Active Users:2625 Time:03/05/2026 01:13:27 AM
Look at what he has seen... Cannoli Send a noteboard - 06/09/2009 11:45:44 PM
Rand is crazy, or to be more accurate, becoming psychotic. Psychotic people do and say illogical things. I personally think that this statement is simply an extreme example of the extent of Rand's paranoia and psychosis.

NaCl(if you are psychotic there don't have to be real reasons)H2O +<img class=' />

Not real reasons you or me can understand, perhaps, but withing Rand's mind, at least, there has to be some kind of justification. From outside, Rand's actions do point to madness, but notice that from his PoV, there's a logical reason for all her does. His rant against Egwene flies on the face of that.


It is consistent with everything she has seen, always taking the side of the Salidar faction, refusing to give him information they want kept secret, attempting to manipulate him against Salidar's enemies while plainly respecting those enemy sisters more than him, and suggesting they are on his side when his own experience reveals absolutely nothing of the kind. The Tower's betrayal of him might have been a more egregious violation, but the Salidar embassy has more offenses to their credit. They immediately took a woman who had violated and assaulted him into their confidence, belligerantly and unjustifiably confronted him in defiance of any reasonable expectations of an embassy to a ruler, and then ignored his requirements for contacting him again, while attempting to assert their dominance at Dumai's Wells. Even after swearing fealty to him, they showed more sympathy and loyalty to his captive tormentors, and attempted to take charge of his affairs while obeying him only with the greatest reluctance. And these are the people Egwene is not only loyal to, but has chosen to lead (and the reputation affects the leader more than the group - will Elayne & Egwene think better of the Children of the Light for being under Galad or will they think worse of him for taking command of them? ), suborning his most trusted general to her purpose (no one thinks Tenobia will be happy about her uncle & top general serving the Dragon Reborn, so why should anyone expect Rand to be sanguine about Mat serving the Aes Sedai? ), and inducing the sister he trusts above all others to encourage him to go to Egwene.

From there he has sent Narishma & Merise with his offer of bonding the Asha'man, and Egwene never even received them, leaving them for her flunkies to handle. How would Egwene take it if she sent a personal embassy to Rand, asking after him, and he never saw them, but left them to be heard by Mazrim Taim & the Illian Council of Nine? And of course, Narishma has reported that a sister from Egwene's followers has perfected a means of detecting male channelers, which is indicative of a great deal of effort in the matter - plainly this is a high priority for the rebels. Rand's offer was met with a good deal of interest as Romanda and Lelaine's dialogue plainly indicates the offer dovetails with an item on the rebel agenda, which they discuss using terms like "control" and speaking of meeting their purposes. Egwene's followers plainly have some specific intentions towards the Asha'man or male channelers in general, and things like detecting saidin, and controlling the men in question are involved. They show no particular friendship or interest, and react with fear or revulsion to Narishma. Does this look like the acts of a friendly group? But what about the last time any of Rand's followers had direct contact with Egwene? What happened then? Why Logain was threatened with murder or gentling in a discussion Egwene initiated regarding Rand's amnesty. She asked Logain's opinion and intimated that the rebel sisters, despite that amnesty and all that Logain had done for their cause, might ignore it, gentle him or even execute or murder him. Do you think he would have let Rand's proposal for the Asha'man to be bonded by Ewgene's followers without mentioning his own experiences at their hands? Not to mention his own story of what happened when he was restored to the Power hardly reflects well on their attitude toward male channelers. And Rand is not all that unreasonable in tarring Egwene with the same brush as her followers. Did she not do the same thing with Mat and the Dragonsworn in LoC?

Given everything that has gone on, plus Rand always having his finger on the pulse of Egwene's ambitions, his comment about another notch on her belt is not out of the blue, and considering his final words to Egwene way back in Fal Dara included the expectation that she would probably want to gentle him when next they met, neither is this a totally new sentiment. Even now, he is probably exaggerating, but this is hardly a new extreme train of thought that blossommed out of nowhere in Rand. Right or wrong as his belief may be, it is not inconsistent or unsupported by his experiences and information. And if you don't know by now that people react to and act upon what they perceive to be reality and the truth, however mistakenly, you have made it through 11 books of WoT without ever realizing what it is about.
Cannoli
"Sometimes unhinged, sometimes unfair, always entertaining"
- The Crownless

“Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” GK Chesteron
Deus Vult!
Reply to message
Your thoughts on TGS - Chapter 1 - 05/09/2009 05:23:47 PM 6216 Views
For all of those whining about it not sounding like RJ: - 05/09/2009 05:47:07 PM 2086 Views
Agreed. If anything, it's a tribute to RJ - 05/09/2009 06:17:36 PM 1945 Views
You're forgetting one thing. - 06/09/2009 12:13:03 AM 2113 Views
And if he were to off Egwene? What would your opinion be? *NM* - 07/09/2009 05:38:36 AM 1121 Views
He dislikes Sanderson's prose. Plot content is irrelevant here. *NM* - 08/09/2009 06:44:42 PM 1118 Views
Who cares? That would have been RJs decision anyway. - 09/09/2009 06:15:16 AM 1714 Views
not impressed - 05/09/2009 06:24:02 PM 2059 Views
all recap, no meat - 14/09/2009 12:33:35 PM 1730 Views
Pretty good. - 05/09/2009 07:35:41 PM 45477 Views
Re: Pretty good. - 05/09/2009 09:13:44 PM 2057 Views
Re: Pretty good. - 06/09/2009 01:19:22 AM 2291 Views
Re: Pretty good. - 06/09/2009 08:08:38 AM 1936 Views
Re: Pretty good. - 13/09/2009 01:22:22 PM 1651 Views
I found it well-written, but rather uninteresting story-wise *NM* - 05/09/2009 08:04:15 PM 1183 Views
because there should totaly be massive plot development in the first chapter - 05/09/2009 08:29:18 PM 1824 Views
I'm tired of passive story telling. - 05/09/2009 08:57:13 PM 1797 Views
On the other hand... - 05/09/2009 08:58:21 PM 1883 Views
Re: I'm tired of passive story telling. - 05/09/2009 10:42:57 PM 1731 Views
Which escape? - 05/09/2009 11:10:01 PM 1739 Views
I'm tired of mindless readers - 06/09/2009 01:54:14 AM 1874 Views
Re: I'm tired of mindless readers - 06/09/2009 04:01:56 AM 2018 Views
Your best yet Dom! *NM* - 06/09/2009 02:04:40 PM 1055 Views
Re: I'm tired of mindless readers - 07/09/2009 04:39:36 AM 1739 Views
Re: I'm tired of mindless readers - 07/09/2009 10:42:29 PM 1721 Views
I was over critical. - 06/09/2009 04:56:48 AM 1667 Views
It's been happening since Book IV btw. - 16/09/2009 05:30:52 PM 1512 Views
A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 05/09/2009 09:34:44 PM 1996 Views
I think Lews Therin's comments to Rand were the most hugely significant part of the chapter. - 06/09/2009 01:15:05 AM 1702 Views
I don't really agree... - 06/09/2009 03:50:08 AM 1691 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 06/09/2009 02:52:47 AM 2415 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 06/09/2009 07:08:08 AM 1653 Views
Just answer one question... - 06/09/2009 07:53:12 AM 2175 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 06/09/2009 10:31:20 AM 2242 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 08/09/2009 10:19:13 PM 1709 Views
If I may make a few somewhat irrelevant interjections... - 09/09/2009 04:44:45 AM 1647 Views
Re: If I may make a few somewhat irrelevant interjections... - 14/09/2009 04:46:29 PM 1771 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 10/09/2009 06:20:56 AM 2003 Views
On Egwene... - 10/09/2009 04:33:58 PM 1703 Views
Nynaeve - 08/09/2009 05:43:43 AM 1817 Views
Re: Nynaeve - 08/09/2009 08:06:20 AM 1605 Views
Re: A few things that drew my attention... (this is long and rambling...spoilers) - 07/09/2009 04:41:47 AM 1785 Views
Answers, short, long and longer. - 07/09/2009 11:27:53 PM 1737 Views
I think you missed some things. (spoilers) - 16/09/2009 05:21:43 PM 1493 Views
People who still have their wotmania SNs draw mine.... - 21/09/2009 05:25:15 PM 1556 Views
Good post, but I have an alternative explanation for the saidin barrier - 28/09/2009 12:53:41 AM 1505 Views
First thought...a typo! ner vous = nervous. *NM* - 05/09/2009 09:55:28 PM 1126 Views
I loved it! - 05/09/2009 10:52:17 PM 1752 Views
I didn't like the opening sequence. - 05/09/2009 10:58:17 PM 1792 Views
Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 06/09/2009 12:02:13 AM 1740 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 06/09/2009 12:44:11 AM 1761 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 07/09/2009 09:08:21 AM 1691 Views
This is what RJ said. - 06/09/2009 12:47:26 AM 1704 Views
Re: This is what RJ said. - 06/09/2009 01:24:36 AM 1903 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 06/09/2009 05:12:25 PM 1573 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 06/09/2009 07:20:45 PM 1573 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 07/09/2009 04:05:09 AM 1591 Views
Re: Robert Jordon vs Brandon Sanderson - 07/09/2009 09:33:25 AM 1602 Views
I found it...interesting --spoilers-- - 06/09/2009 01:33:11 AM 1899 Views
Re: I found it...interesting --spoilers-- - 06/09/2009 01:42:07 AM 1758 Views
Re: I found it...interesting --spoilers-- - 06/09/2009 02:54:17 PM 1798 Views
I'm excited. (Here be spoilers) - 06/09/2009 03:29:59 AM 1687 Views
six questions and nine statements - 06/09/2009 04:47:52 AM 1742 Views
Re: Your thoughts on TGS - Chapter 1 - 06/09/2009 04:51:04 AM 1698 Views
Re: Your thoughts on TGS - Chapter 1 - 06/09/2009 07:30:53 AM 1752 Views
I liked it - 06/09/2009 07:58:09 AM 1693 Views
Some questions... - 06/09/2009 08:04:30 AM 1694 Views
Re: Some questions... - 06/09/2009 08:11:08 AM 1797 Views
Re: Some questions... - 06/09/2009 08:53:20 AM 1692 Views
Re: I liked it - 06/09/2009 09:55:41 PM 1699 Views
Theory: Rand and Egwene. What is up? - 06/09/2009 07:59:58 AM 2599 Views
Also - 06/09/2009 08:24:45 AM 1705 Views
A simpler answer - 06/09/2009 03:04:04 PM 1782 Views
Really? - 06/09/2009 03:38:59 PM 1621 Views
Look at what he has seen... - 06/09/2009 11:45:44 PM 1571 Views
are we already at the location of the book cover? - 06/09/2009 11:49:06 AM 1663 Views
Re: are we already at the location of the book cover? - 06/09/2009 02:43:24 PM 1668 Views
I still think it's Aviendha - 07/09/2009 05:14:50 AM 1524 Views
Omniscient narrator not neutral enough, for one... - 06/09/2009 04:17:51 PM 1862 Views
Yip - 06/09/2009 04:29:40 PM 1784 Views
Yes... - 06/09/2009 04:39:00 PM 1647 Views
I totally agree...the narration was the biggest put-off for me - 09/09/2009 09:51:52 PM 1510 Views
Two Things - 07/09/2009 12:25:31 AM 1708 Views
Moiraine - 07/09/2009 01:19:08 AM 1795 Views
The Moiraine thing is dumb - 09/09/2009 09:53:51 PM 1671 Views
She fell through the doorway with Lanfear - 09/09/2009 10:18:55 PM 1610 Views
uh - 09/09/2009 10:57:17 PM 1642 Views
Timeline? - 07/09/2009 05:10:16 AM 1689 Views
Re: Timeline? - 07/09/2009 05:52:50 PM 1641 Views
So what chapter symbol is it going to have? *NM* - 07/09/2009 08:09:54 AM 978 Views
the dragon in COT chap 23 ornaments *NM* - 07/09/2009 01:28:58 PM 971 Views
The Seanchan are up to something - 07/09/2009 10:26:23 AM 1680 Views
Red stone doorway. - 07/09/2009 03:27:22 PM 1553 Views
The whole thing was explained by Rand in KoD. So no, not new. - 07/09/2009 06:35:01 PM 1562 Views
No - 07/09/2009 07:57:57 PM 1556 Views
Questions, Comments Thoughts and Theories about tGS - 07/09/2009 09:09:05 PM 1748 Views
My thoughts are that the main page is being crowded by too many duplicate threads - 07/09/2009 10:23:41 PM 1690 Views
Hrm... - 08/09/2009 05:28:19 AM 1755 Views
Enjoyed it - 08/09/2009 01:35:03 AM 1665 Views
Ready for More - 08/09/2009 04:25:19 PM 1693 Views
... - 08/09/2009 07:24:46 PM 1611 Views
Not sure what I expected, but not this... - 09/09/2009 04:07:10 PM 1705 Views
I know why Rand is mad at Egwene...read inside to find out - 11/09/2009 03:15:00 AM 1749 Views
It's his increasing paranoia and dehumanization. - 15/09/2009 03:03:53 AM 1654 Views
Re: Your thoughts on TGS - Chapter 1 - 16/09/2009 06:20:14 AM 1445 Views
Semirhage isn't scaring anyone - 28/09/2009 02:32:34 PM 1966 Views
Indeed... - 28/09/2009 03:36:55 PM 1567 Views
Will the Chosen pass that edict down or just not act themselves? - 28/09/2009 10:29:53 PM 1545 Views

Reply to Message