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At least I am not as quick to repeat the same excuses Larry Send a noteboard - 26/04/2010 05:13:08 PM
It is always appreciated when you criticize my approach and intention based on the vast insight into my life and plans that you obviously have. I appreciate that you hold that only your model is the successful one when it comes to topical or book club type discussion. I understand that you hold it that only you, or any other organizer, can possibly ask poignant questions or open sub-threads about plot points or thematic developments. Thank you for disabusing me of the opinion that if someone reads something they might have an opinion or questions of their own.


Considering that your response was, shall we say, a bit "out of character" for you, in as much as you usually don't open talk about the need to stop "holding hands," perhaps my response was actually a bit understated compared to what I felt when I originally read it?

Here are some takeaway points for you, Larry. If you don't want to be accusatory, don't write a post the is simply a lecture about how poorly I am doing my 'job'. If you don't want to be insulting, you can try NBing personal suggestions directly to me. If you don't want to be condescending, you can stop holding up every MB interaction and event to the perfect model of how you would do it, regardless of how far from fact that ever was in the past.


To be honest, I am now more concerned about you making yet another round of excuses. After all, there are several things that you have pretty much promised me that you would have done...over a year ago. I just had to place an order for a replacement for one book in particular, since I had given up hope that you would ever review it or that I would ever get it back. Sure, you have had things come up. So have I, things I still won't share with any. But I also learned that sometimes it's best to just admit to myself when I cannot do something and to not make promises that I cannot keep.

As for this being "public," like I said above, sometimes when someone wants to talk about "hand-holding" in such a tone, perhaps that person can deal with a public rebuke. But since the point behind the barb appears to be lost in the anger, I'll give free rein to it now and ask, publicly, when are you going to fulfill certain promises made?

A better idea might have been to ask if or what my exact plans for the discussion, or a book club event in general might be. It is possible, though you obviously disagree, to take different approaches for how a book club event can progress.


I'm well aware of that. I'm also aware that you procrastinate more around here with each passing year and that my patience, little as it is, has become exhausted recently. As for the book club idea, I would imagine that moderators tend to do well when they actually moderate. If they can't do that, perhaps they should just step aside until they can do so?

Take my plan here for instance. Pick a sci-fi book that has some deeper elements than simple sci-fi entertainment. Advertise the book to get people to read it, and set a date for a discussion. Open the discussion with some general questions to kick start responses and participant initiated conversations. During the second week, post my review/response of the work; follow up with participant posts/conversations, respond to/or initiate deeper element conversations.


And did you really do this?

I thought that I would try this approach to see if/how it might affect participation and the general willingness to continue in conversation. It would allow people the ability to initiate conversation if they wanted. It would allow more surface level conversation, and better participation up front, and then attempt to delve deeper with greater participation. As a side bonus, it would also fit into my schedule.

Obviously, thanks to your ever so humble and knowledgeable rebuke of my abilities and my approach, I know that such things just won't work.


Nice to see what comes out in anger. And by the way, a month's delay is quite ridiculous.
Illusions fall like the husk of a fruit, one after another, and the fruit is experience. - Narrator, Sylvie

Je suis méchant.
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Sci-Fi Book Club: SOLARIS by Stanislaw Lem - 19/04/2010 05:50:45 PM 2109 Views
Roll-Call: Have you read it? Are you reading it? Like it: Yes/NO? *NM* - 19/04/2010 05:52:00 PM 760 Views
I read it back in January. - 19/04/2010 06:23:29 PM 1387 Views
I read it years ago, and liked it. *NM* - 19/04/2010 06:41:36 PM 710 Views
I just finished it. - 19/04/2010 06:54:49 PM 1367 Views
Well, to be fair, - 20/04/2010 08:12:17 PM 1312 Views
Heh. - 21/04/2010 08:31:51 AM 1521 Views
Re: Well, to be fair, - 12/05/2010 09:06:06 PM 1244 Views
That was how I felt too. - 20/04/2010 11:39:15 PM 1104 Views
I read it 3 years ago, and liked it. - 19/04/2010 06:58:37 PM 1662 Views
I read it, and liked it. - 19/04/2010 07:33:16 PM 1379 Views
I plan to - 19/04/2010 07:41:21 PM 1495 Views
I might re-read it in a few days - 19/04/2010 09:11:35 PM 1302 Views
I'm currently reading it - 20/04/2010 10:00:05 AM 1546 Views
That has always bothered me too. - 20/04/2010 08:20:56 PM 1206 Views
Indeed - 11/05/2010 03:02:26 PM 1228 Views
It was a while since I've read it - 22/04/2010 05:33:44 AM 1206 Views
I have started reading it - 11/05/2010 11:10:53 AM 1166 Views
Translation: - 19/04/2010 05:54:57 PM 1437 Views
I read it in Russian, which was very close to the original. - 19/04/2010 06:25:00 PM 1424 Views
I'm not sure now, I think I read it in Dutch. - 19/04/2010 06:43:30 PM 1336 Views
English translation by Joanna Kilmartin and Steve Cox (1970). - 19/04/2010 06:56:54 PM 1306 Views
Translation of a translation, actually. *NM* - 19/04/2010 07:22:18 PM 691 Views
Yes, I did read Jake's intro piece there. *NM* - 19/04/2010 07:23:44 PM 695 Views
I figured you were not accurate enough. - 19/04/2010 07:26:54 PM 1301 Views
Pffft. Accuracy is for nerds. - 19/04/2010 07:31:52 PM 1385 Views
That was the one I read. - 20/04/2010 01:43:01 AM 1541 Views
I read it in Czech - 19/04/2010 07:40:05 PM 1556 Views
I also read a Swedish translation. - 19/04/2010 07:41:31 PM 1766 Views
1970 translation from French to English by Joanna Kilmartin and Steve Cox - 20/04/2010 02:20:42 AM 1419 Views
I have a different opinion on this. - 20/04/2010 08:17:06 PM 1319 Views
I've read it in Polish - 22/04/2010 05:32:33 AM 1136 Views
Re: So it's flat and boring? - 23/04/2010 09:50:38 PM 1282 Views
Re: Does anyone know why the Polish publishers haven't commissioned another translation? - 24/04/2010 10:04:38 AM 1278 Views
Rights issues, I beieve - 24/04/2010 10:48:53 AM 1318 Views
So 'we' have read the novel in 6 different languages. - 27/04/2010 09:20:02 PM 1170 Views
I read the English from French translation - 12/05/2010 09:10:42 PM 1131 Views
This was my general experience as well. - 17/05/2010 06:53:58 PM 1183 Views
I probably got more out of it than I first thought. - 20/04/2010 11:37:52 PM 1125 Views
Re: I do that too! - 23/04/2010 09:51:39 PM 1161 Views
It is certainly a book that makes you think... - 26/04/2010 09:46:31 PM 1156 Views
Literature vs. Genre Fiction - 21/04/2010 02:33:21 PM 1342 Views
Re: Literature vs. Genre Fiction - 21/04/2010 08:44:24 PM 1330 Views
Re: Literature vs. Genre Fiction - 12/05/2010 09:19:31 PM 1170 Views
Re: - 21/04/2010 09:09:02 PM 1286 Views
How do you know Solaris was an advanced intelligence? - 22/04/2010 01:20:35 AM 1204 Views
Fair enough. - 22/04/2010 09:04:58 PM 1270 Views
But I think that is Lem's point. - 23/04/2010 03:20:18 AM 1260 Views
Good point Tom. - 23/04/2010 03:14:23 AM 1148 Views
It's definitely literature - 22/04/2010 01:19:34 AM 1117 Views
You might be winning me over to your thoughts here. - 26/04/2010 09:42:33 PM 1101 Views
As long as you realize... - 26/04/2010 10:26:00 PM 1130 Views
This is why I sort of float around on this issue. - 27/04/2010 05:49:39 PM 1219 Views
Re: This is why I sort of float around on this issue. - 13/05/2010 10:15:38 AM 1210 Views
Very well put. - 17/05/2010 06:51:27 PM 1081 Views
Re: Very well put. - 17/05/2010 06:53:13 PM 1205 Views
This book is definitely literature. - 23/04/2010 02:59:48 AM 1259 Views
Re: This discussion gives me hives. *NM* - 23/04/2010 09:52:09 PM 643 Views
Understandable. - 26/04/2010 07:31:08 PM 1127 Views
Hmmm - 12/05/2010 09:18:42 PM 1223 Views
What didn't you enjoy? - 21/04/2010 09:47:06 PM 1121 Views
I didn't like the excessive description of the types of clouds on Solaris. - 22/04/2010 01:17:22 AM 1071 Views
This was what I disliked too - 22/04/2010 05:46:05 AM 1289 Views
Re: I didn't like the excessive description of the types of clouds on Solaris. - 23/04/2010 03:33:14 AM 1150 Views
Re: I found it made this stark contrast with his descriptions of his own, more human environment. - 24/04/2010 09:56:40 AM 1374 Views
That is an interesting take. - 27/04/2010 05:53:23 PM 1209 Views
I didn't really find anything difficult about it. - 23/04/2010 03:38:48 AM 1230 Views
The only thing that bothered me... - 03/05/2010 07:06:42 PM 1339 Views
So, is there really anything to discuss about the story itself? - 22/04/2010 08:55:03 AM 1292 Views
Apparently not. - 22/04/2010 01:38:24 PM 1334 Views
True - 22/04/2010 09:29:53 PM 1156 Views
Point of fact, - 23/04/2010 02:53:47 PM 1199 Views
Perhaps it's time for a self-reevaluation then - 24/04/2010 10:45:44 AM 1557 Views
Thank you for telling me how I should prioritize my life, Larry. - 26/04/2010 04:54:01 PM 1362 Views
At least I am not as quick to repeat the same excuses - 26/04/2010 05:13:08 PM 1527 Views
I was originally gonna reply to your previous post, then decided not to. Guess I will now. - 26/04/2010 05:42:15 PM 1370 Views
Thank you. - 26/04/2010 07:41:17 PM 1311 Views
One point... - 26/04/2010 07:34:02 PM 1190 Views
Posting while irritated and about to crash does little good, it seems - 27/04/2010 06:20:19 PM 1272 Views
The delay to the review is my fault. I've got a mostly finished one. I'm just not happy with it. - 27/04/2010 07:19:35 PM 1230 Views
It wasn't the review I was irritated about, but thanks for doing it - 27/04/2010 07:39:08 PM 1158 Views
Ah. OK. - 27/04/2010 07:47:09 PM 1297 Views
Thanks - 27/04/2010 07:58:54 PM 1178 Views
I'm a bit ambivalent on the merits of this approach of yours. - 26/04/2010 05:32:19 PM 1137 Views
You highlight my only frustration with the thread. - 26/04/2010 05:48:01 PM 1491 Views
Re: So what do you think about any of those things? - 23/04/2010 08:30:55 PM 1151 Views
A question about Lem. - 23/04/2010 03:49:57 AM 1167 Views
I've only read one other book by him, The Cyberiad - 23/04/2010 04:03:19 AM 1283 Views
Re: A question about Lem. - 23/04/2010 07:26:18 PM 1300 Views
Thanks. - 24/04/2010 06:42:05 AM 1288 Views
Yes - 24/04/2010 02:43:17 PM 1259 Views
My main thoughts on Solaris by Stanislaw Lem - 23/04/2010 02:50:10 AM 1531 Views
Re: About that "worst" thoughts issue. - 23/04/2010 09:49:04 PM 1426 Views
Re: About that "worst" thoughts issue. - 12/05/2010 09:35:48 PM 1319 Views
I came away with the same message you did on the first point. - 25/04/2010 04:46:09 PM 1136 Views
Re: My main thoughts on Solaris by Stanislaw Lem - 12/05/2010 09:31:32 PM 1293 Views
Re: So I have no team spirit and should be lynched. - 23/04/2010 09:41:48 PM 1179 Views
I finally watched Avatar for the first time tonight. - 25/04/2010 04:27:34 AM 1151 Views
Solaris was, I hope, better than Avatar. - 25/04/2010 04:54:12 AM 1131 Views
Misplaced answer . *NM* - 25/04/2010 04:40:27 PM 551 Views
On identity and communication: do we love only ourselves? - 25/04/2010 03:35:34 PM 1211 Views
The argument: (From the text and some thoughts) - 27/04/2010 06:22:34 PM 1138 Views
Yes - 12/05/2010 10:10:30 PM 1296 Views
That is a great idea... - 17/05/2010 06:58:48 PM 1212 Views
Re: That is a great idea... - 17/05/2010 07:02:44 PM 1244 Views
That settles it. I am going to have to reread it. - 13/05/2010 12:23:14 AM 1166 Views
It is interesting you should say that. - 12/05/2010 09:56:26 PM 1420 Views
That is the second time this week that I have heard something about Derrida. Now I am going to have - 13/05/2010 12:02:56 AM 1301 Views
Derrida is great. - 13/05/2010 10:06:49 AM 1330 Views
Is Solaris alive? Is Solaris sentient? - 25/04/2010 03:40:57 PM 1166 Views
I can't decide. - 25/04/2010 03:54:39 PM 1308 Views
An interesting point to consider... - 25/04/2010 10:41:17 PM 1314 Views
Re: I can't decide. - 12/05/2010 10:05:21 PM 1101 Views
Re: Is Solaris alive? Is Solaris sentient? - 25/04/2010 10:31:58 PM 1298 Views
Ooohhhh. I like that theory. - 25/04/2010 11:32:15 PM 1273 Views
Does it make a difference? - 26/04/2010 07:29:44 PM 1131 Views
Re: Is Solaris alive? Is Solaris sentient? - 12/05/2010 09:57:05 PM 1297 Views
What do you think the biggest message of the book is? - 25/04/2010 03:47:03 PM 1235 Views
Re: Does he let go of her? How independant is she of him? - 25/04/2010 04:07:33 PM 1361 Views
That's an interesting observation. - 26/04/2010 10:23:28 PM 1162 Views
Re: I was telling Tashmere... - 11/05/2010 11:05:09 AM 1294 Views
Re: What do you think the biggest message of the book is? - 25/04/2010 10:16:16 PM 1205 Views
Communication with the entirely other - 12/05/2010 10:01:37 PM 1234 Views
Did anyone else do any wondering what their own visitors would take the form of if they were there? - 26/04/2010 11:31:27 PM 1139 Views
Actually, no. It was obvious to me. *NM* - 26/04/2010 11:41:22 PM 545 Views
In a way yes. - 27/04/2010 06:33:43 PM 1240 Views
My father, perhaps. - 27/04/2010 08:55:18 PM 1135 Views
Ha. - 27/04/2010 09:16:56 PM 1169 Views

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