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Re: Is that assumption valid? Isaac Send a noteboard - 09/08/2010 12:07:22 PM
I meant my reply was tangential.


LOL, I'm so used to wandering off on tangents I assume any comment of that variety is aimed my way :P

Yes, and my reply suggested that the underlying assumption of your arugment, that polygamy is bad, is problematic. I questioned your lumping of polygamy and incest into one big ball.


Polygamy = bad is not part of my argument, I am rather specifically trying not to make any argument at all, I raised both because they are relatively common 'atypical relations' that can be consensual, why necrophilia and bestiality are not mentioned. No moral judgement on any of the various relations mentioned are implied, or were meant to be implied. Obviously I do have my own views, which to save further confusion happens to be strong support of gay marriage, lukewarm support of polygamy, and a regrettable mind-bender on incest, I find it revolting but can't think of a reason it should be banned that doesn't apply to other things, hence me fishing other people's heads. ;)

Incest is a whole other ball game.

Because the babies go bad? The prohibition against incest is founded in very sound evolutionary science.


Considering the laws predate sound evolutionary science :P Anyway, two-parter, is their an ethical reason to ban incestuous marriage where there is no reason to believe bad babies will result (one or both partners sterile, old, using birth control, futuristic gene-tinkering) and 2) If 'bad babies' is a legal ground, where does that right for the state come from and is incest the only case it should be applicable? Does the state, by incest laws as precedent, have the right to ban procreation between any cases of significantly heightened genetic defects?
The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.
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Let's ban all Christian Marriage. Dannymac - 07/08/2010 06:36:13 AM 1763 Views
Nice satire, but it raises another point for me. Helene - 07/08/2010 07:20:49 AM 1148 Views
One small problem... Phelix - 07/08/2010 08:02:34 AM 1157 Views
Re tax. Rebekah - 07/08/2010 08:47:22 AM 1202 Views
That seems sensible to me. SilverWarder - 09/08/2010 08:13:26 PM 1098 Views
Not sure what you mean by "demoted." Dannymac - 07/08/2010 03:50:02 PM 1228 Views
Nice. *NM* Camilla - 07/08/2010 08:58:20 AM 663 Views
That would only be appropriate if Christians wanted to ban secular unions of normal people. Cannoli - 07/08/2010 11:51:29 AM 1414 Views
Hey, look! There was a point over there! Dannymac - 07/08/2010 03:46:41 PM 1227 Views
Who else should make those decisions? Cannoli - 07/08/2010 08:00:39 PM 1168 Views
I'd totally... Ectheledhel - 08/08/2010 04:14:15 AM 1079 Views
I'd totally... ßelals Girl - 08/08/2010 06:17:30 AM 1244 Views
You'd defend this idiot? *NM* Ectheledhel - 08/08/2010 06:40:34 AM 549 Views
Indeed ßelals Girl - 08/08/2010 06:43:53 AM 1177 Views
I used to think Joel was the biggest rambler on this site. I am seriously reconsidering. everynametaken - 08/08/2010 05:24:56 AM 1181 Views
And my assessment of one poster as the most content-poor, non-contributing slug is unchanged Cannoli - 08/08/2010 07:17:02 PM 1080 Views
Um, ok. *NM* everynametaken - 10/08/2010 12:48:19 AM 550 Views
*Shakes Head* Dannymac - 08/08/2010 06:23:47 AM 1056 Views
I highly doubt Cannoli is "scared" of homosexuals *NM* ßelals Girl - 08/08/2010 06:29:54 AM 588 Views
Perhaps not in the physical sense. Great Lord of Chaos - 08/08/2010 06:35:53 AM 1145 Views
Re: Perhaps not in the physical sense. ßelals Girl - 08/08/2010 06:46:56 AM 1099 Views
Gah! You did that on purpose! Vodalus - 09/08/2010 01:05:13 AM 1053 Views
whoops *NM* ßelals Girl - 09/08/2010 02:22:49 AM 508 Views
Re: *Shakes Head* Cannoli - 08/08/2010 07:43:11 PM 1092 Views
I still do not see how you think marriage is a "pointless" institution LadyLorraine - 08/08/2010 08:05:45 PM 1205 Views
No, I was referring to same-sex marriage. Real marriage hardly counts as a novelty. *NM* Cannoli - 11/08/2010 02:28:43 PM 491 Views
This must be the "thought out reaction" I've heard so much about. Dannymac - 08/08/2010 10:45:59 PM 1034 Views
You cannot be that stupid. Cannoli - 11/08/2010 03:10:55 PM 1320 Views
There's a lot of ridiculous arguments here, but I'll focus on just one of them... Legolas - 11/08/2010 03:38:05 PM 1258 Views
Incorrect. Genders are not treated equally. Dreaded Anomaly - 11/08/2010 07:53:00 PM 1422 Views
all you need is enough support to pass an amendment random thoughts - 08/08/2010 02:46:08 PM 1025 Views
A lot of the arguments would seem to justify polygamy and incest too Isaac - 08/08/2010 11:51:24 PM 1067 Views
And what is wrong with polygamy? *NM* Ectheledhel - 09/08/2010 10:36:53 AM 558 Views
Did I say there was anything? Isaac - 09/08/2010 11:03:10 AM 1184 Views
Plolygamy and incest are not on the same level of bad. Camilla - 09/08/2010 11:00:07 AM 1133 Views
Is that assumption valid? Isaac - 09/08/2010 11:36:26 AM 1054 Views
Re: Is that assumption valid? Camilla - 09/08/2010 11:46:42 AM 1049 Views
Re: Is that assumption valid? Isaac - 09/08/2010 12:07:22 PM 1159 Views
Not really snoopcester - 09/08/2010 01:20:46 PM 1022 Views
Re: Not really Isaac - 09/08/2010 01:27:04 PM 1146 Views
Re: Not really snoopcester - 09/08/2010 02:14:43 PM 1014 Views
Re: Not really Isaac - 09/08/2010 03:06:31 PM 1193 Views
Spoken like someone who does not have to insure an employee's six wives. Cannoli - 11/08/2010 03:11:57 PM 1187 Views
... Camilla - 11/08/2010 03:22:50 PM 1085 Views
Re: A lot of the arguments would seem to justify polygamy and incest too snoopcester - 09/08/2010 11:25:39 AM 1082 Views
Re: A lot of the arguments would seem to justify polygamy and incest too Isaac - 09/08/2010 11:51:50 AM 1054 Views
Re: A lot of the arguments would seem to justify polygamy and incest too snoopcester - 09/08/2010 01:18:35 PM 1138 Views
Re: A lot of the arguments would seem to justify polygamy and incest too Isaac - 09/08/2010 02:54:19 PM 1161 Views
Mmm, but when you're strictly discussing marriage LadyLorraine - 09/08/2010 06:13:30 PM 1195 Views
Re: Mmm, but when you're strictly discussing marriage Isaac - 10/08/2010 01:24:06 AM 1001 Views
Now I think about it, I'm not sure. Dannymac - 10/08/2010 04:09:43 PM 1122 Views
Re: Now I think about it, I'm not sure. Isaac - 10/08/2010 06:12:39 PM 1009 Views
Great post Danny SilverWarder - 09/08/2010 08:22:27 PM 885 Views
It should be noted again... Jeordam - 09/08/2010 08:59:32 PM 1169 Views
and how is it not a right? LadyLorraine - 09/08/2010 09:19:12 PM 1062 Views
My definition of rights... Jeordam - 09/08/2010 10:47:16 PM 1164 Views
mmm, but the UN has legally stated marriage as a right. LadyLorraine - 10/08/2010 02:52:03 AM 929 Views
+1 Napoleon62 - 10/08/2010 03:11:22 AM 1230 Views
Article 16 probably not a great example Isaac - 10/08/2010 03:44:04 AM 1025 Views
You could just as easily move the emphasis... Napoleon62 - 10/08/2010 04:08:46 AM 1174 Views
If we need a more specific resolution... Napoleon62 - 10/08/2010 04:22:12 AM 1360 Views
No, the choice of 'Men and Women' is too specific in the context Isaac - 10/08/2010 05:25:57 AM 1057 Views
Re: No, the choice of 'Men and Women' is too specific in the context Napoleon62 - 10/08/2010 03:04:39 PM 1368 Views
That's really a ridiculous stance, you do realize. Legolas - 10/08/2010 03:23:02 PM 974 Views
The point is that marriage IS a right, one which cannot be denied based upon sexual orientation *NM* Napoleon62 - 10/08/2010 07:04:16 PM 776 Views
Re: No, the choice of 'Men and Women' is too specific in the context Isaac - 10/08/2010 03:46:56 PM 1221 Views
It doesn't say a man can only marry a woman or vice versa, though. Dreaded Anomaly - 10/08/2010 04:24:17 AM 1041 Views
It also doesn't say they can Isaac - 10/08/2010 04:41:18 AM 1041 Views
You're missing the point. It's not about gay marriage. Legolas - 10/08/2010 11:20:59 AM 1055 Views
No, I got that, I'm pointing out how it does so Isaac - 10/08/2010 01:47:00 PM 1054 Views
I know, and that's been brought up before. But that's not my point. LadyLorraine - 10/08/2010 06:09:32 PM 1025 Views
Re: I know, and that's been brought up before. But that's not my point. Isaac - 10/08/2010 06:33:56 PM 958 Views
It's mentioned as a right in some SC decision quoted in that Walker opinion. *NM* Legolas - 10/08/2010 06:51:13 PM 502 Views
To clarify for you SilverWarder - 10/08/2010 05:36:14 AM 1036 Views
The UNSC is actually the UN's enforcement body... Napoleon62 - 10/08/2010 07:16:31 PM 1417 Views
I'm not sure that I would call the Security Council the 'Enforcement Body' SilverWarder - 10/08/2010 08:43:02 PM 1032 Views
The fact that it is capable of authorizing the use of military force makes it an enforcement body Napoleon62 - 10/08/2010 10:33:59 PM 1311 Views
Disagree - but it's most a matter of definition there SilverWarder - 11/08/2010 04:31:53 PM 1189 Views
What the UN thinks is *completely* worthless.... Jeordam - 10/08/2010 06:43:15 PM 980 Views
and the Constitution dictates nothing about marriage. *NM* LadyLorraine - 10/08/2010 11:46:24 PM 532 Views
That means it is up to the people. And they say "No." *NM* Cannoli - 11/08/2010 03:13:12 PM 540 Views
No, but it does dictate things about rights and discrimination SilverWarder - 12/08/2010 03:48:02 PM 1223 Views
Why don't YOU back up your assertion that the right to marry exists? *NM* Cannoli - 11/08/2010 03:16:02 PM 542 Views
The actual ruling on Prop 8 specifices marriage as a freedom, not a right. Dreaded Anomaly - 10/08/2010 12:02:17 AM 1149 Views
Out of curiosity, what would you say to using the Ninth Amendment, possibly in conjunction... Vodalus - 10/08/2010 12:20:19 AM 1210 Views
I agree LadyLorraine - 10/08/2010 06:11:19 PM 908 Views
Yeah but this can't be used to prove that it IS a right... Napoleon62 - 10/08/2010 07:30:57 PM 1305 Views
Note it all you want... Dannymac - 10/08/2010 06:43:53 AM 906 Views
No, they seek to expand the terms of the partnership. Homosexuals can & do get married normally *NM* Cannoli - 11/08/2010 03:14:25 PM 576 Views
The best one yet. Camilla - 10/08/2010 07:59:17 PM 1162 Views
Yeah, I'd agree that's pretty insane SilverWarder - 10/08/2010 08:49:24 PM 1031 Views
Re: Yeah, I'd agree that's pretty insane Camilla - 10/08/2010 09:03:11 PM 1136 Views
Re: Yeah, I'd agree that's pretty insane SilverWarder - 11/08/2010 04:35:03 PM 1040 Views
Re: Yeah, I'd agree that's pretty insane Camilla - 11/08/2010 04:41:23 PM 1177 Views
Hmm - been a long time since I read my copy of the graphic novel SilverWarder - 11/08/2010 05:06:47 PM 1145 Views
Re: Hmm - been a long time since I read my copy of the graphic novel Camilla - 11/08/2010 05:09:23 PM 1090 Views
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