Katarine is asking why two of us now. She makes no comment at all about later.
Katerine never once said only one was necessary. She just complained about having to be part of it. Silviana's comment is crystal clear that she thinks Katerine is simply complaining. The first words out of her mouth are "Because I said so" ... something a mother would say to a child who was being a brat. "Why do I have to make my bed" ... "Because I said so"
Now, you can argue that she and Silviana both knew about the exact effects of Forkroot and how long it would last, so they never made a mention of it in their discussion of shielding Egwene.
Of course they did, that's the whole point of giving it to her in the first place! The Shield being held all night is Silviana's way of saying "I'm watching you because I think you are tricky".
But Egwene herself did not find it odd at all. Given that in the carriage, she felt she could get hold of enough saidar to defeat five Aes Sedai, either she doesn't know how much the Forkroot is affecting her, or the dose was small enough that it was wearing out enough for her to channel quite strongly. Either way, she would have been a little baffled that people assumed Barasine could hold her (if, as you say, that is not possible).
She said if she acted fast enough she may have a chance to win, that is not a comment about how much saidar she could hold, it's a comment on she may have a chance if she caught them by surprise.
KoD
Prologue
Abruptly it came to her that she was not shielded. Muddled she might be, but that made no sense at all. They could feel her strength, as she could theirs, and while none was weak, she thought she could overcome all five if she were quick enough.
A few seconds later they start discussing all the Forkroot in her system and wonder if she'll even be able to walk on her own. It's several more minutes before they even bother shielding her .. so of course they know exactly what is necessary. It's heavily implied in this scene that AS have been experimenting with the effects of Forkroot since Pritalle claims to have given Egwene the exact dose necessary. Clearly they are aware of when Egwene will need either more sisters to hold the shield, or more Forkroot.
Well, here's another quote that supports what I'm saying:
The glow of saidar surrounded Silviana, and she took over the shield smoothly, without giving any opening when Egwene might have embraced the Power herself. She was certain that she could, now.
Except that Silviana was far from weak; there was no hope she could break the woman’s shield.
By Egwene's own statement here, Forkroot is no longer an issue. She can embrace the power, and that is that, as far as she is concerned. Maybe she doesn't know she's be able to channel less than full strength, or it has indeed worn off enough that she can.
Point is, even after dismissing the effect of Forkroot, she says Silviana is too strong for Egwene to break her shield. That's the end of the argument, as far as I'm concerned.
The glow of saidar surrounded Silviana, and she took over the shield smoothly, without giving any opening when Egwene might have embraced the Power herself. She was certain that she could, now.
Except that Silviana was far from weak; there was no hope she could break the woman’s shield.
By Egwene's own statement here, Forkroot is no longer an issue. She can embrace the power, and that is that, as far as she is concerned. Maybe she doesn't know she's be able to channel less than full strength, or it has indeed worn off enough that she can.
Point is, even after dismissing the effect of Forkroot, she says Silviana is too strong for Egwene to break her shield. That's the end of the argument, as far as I'm concerned.
You keep trotting out this quote like it supports your thought. All it tells anyone is that Egwene is suffering from Forkroot still and would have no chance of breaking Silviana's shield in that moment. Egwene has realized by now that Channeling to any effect at that point is mostly beyond her. Not to mention we spend the rest of the next two books hearing about how the ability comes back gradually. Obviously Egwene is nowhere close to her normal strength in this scene. Just like when the Seanchan attack and she has to link with Nicola and others ... that was hours after her last dose and she could still barely Channel at all.
Domani Drag Queen in the White Tower ... Aran'gar watch out!
Several good MAFOs from Dragonmount
- 10/06/2010 07:07:55 PM
2509 Views
Maria's answer to question 20 is ground-breaking!
- 10/06/2010 07:36:40 PM
1444 Views
No, it merely means that the Bell Curve does not refer to absolute strength...
- 10/06/2010 07:42:31 PM
1276 Views
See the question again man!
- 10/06/2010 07:48:57 PM
1264 Views
That contradicts your assertion that Moiraine is stronger than the average woman...
- 10/06/2010 07:50:11 PM
1329 Views
I need to re-evaluate nothing!
- 10/06/2010 07:46:20 PM
1272 Views
- 10/06/2010 07:46:20 PM
1272 Views
Think logically for a moment...
- 10/06/2010 07:49:10 PM
1093 Views
Who said Egwene is twice as strong as Moiraine?
- 10/06/2010 07:52:27 PM
1398 Views
Aviendha did in FoH...
- 10/06/2010 07:54:32 PM
1093 Views
Nope!
- 10/06/2010 07:55:55 PM
1271 Views
Your quotes are faulty
- 10/06/2010 07:57:18 PM
1267 Views
In what sense though?
- 10/06/2010 07:59:00 PM
1288 Views
Forkroot
- 10/06/2010 08:04:50 PM
1243 Views
Again... later that night?
- 10/06/2010 08:05:39 PM
1089 Views
What do you mean?
- 10/06/2010 08:07:24 PM
1239 Views
See below...
- 10/06/2010 08:11:24 PM
1136 Views
Re: See below...
- 10/06/2010 08:12:34 PM
1198 Views
I just did.
- 10/06/2010 08:16:09 PM
1050 Views
Well then we disagree
- 10/06/2010 08:18:10 PM
1242 Views
BUT WHAT ABOUT LATER IN THE NIGHT!
- 10/06/2010 08:20:21 PM
1078 Views
Ah, you mean later later ...
- 10/06/2010 08:29:59 PM
1173 Views
Forkroot wears off, you know?
- 10/06/2010 08:45:33 PM
1268 Views
Yes I know
- 10/06/2010 09:05:29 PM
1265 Views
I've explained it before in this thread...
- 10/06/2010 09:17:10 PM
1228 Views
Re: I've explained it before in this thread...
- 10/06/2010 09:37:39 PM
1224 Views
Re: I've explained it before in this thread...
- 10/06/2010 09:51:40 PM
1170 Views
Re: I've explained it before in this thread...
- 10/06/2010 10:05:37 PM
1235 Views
Are you sure you're feeling fine?
- 10/06/2010 10:18:44 PM
1261 Views
RJ writes that Amys cannot hold Egwene. BS writes that Barasene can. Who are you gonna believe?
- 10/06/2010 08:31:35 PM
1078 Views
It wasn't BS... both were RJ!
- 10/06/2010 08:41:54 PM
1199 Views
In that case, there is no problem...
- 10/06/2010 08:45:05 PM
1315 Views
But that isn't what the text says...
- 10/06/2010 08:57:42 PM
1023 Views
How can Egwene be strong enough to overcome Katerine and Silviana together then?
- 10/06/2010 09:07:36 PM
1315 Views
Yeah, both were RJ
- 10/06/2010 08:49:13 PM
1141 Views
Yeah yeah... RJ lied, Maria lied. Only you make sense. I'm finished with this debate.
- 10/06/2010 08:59:06 PM
1239 Views
- 10/06/2010 09:07:52 PM
1250 Views
- 10/06/2010 09:07:52 PM
1250 Views
Really?
- 10/06/2010 09:29:22 PM
1082 Views
Re: Really?
- 10/06/2010 09:39:21 PM
1235 Views
Here's what is clear:
- 10/06/2010 09:02:41 PM
1132 Views
IMO it's easy to disprove
- 10/06/2010 09:22:23 PM
1113 Views
Dude...
- 10/06/2010 09:27:34 PM
1055 Views
At least we agree on one thing
- 10/06/2010 09:29:14 PM
1155 Views
yet 4 women can still hold Rand in LoC ... he can't break the Shield until it's down to 3
- 13/06/2010 12:47:43 PM
962 Views
Have to agree with Sidious on this point
- 11/06/2010 02:49:58 AM
1091 Views
The rate forkroot wears off?
- 16/06/2010 12:36:38 PM
1198 Views
You missed that she isn't being given Forkroot at night at all!
- 16/06/2010 04:47:59 PM
1088 Views
Maria's other answer adresses this...
- 10/06/2010 08:14:54 PM
992 Views
Then one Aes Sedai cannot shield her. But one did.
- 10/06/2010 08:16:41 PM
1098 Views
You can be much weaker than someone, and hold them shielded, if they are already cut off...
- 10/06/2010 08:19:15 PM
1099 Views
But, if you are much stronger, you can break that shield...
- 10/06/2010 08:22:25 PM
1090 Views
Easy...
- 10/06/2010 08:24:59 PM
1060 Views
What has that got to do with it?
- 10/06/2010 08:32:56 PM
1240 Views
Amys is not LESS than half of Egwene's strength. You cannot hold someone if you are LESS than half..
- 10/06/2010 08:47:41 PM
1163 Views
Amys is as strong as Moiraine, at the most one level lower. Barasine is weaker than Katarine, who...
- 10/06/2010 09:00:26 PM
1288 Views
I can agree with that.
- 10/06/2010 09:09:07 PM
1051 Views
...
- 10/06/2010 09:12:21 PM
1046 Views
Agreed, but...
- 10/06/2010 09:13:59 PM
1208 Views
Re: Agreed, but...
- 10/06/2010 09:16:30 PM
1006 Views
Good point...
- 10/06/2010 09:18:53 PM
1217 Views
Or, you know, you can have the grace to question your antiquated strength list...
- 10/06/2010 09:22:51 PM
1075 Views
I'd be perfectly happy to adjust my list if it made sense
- 10/06/2010 09:32:35 PM
1019 Views
Uhhh?
- 10/06/2010 09:41:59 PM
1031 Views
Re: Uhhh?
- 10/06/2010 09:48:58 PM
1018 Views
DUDE!
- 10/06/2010 09:58:59 PM
1042 Views
Rand seems to shield Egwene and Elayne TOGETHER, pretty easily...
- 10/06/2010 09:54:03 PM
1690 Views
That's fairly simple, actually...
- 10/06/2010 10:08:53 PM
1270 Views
Nope. Rand was also cut off from the Source when he broke a shield held by 3 Aes Sedai...
- 10/06/2010 11:18:41 PM
1243 Views
Because that channeler is much stronger? I'm not getting your confusion here. *NM*
- 10/06/2010 11:27:31 PM
592 Views
Your Aes Sedai are close to the average woman in strength, right...
- 10/06/2010 11:42:01 PM
1329 Views
No, here's the quote: I hate having to pull out my books with their yellowed pages...
- 10/06/2010 08:01:54 PM
1073 Views
Why would she need surprise against two? That was against five of them...
- 10/06/2010 08:04:57 PM
1083 Views
Very poor evidence
- 10/06/2010 08:11:26 PM
1210 Views
no she said Egwene is stronger than Amys and Melaine combined
- 11/06/2010 12:46:29 AM
1150 Views
The actual quote says Amys and Melaine combined...
- 11/06/2010 12:25:07 PM
1186 Views
Here's the problem with that...
- 11/06/2010 12:42:41 PM
1055 Views
I think you are misreading her.
- 10/06/2010 07:47:06 PM
1035 Views
Please explain what you mean by "channeler" and "power" distribution. *NM*
- 10/06/2010 09:23:36 PM
635 Views
Re: Please explain what you mean by "channeler" and "power" distribution.
- 10/06/2010 10:11:23 PM
1241 Views
Yes. You can't extrapolate a generalized macro level scale to micro level individuals.
- 11/06/2010 12:16:24 AM
1106 Views
I don't agree
- 10/06/2010 07:49:41 PM
1091 Views
BAH! Its infuriating how you have so many blinders... Eerily Aes Sedai of you.
- 10/06/2010 07:54:23 PM
1279 Views
Hmm...
- 10/06/2010 07:55:59 PM
1008 Views
Because of the question to which she responded...
- 10/06/2010 07:57:55 PM
1014 Views
Re: Because of the question to which she responded...
- 10/06/2010 08:06:16 PM
1174 Views
Without contradicting the latter...
- 10/06/2010 08:15:11 PM
1080 Views
Ah well
- 10/06/2010 08:20:32 PM
1049 Views
Great! Two of my OP strength ideas have been solidified!
- 10/06/2010 07:39:53 PM
1274 Views
Nope...
- 10/06/2010 07:46:31 PM
1146 Views
Who said Cadsuane was 50?
- 10/06/2010 07:51:14 PM
1181 Views
So how can Egwene be twice as strong as Moiraine, if Moiraine is at 55?
- 10/06/2010 07:53:11 PM
1039 Views
She cannot be because she isn't. Silviana can shield Egwene alone, for God's sake. So can Amys!
- 10/06/2010 07:56:26 PM
983 Views
Amys can't hold her properly
- 10/06/2010 07:59:47 PM
1007 Views
What about later that night?
- 10/06/2010 08:02:16 PM
1038 Views
No she didn't
- 16/06/2010 03:02:21 PM
1148 Views
No she didn't what?
- 16/06/2010 04:46:05 PM
1230 Views
Re: No she didn't what?
- 17/06/2010 06:16:16 AM
1047 Views
Re: No she didn't what?
- 17/06/2010 06:02:57 PM
1168 Views
you are arguing in a circle
- 17/06/2010 06:31:19 PM
1521 Views
Why do you think it's a linear scale?
- 16/06/2010 05:25:56 AM
1153 Views
That's simple...
- 16/06/2010 06:36:44 AM
1128 Views
Re: That's simple...
- 16/06/2010 12:27:07 PM
1085 Views
Your concept is not mathematically right. So yeah, forget discussing it.
- 16/06/2010 04:41:13 PM
1257 Views
Dang, Cyndane isn't using Cabriana's body.
- 10/06/2010 08:25:20 PM
1107 Views
The blue flash RAFO irritates me- I can't see how that will be relevant. The Min thing was new
- 10/06/2010 08:50:52 PM
1206 Views
RJ already RAFOed the incident with Thom's knives/daggers before
- 10/06/2010 08:57:52 PM
1291 Views
It isn't, unless she's implying the Creator helped him out or some other such thing
- 11/06/2010 12:56:49 AM
1051 Views
Just to make things clear on the strength thing...
- 10/06/2010 09:08:02 PM
1308 Views
It is possible Maria was answering the first question and ignoring the second...
- 10/06/2010 09:29:59 PM
1064 Views
That still proves my point...
- 10/06/2010 09:33:10 PM
1231 Views
Re: That still proves my point...
- 10/06/2010 09:45:39 PM
1092 Views
Then why...
- 10/06/2010 10:00:00 PM
1183 Views
Re: Then why...
- 10/06/2010 10:07:56 PM
1077 Views
God, what stupidity!
- 10/06/2010 10:10:32 PM
1033 Views
Re: God, what stupidity!
- 10/06/2010 10:16:38 PM
1133 Views
It doesn't have to be 1-100.
- 10/06/2010 10:32:17 PM
1073 Views
Re: It doesn't have to be 1-100.
- 10/06/2010 10:41:02 PM
1390 Views
That's a mathematical impossibility...
- 10/06/2010 11:26:23 PM
1213 Views
Just popping in. I think you're arguing over non-existent delineations.
- 11/06/2010 12:44:40 AM
1150 Views
You know, these things always end up pissing me off.
- 11/06/2010 12:25:05 AM
1117 Views
Re: You know, these things always end up pissing me off.
- 11/06/2010 03:22:53 AM
1224 Views
Re: You know, these things always end up pissing me off.
- 11/06/2010 12:29:37 PM
1196 Views
I agree
- 11/06/2010 01:14:36 PM
1296 Views
Re: I agree
- 12/06/2010 03:02:32 PM
1061 Views
BS didn't answer with "Read and find out"
- 12/06/2010 03:28:05 PM
1111 Views
We were speaking about Maria giving a RAFO on the topic, not Sanderson. *NM*
- 13/06/2010 12:05:17 AM
609 Views
Actually she said "No"...
*NM*
- 13/06/2010 01:06:18 AM
710 Views
*NM*
- 13/06/2010 01:06:18 AM
710 Views
I'll rephrase then. It was about Maria saying that she considered giving a RAFO on the question.
- 13/06/2010 01:44:19 AM
1101 Views
Eh, practically useless.
- 14/06/2010 11:50:06 PM
1044 Views
I agree. I think she is saving the good stuff for the encyclopedia. *NM*
- 15/06/2010 04:17:07 PM
575 Views
Yeah. I do think she's taking advantage of these poor saps, though.
- 17/06/2010 03:52:33 PM
1634 Views
