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Re: Who performs the worst atrocity in this book: Egwene or Rand? (A good Cannoli question) randfandom Send a noteboard - 13/11/2009 08:16:29 PM
Everyone here has noted Rand's mass atrocity. Rand most likely killed dozens of Graendal's innocent pawns of Graendal when he balefired her palace. Rand did this to get rid of a necessary evil, and the people he killed were beyond saving anyway.
IMO, the only really bad thing Rand did was by burning them out of the pattern. Those people he killed will never have a chance to live again.


Actually RJ said that people killed by balefire do get reborn. Their souls are not taken out of the recycling bin. Balefire wipes out their last actions (in this case going back maybe an hour) and prevents the Dark One grabbing the soul at the point of death.

Since the people there had been reprogrammed by Graendel, Rand probably did them all a favor. They'll have a chance to be reborn free and not used as puppets.

However, Rand's action was a-moral. He knew that Ramshallan(?) was compelled by Graedel, but not whether or not she was still there. He killed these people without absolute positive proof that Graedel was there at the time of the strike. Luckily she was, but it could just as easily have been the other way.

It's a little like when we fight Al Qaida, the army bombs a civilian lodging because it has evidence that Bin Laden might be there. You don't know until after whether you murdered innocents for nothing or whether that action is justified even if you could prove the terrorists are there.

As for Egwene, she was perfectly justified, especially given her own experience as a damane, to do what she did, although I think she violated her vow that she follows the Three Oaths "in her heart" - for all she knew, the Seanchan came to collar, not kill, so by the Three Oaths she should not have used killing force.

randfandom
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Who performs the worst atrocity in this book: Egwene or Rand? (A good Cannoli question) - 13/11/2009 06:22:50 PM 2001 Views
Egwene also killed Aes Sedai who belonged to the shadow by the dozens - 13/11/2009 07:19:14 PM 724 Views
Re: Egwene also killed Aes Sedai who belonged to the shadow by the dozens - 13/11/2009 07:25:14 PM 657 Views
Forcible turning is not the only method - 13/11/2009 08:28:08 PM 759 Views
But... - 13/11/2009 08:43:53 PM 796 Views
The point is - 13/11/2009 11:00:58 PM 538 Views
They were tried. *NM* - 14/11/2009 12:23:45 AM 265 Views
Mock trials - 14/11/2009 08:06:14 AM 620 Views
Proof? - 14/11/2009 09:09:14 AM 554 Views
That's the impression I got from Sheriam's 'trial' - 14/11/2009 09:44:09 AM 633 Views
But... - 14/11/2009 06:55:54 PM 602 Views
And if Verin had been caught, she would have deserved death. - 13/11/2009 11:55:13 PM 701 Views
Ordinarily, I would disagree... - 14/11/2009 04:20:28 AM 750 Views
Re: Ordinarily, I would disagree... - 14/11/2009 08:04:37 AM 653 Views
They had trials. No mention of them presenting such evidence. *NM* - 13/11/2009 11:54:23 PM 278 Views
Forced turnings should be killed too - 15/11/2009 07:06:43 AM 566 Views
Sad but true - 07/12/2009 05:05:08 PM 537 Views
Based on those two actions... - 13/11/2009 08:01:32 PM 735 Views
How was she going to protect the Tower and occupants then? - 13/11/2009 08:02:31 PM 638 Views
There is a difference between collateral damage and targeting your own people! *NM* - 13/11/2009 11:56:10 PM 299 Views
She did not target her own people... - 14/11/2009 12:39:14 AM 595 Views
You seem to be contradicting yourself here - 14/11/2009 07:52:07 AM 649 Views
Because they were indistinct specks high in the sky? *NM* - 14/11/2009 09:11:15 AM 282 Views
Considering the power she had in her hands - 14/11/2009 09:52:10 AM 942 Views
That's ridiculous... - 14/11/2009 07:07:11 PM 628 Views
Re: That's ridiculous... - 14/11/2009 07:21:44 PM 614 Views
typical cannoli double speak, she wasn't targeting her own people - 14/11/2009 01:46:10 AM 2205 Views
Nothing wrong with that. - 14/11/2009 08:11:15 AM 669 Views
She does have first hand experience - 14/11/2009 07:52:20 PM 664 Views
Dozens of dark sisters together...trapped like rats... - 18/11/2009 12:29:19 AM 582 Views
Re: Who performs the worst atrocity in this book: Egwene or Rand? (A good Cannoli question) - 13/11/2009 08:16:29 PM 629 Views
Neither is an atrocity... - 13/11/2009 08:17:08 PM 868 Views
this ^ *NM* - 13/11/2009 08:34:10 PM 246 Views
Re: Neither is an atrocity... - 13/11/2009 08:59:30 PM 669 Views
Bull Sh!t! - 13/11/2009 09:08:00 PM 683 Views
Come on now... - 13/11/2009 09:13:50 PM 596 Views
Not outraged on their behalf... - 13/11/2009 09:26:11 PM 610 Views
Re: Not outraged on their behalf... - 13/11/2009 09:56:01 PM 526 Views
Re: Not outraged on their behalf... - 13/11/2009 10:08:06 PM 545 Views
Re: Not outraged on their behalf... - 13/11/2009 10:37:04 PM 621 Views
- 13/11/2009 10:45:57 PM 561 Views
Re: - 13/11/2009 11:16:58 PM 596 Views
Re: - 14/11/2009 12:34:49 AM 500 Views
Re: - 14/11/2009 01:46:51 AM 595 Views
Yes your argument is very much Bull Sh!t - 13/11/2009 09:15:17 PM 662 Views
So... - 13/11/2009 09:27:11 PM 616 Views
Re: So... - 13/11/2009 10:07:15 PM 530 Views
Not at all... - 13/11/2009 10:09:43 PM 540 Views
Re: Not at all... - 13/11/2009 10:54:14 PM 530 Views
Re: Not at all... - 14/11/2009 12:36:36 AM 540 Views
Break out the inflatable balloon swords and have at it already! - 14/11/2009 02:14:47 AM 567 Views
Rand. - 13/11/2009 09:17:14 PM 689 Views
Re: Rand. - 13/11/2009 10:56:04 PM 691 Views
But that is not her choice to make. She has NO right to decide that for anyone. *NM* - 13/11/2009 11:57:03 PM 298 Views
No, she had no right to make that choice - 14/11/2009 03:54:35 AM 533 Views
Yes, it was her choice to make, and she is now responsible for the consequences. - 16/11/2009 06:24:46 PM 953 Views
Its the difference between - 14/11/2009 02:59:42 AM 580 Views
Cannoli mentioned already - after balefire you can live again - 20/11/2009 03:38:06 AM 495 Views

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