need the whole Tower following him and doesn't need to bend knee to them either), but he does need their help. The thing is, he has it in the form of Cadsuane, Nynaeve, Alivia, and the Aes Sedai who have sworn to him. They are the ones who can help him, not LTT. LTT likely has no idea why the seals didn't work properly and is too insane to be of much use in figuring it out. What Fel told Rand is of far more use but he needs to get the input of others to help him figure out the riddle instead of asking an insane man for guidance.

The more I think about LTT and Latra Posae, the more I see a reflection of the Rand/Egwene relationship - the two of them were apparently adversaries and thought the other one was an arrogant jerk. They each thought they knew best and it was LTT who finally relented and went with LP's plan, but when Latra's plan failed because of the CK being taken by Forsaken, she still refused to compromise. LTT, at that point, was convinced his way was the only way (as LP believed hers was the only way) and since he believed time was running out he moved ahead with no help from the women because LP convinced all the women to refuse to help him.

Thankfully, this time the Pattern has interfered and given the Dragon some female channelers who want to help him (Caddy, Nyn, Alivia, etc.) and who will help him even if this age's Latra Posae (Egwene) doesn't like it because she thinks she should be dictating all of his actions. It would be in Rand's best interest to accept help from the women he has with him and forget Egwene. Let her deal with her own mess.

As for sealing the Bore, he needs to forget the seals (I think him trying to do a repeat of LTT's plan with both sides of the Power would end in complete and utter disaster) and find the meaning behind Fel's words. When he thinks to himself that he needs to get to TG before there's nothing left of him to kill, he's right. He needs to forget trying to bring peace to the world (peace he admits won't hold because no one seems to want it) and get on with what he needs to do. He has what he needs in the Aes Sedai with him, Alivia, the Asha'man, Mat's army, and Bashere and his army. Everyone else can either follow his lead, and stop bickering like a bunch of children, or they can die at the hands of the Shadow.
Reply to message
Your thoughts on TGS - Chapter 1 - 05/09/2009 05:23:47 PM 6038 Views
For all of those whining about it not sounding like RJ: - 05/09/2009 05:47:07 PM 1927 Views
Agreed. If anything, it's a tribute to RJ - 05/09/2009 06:17:36 PM 1772 Views
You're forgetting one thing. - 06/09/2009 12:13:03 AM 1914 Views
And if he were to off Egwene? What would your opinion be? *NM* - 07/09/2009 05:38:36 AM 941 Views
He dislikes Sanderson's prose. Plot content is irrelevant here. *NM* - 08/09/2009 06:44:42 PM 1036 Views
Who cares? That would have been RJs decision anyway. - 09/09/2009 06:15:16 AM 1542 Views
not impressed - 05/09/2009 06:24:02 PM 1905 Views
all recap, no meat - 14/09/2009 12:33:35 PM 1538 Views
Pretty good. - 05/09/2009 07:35:41 PM 45314 Views
Re: Pretty good. - 05/09/2009 09:13:44 PM 1820 Views
Re: Pretty good. - 06/09/2009 01:19:22 AM 2117 Views
Re: Pretty good. - 06/09/2009 08:08:38 AM 1761 Views
Re: Pretty good. - 13/09/2009 01:22:22 PM 1493 Views
I found it well-written, but rather uninteresting story-wise *NM* - 05/09/2009 08:04:15 PM 1029 Views
because there should totaly be massive plot development in the first chapter - 05/09/2009 08:29:18 PM 1649 Views
I'm tired of passive story telling. - 05/09/2009 08:57:13 PM 1605 Views
On the other hand... - 05/09/2009 08:58:21 PM 1655 Views
Re: I'm tired of passive story telling. - 05/09/2009 10:42:57 PM 1546 Views
Which escape? - 05/09/2009 11:10:01 PM 1570 Views
I'm tired of mindless readers - 06/09/2009 01:54:14 AM 1685 Views
Re: I'm tired of mindless readers - 06/09/2009 04:01:56 AM 1841 Views
Your best yet Dom! *NM* - 06/09/2009 02:04:40 PM 983 Views
Re: I'm tired of mindless readers - 07/09/2009 04:39:36 AM 1556 Views
Re: I'm tired of mindless readers - 07/09/2009 10:42:29 PM 1545 Views
I was over critical. - 06/09/2009 04:56:48 AM 1482 Views
It's been happening since Book IV btw. - 16/09/2009 05:30:52 PM 1343 Views
A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 05/09/2009 09:34:44 PM 1738 Views
I think Lews Therin's comments to Rand were the most hugely significant part of the chapter. - 06/09/2009 01:15:05 AM 1514 Views
I don't really agree... - 06/09/2009 03:50:08 AM 1493 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 06/09/2009 02:52:47 AM 2152 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 06/09/2009 07:08:08 AM 1477 Views
Just answer one question... - 06/09/2009 07:53:12 AM 1972 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 06/09/2009 10:31:20 AM 2008 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 08/09/2009 10:19:13 PM 1525 Views
If I may make a few somewhat irrelevant interjections... - 09/09/2009 04:44:45 AM 1439 Views
Re: If I may make a few somewhat irrelevant interjections... - 14/09/2009 04:46:29 PM 1597 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 10/09/2009 06:20:56 AM 1753 Views
On Egwene... - 10/09/2009 04:33:58 PM 1493 Views
Nynaeve - 08/09/2009 05:43:43 AM 1601 Views
Re: Nynaeve - 08/09/2009 08:06:20 AM 1433 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 07/09/2009 04:41:47 AM 1592 Views
Answers, short, long and longer. - 07/09/2009 11:27:53 PM 1516 Views
I think you missed some things. (spoilers) - 16/09/2009 05:21:43 PM 1282 Views
People who still have their wotmania SNs draw mine.... - 21/09/2009 05:25:15 PM 1357 Views
Good post, but I have an alternative explanation for the saidin barrier - 28/09/2009 12:53:41 AM 1329 Views
First thought...a typo! ner vous = nervous. *NM* - 05/09/2009 09:55:28 PM 973 Views
I loved it! - 05/09/2009 10:52:17 PM 1587 Views
I didn't like the opening sequence. - 05/09/2009 10:58:17 PM 1606 Views
Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 06/09/2009 12:02:13 AM 1546 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 06/09/2009 12:44:11 AM 1601 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 07/09/2009 09:08:21 AM 1505 Views
This is what RJ said. - 06/09/2009 12:47:26 AM 1528 Views
Re: This is what RJ said. - 06/09/2009 01:24:36 AM 1537 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 06/09/2009 05:12:25 PM 1405 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 06/09/2009 07:20:45 PM 1397 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 07/09/2009 04:05:09 AM 1432 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 07/09/2009 09:33:25 AM 1425 Views
I found it...interesting --spoilers-- - 06/09/2009 01:33:11 AM 1727 Views
Re: I found it...interesting --spoilers-- - 06/09/2009 01:42:07 AM 1596 Views
Re: I found it...interesting --spoilers-- - 06/09/2009 02:54:17 PM 1621 Views
I'm excited. (Here be spoilers) - 06/09/2009 03:29:59 AM 1479 Views
six questions and nine statements - 06/09/2009 04:47:52 AM 1550 Views
Re: Your thoughts on TGS - Chapter 1 - 06/09/2009 04:51:04 AM 1499 Views
Re: Your thoughts on TGS - Chapter 1 - 06/09/2009 07:30:53 AM 1602 Views
I liked it - 06/09/2009 07:58:09 AM 1506 Views
Some questions... - 06/09/2009 08:04:30 AM 1529 Views
Re: Some questions... - 06/09/2009 08:11:08 AM 1594 Views
Re: Some questions... - 06/09/2009 08:53:20 AM 1515 Views
Re: I liked it - 06/09/2009 09:55:41 PM 1514 Views
Theory: Rand and Egwene. What is up? - 06/09/2009 07:59:58 AM 2406 Views
Also - 06/09/2009 08:24:45 AM 1531 Views
A simpler answer - 06/09/2009 03:04:04 PM 1589 Views
Really? - 06/09/2009 03:38:59 PM 1456 Views
are we already at the location of the book cover? - 06/09/2009 11:49:06 AM 1486 Views
Re: are we already at the location of the book cover? - 06/09/2009 02:43:24 PM 1496 Views
I still think it's Aviendha - 07/09/2009 05:14:50 AM 1328 Views
Omniscient narrator not neutral enough, for one... - 06/09/2009 04:17:51 PM 1650 Views
Yip - 06/09/2009 04:29:40 PM 1575 Views
Yes... - 06/09/2009 04:39:00 PM 1450 Views
I totally agree...the narration was the biggest put-off for me - 09/09/2009 09:51:52 PM 1335 Views
Two Things - 07/09/2009 12:25:31 AM 1558 Views
Moiraine - 07/09/2009 01:19:08 AM 1629 Views
The Moiraine thing is dumb - 09/09/2009 09:53:51 PM 1499 Views
She fell through the doorway with Lanfear - 09/09/2009 10:18:55 PM 1440 Views
uh - 09/09/2009 10:57:17 PM 1490 Views
Timeline? - 07/09/2009 05:10:16 AM 1477 Views
Re: Timeline? - 07/09/2009 05:52:50 PM 1472 Views
So what chapter symbol is it going to have? *NM* - 07/09/2009 08:09:54 AM 888 Views
the dragon in COT chap 23 ornaments *NM* - 07/09/2009 01:28:58 PM 899 Views
The Seanchan are up to something - 07/09/2009 10:26:23 AM 1475 Views
Red stone doorway. - 07/09/2009 03:27:22 PM 1404 Views
The whole thing was explained by Rand in KoD. So no, not new. - 07/09/2009 06:35:01 PM 1409 Views
No - 07/09/2009 07:57:57 PM 1402 Views
Questions, Comments Thoughts and Theories about tGS - 07/09/2009 09:09:05 PM 1526 Views
My thoughts are that the main page is being crowded by too many duplicate threads - 07/09/2009 10:23:41 PM 1494 Views
Hrm... - 08/09/2009 05:28:19 AM 1567 Views
Enjoyed it - 08/09/2009 01:35:03 AM 1470 Views
Ready for More - 08/09/2009 04:25:19 PM 1531 Views
... - 08/09/2009 07:24:46 PM 1453 Views
Not sure what I expected, but not this... - 09/09/2009 04:07:10 PM 1512 Views
I know why Rand is mad at Egwene...read inside to find out - 11/09/2009 03:15:00 AM 1554 Views
It's his increasing paranoia and dehumanization. - 15/09/2009 03:03:53 AM 1472 Views
Re: Your thoughts on TGS - Chapter 1 - 16/09/2009 06:20:14 AM 1290 Views
Semirhage isn't scaring anyone - 28/09/2009 02:32:34 PM 1792 Views
Indeed... - 28/09/2009 03:36:55 PM 1400 Views
Will the Chosen pass that edict down or just not act themselves? - 28/09/2009 10:29:53 PM 1367 Views

Reply to Message