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Re: Yes, she did state it. DomA Send a noteboard - 07/12/2009 01:39:07 AM
That didn't matter to the binder.

She didn't state that Gitara died without saying anything, she told two people who were there to lie, and which lie to tell.

She could not say that as a statement, but as instructions she could.

Intent and result.



That's the point, that she did state it. Aes Sedai can state things as long as you're not trying to trick someone, according to RJ.

There was a huge argument about this when NS was released

"You will tell no one about this, not for any reason. If necessary, lie. Even to a sister. Gitara died without speaking. Do you understand me?"


We're saying the same thing then. By "statement" I meant her making the affirmation that Gitara died without speaking. She didn't do that, she was merely telling people who knew how Gitara died how she wanted them to lie about it.

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Cadsuane lies! darius_sedai - 06/12/2009 06:10:41 PM 2455 Views
Re: Cadsuane lies! joepo - 06/12/2009 06:18:39 PM 1683 Views
Sarcasm is one thing Ryan - 06/12/2009 06:43:12 PM 1361 Views
I disagree darius_sedai - 06/12/2009 06:51:27 PM 1332 Views
RJ has said they're allowed to be sarcastic TheCrownless - 06/12/2009 07:07:32 PM 1284 Views
How does that jive with the Oaths? darius_sedai - 06/12/2009 07:13:21 PM 1339 Views
Good point, but in that same book Tamra said that Gitara didn't say anything before dying *NM* Deadsy - 06/12/2009 07:53:31 PM 634 Views
Re: Good point, but in that same book Tamra said that Gitara didn't say anything before dying DomA - 06/12/2009 08:03:36 PM 1416 Views
Yes, she did state it. Deadsy - 06/12/2009 08:57:47 PM 1301 Views
Re: Yes, she did state it. DomA - 07/12/2009 01:39:07 AM 1299 Views
Re: How does that jive with the Oaths? DomA - 06/12/2009 07:57:10 PM 1257 Views
The Oaths focus on INTENT beetnemesis - 06/12/2009 10:01:27 PM 1310 Views
None of what you describe is an Oath ingrained into your bones. darius_sedai - 07/12/2009 01:52:49 AM 1147 Views
It's ENTIRELY about self-rationalization Nameless Ashaman - 07/12/2009 03:59:00 AM 1110 Views
^This. *NM* Nate - 07/12/2009 08:23:27 AM 692 Views
Because it isn't a lie DomA - 06/12/2009 07:44:29 PM 1344 Views
I understand this, I'm not arguing that an AS should not be able to be sarcastic darius_sedai - 06/12/2009 08:08:15 PM 1338 Views
Verin didn't say it sarcastically. Darth_Katie - 06/12/2009 08:11:31 PM 1104 Views
Really? I never would have known that without you darius_sedai - 06/12/2009 08:39:56 PM 1240 Views
Re: I understand this, I'm not arguing that an AS should not be able to be sarcastic DomA - 06/12/2009 08:35:23 PM 1364 Views
Quote for you darius_sedai - 06/12/2009 08:42:52 PM 1281 Views
Re: Quote for you DomA - 07/12/2009 01:30:57 AM 1193 Views
The sarcasm was for him repeating himself to her. The "remember" is the part she's refering to. Onarishma - 07/12/2009 10:15:06 AM 1127 Views
That's why I think this example of sarcasm works as opposed to Cadsuane who makes a false statement darius_sedai - 07/12/2009 03:17:52 PM 1165 Views
sarcasm is sarcasm. In both instances their is technically a lie. Onarishma - 07/12/2009 11:28:02 PM 1123 Views
Not at all the case darius_sedai - 07/12/2009 11:58:42 PM 1190 Views
Do you really believe he waited till the last minute to tell Seonid? Onarishma - 14/12/2009 01:32:37 PM 1290 Views
That's the whole point of her being able to say what she did! darius_sedai - 14/12/2009 04:05:24 PM 1068 Views
What about the Sheriam thing? Legolas - 07/12/2009 01:49:32 PM 1231 Views
Re: What about the Sheriam thing? DomA - 07/12/2009 02:15:25 PM 1069 Views
But surely an Aes Sedai can answer a question she hasn't fully heard yet. Legolas - 07/12/2009 03:06:34 PM 1318 Views
I actually don't take it as proof. Nameless Ashaman - 07/12/2009 09:00:58 PM 1129 Views
Yeah, I thought about that possibility too... Legolas - 07/12/2009 10:21:16 PM 1416 Views
Sarcasm Sidious - 06/12/2009 07:14:47 PM 1350 Views
It's obviously meant to be sarcasm, I just don't like darius_sedai - 06/12/2009 07:18:40 PM 1137 Views
Here is what RJ said about it Etzel - 06/12/2009 07:41:18 PM 1311 Views
Well I have to say I think RJ made the wrong call with this one *NM* darius_sedai - 06/12/2009 07:43:47 PM 570 Views
Like my momma used to say... Mat_Cauthon33 - 06/12/2009 11:27:22 PM 1229 Views
Your momma is a wise woman. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 07/12/2009 03:14:27 PM 1093 Views
Agreed. johnnymack - 07/12/2009 01:45:39 AM 1099 Views
You can already drive a truck through the oaths. Does this one additional tiny gap really matter? Nameless Ashaman - 07/12/2009 04:07:16 AM 1155 Views
Alys (Moiraine alias) *NM* BlackAdder - 07/12/2009 05:13:18 AM 1451 Views
No, no it doesn't. johnnymack - 08/12/2009 03:31:11 PM 1093 Views
Re: No, no it doesn't. Nameless Ashaman - 08/12/2009 04:41:42 PM 1106 Views
what do you think a RL lie detector would tell in this case? redhand - 07/12/2009 12:27:07 PM 1116 Views
in RL you would get warned by the investigator to cooperate AgentOrange - 07/12/2009 01:04:33 PM 1130 Views
But how would the machine reading indicate? redhand - 07/12/2009 07:04:22 PM 1087 Views
Usually you're s'possed to answer with a yes or no. It's easy to tell when you're evasive AgentOrange - 09/12/2009 10:46:58 PM 1183 Views
Where's the problem? Shadowkiller - 09/12/2009 04:18:40 PM 1034 Views
It's in the way the Oath is worded darius_sedai - 09/12/2009 05:14:39 PM 1120 Views
Re: It's in the way the Oath is worded Shadowkiller - 09/12/2009 05:36:59 PM 1165 Views
See the Cadsuane quote, but I'll give you another one darius_sedai - 09/12/2009 06:15:32 PM 1306 Views
PS You misread my original quote darius_sedai - 09/12/2009 11:00:56 PM 1024 Views
You're so right. My fault. *NM* Shadowkiller - 10/12/2009 12:57:29 AM 1093 Views
No worries! It a discussion forum, we're supposed to discuss darius_sedai - 10/12/2009 12:58:39 AM 1210 Views
Re: PS You misread my original quote taura-tierno - 28/12/2009 10:04:51 PM 1311 Views
Lies, untruths, sarcasm, and meaning Shadowkiller - 09/12/2009 07:46:25 PM 1212 Views
We are starting understand each other darius_sedai - 09/12/2009 10:09:41 PM 1176 Views
Re: We are starting understand each other Shadowkiller - 10/12/2009 01:03:08 AM 1081 Views
Completely agree darius_sedai - 10/12/2009 01:23:36 AM 1157 Views
Why do you think she *had* noticed the Aiel? *NM* Lord Haart - 14/12/2009 02:02:24 PM 510 Views
because she arrived with Rand and dozens of Maidens, darius_sedai - 15/12/2009 01:02:43 AM 1062 Views
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