I'll save you most of the jargon, but in short, the section of our constitution that forbade practicing homosexuals from being Ordained to Ministry of Word and Sacrament has been lifted. It doesn't force churches to ordain homosexuals, but it allows them to do so.
First, let me wish PCUSA well, I hope this decision - which I am dubious on - does not rupture your fellowship.
If I understand this correctly, as a whole the ban is lifted but churches may still reject people on those grounds, which appeals to my localized control of things even if I can't see a scriptural justification for this. But can you, if possible, list a few other things which are still banned, or which also are, like this, left to the individual churches?
And somewhat separately, is homosexuality still being considered a sin, also separately, I gather gay marriage was also on the table, can you address that in this context?
This is one of those things that I was never quite sure would happen in my lifetime. I am extremely proud of my denomination right now. It won't be easy, and a lot of folks are likely to leave. But better folks leaving by choice then being forced out by polity, in my opinion.
Having been raised Unitarian - at least until I was old enough to look up the term 'atheist' - I can tell you that the only thing worse than a religion with doctrinal disputes is one without any, either because they permit none or can't have any. I guess the silver lining is knowing that everyone involved cares enough about the Word of God to argue about it or even break fellowship.
The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.
- Albert Einstein
King of Cairhien 20-7-2
Chancellor of the Landsraad, Archduke of Is'Mod
- Albert Einstein
King of Cairhien 20-7-2
Chancellor of the Landsraad, Archduke of Is'Mod
Presbyterian Church (USA) passes Amendment 10-A.
- 11/05/2011 05:39:29 PM
1498 Views
What's the language? Did they at least TRY to give a doctrinal justification?
- 12/05/2011 02:10:46 AM
1074 Views
Thank you for that rousing argument against married priests.
- 12/05/2011 03:36:51 AM
996 Views
Why ARE you letting women into the priesthood?
- 12/05/2011 04:16:50 AM
923 Views
Because Episcopalians don't listen to the Bible much.
- 12/05/2011 05:47:03 AM
859 Views
That's just fine as far as I'm concerned
- 12/05/2011 02:23:44 PM
888 Views
Yes, I suppose a church could go that route.
- 14/05/2011 07:38:02 AM
834 Views
I'm not attempting to impose a dichotomy on the Bible.
- 14/05/2011 03:25:30 PM
913 Views
I don't even know what following the Bible in its entirety means.
- 14/05/2011 09:09:10 PM
1075 Views
As an exercise, I tried to think of how I would justify allowing homosexuals as clergy.
- 14/05/2011 04:19:43 PM
906 Views
Thanks (I'm actually OK with women priests though).
- 12/05/2011 07:09:11 AM
963 Views
There's ample precedent for female religious leaders, even within the bible.
- 12/05/2011 06:51:05 AM
1011 Views
Since when is Moses' society the be-all end all?
- 12/05/2011 07:12:41 PM
863 Views
Since never, which is why I referenced five other eras you completely ignored.
- 14/05/2011 01:11:30 AM
968 Views
They did so, via negativa.
- 12/05/2011 04:22:17 PM
1040 Views
Sorry for the delay, particularly since it looks like I'll be spending a fair amount of time here.
- 14/05/2011 12:31:33 AM
842 Views
Your church has a constitution?!
- 12/05/2011 03:36:41 AM
904 Views
My Church has a congress!
*NM*
- 12/05/2011 03:37:52 AM
431 Views
*NM*
- 12/05/2011 03:37:52 AM
431 Views
Haha no way! *NM*
- 12/05/2011 03:46:32 AM
393 Views
Well, we have one group of laity and one of bishops, so it is only mildy utter chaos.
*NM*
- 12/05/2011 05:51:09 AM
428 Views
*NM*
- 12/05/2011 05:51:09 AM
428 Views
I'm happy to hear this, personally. I also wonder how you reconcile this with the Bible.
- 12/05/2011 04:11:31 AM
1077 Views
Every direct reference to homosexuality in the Bible is a reference to rape.
- 12/05/2011 04:12:43 PM
907 Views
Every single word that you wrote in your response is complete bullshit.
- 12/05/2011 05:50:07 PM
1041 Views
Knock off your eisegesis, try some exegesis
- 12/05/2011 07:02:45 PM
947 Views
I'm trying to figure out just what your "gifts" are, because I don't see any.
- 12/05/2011 07:30:39 PM
921 Views
There are cases in which hypocrisy is far better than the alternatives.
- 12/05/2011 10:04:32 PM
996 Views
Hypocrisy is better than, say, setting gays on fire, yes.
- 12/05/2011 10:10:40 PM
972 Views
My statement is that, from a pragmatic point of view, hypocrisy shouldn't be discouraged too much.
- 13/05/2011 10:05:39 PM
993 Views
Oh, is that how we're playing this, then?
- 13/05/2011 06:29:31 PM
928 Views
I'm not playing. I'm pointing out some glaring errors on your part.
- 13/05/2011 07:25:08 PM
832 Views
The Bible says what it says. The problem... people like to tell us just what else it's saying.
- 13/05/2011 05:31:29 PM
897 Views
You don't reconcile... you pick the parts you like and adjust the rest to suit you.
- 13/05/2011 09:33:54 PM
818 Views
Another example...
- 12/05/2011 09:19:52 AM
819 Views
If you claim to follow the entire Bible, then you are completely correct.
- 12/05/2011 06:04:38 PM
814 Views
On the contrary, this move will take some butts out of the seats.
- 12/05/2011 07:16:22 PM
873 Views
We both know that isn't the case
- 12/05/2011 07:55:41 PM
976 Views
Cool cool. I have a question on a semi-related note, about Protestant Gospels
- 12/05/2011 05:33:49 PM
931 Views
No Protestant denomination has added so much as a word to the Bible
- 12/05/2011 05:58:16 PM
811 Views
So, everyone hates Judith, then?
- 12/05/2011 06:40:11 PM
892 Views
The Catholics and Eastern Orthodox Churches accept Judith as part of Scripture.
- 12/05/2011 07:51:27 PM
836 Views
Does the Eastern Orthodox Church also segregate deuterocanonical works like Roman Catholicism does?
- 14/05/2011 02:19:03 AM
1150 Views
The Eastern Church bases everything on the Septuagint.
- 14/05/2011 02:34:41 AM
894 Views
That sounds appealing, and makes sense.
- 14/05/2011 02:44:56 AM
902 Views
Oh, I just enjoy calling Protestants "heretics" to remind them not everyone agrees with them.
- 14/05/2011 03:25:42 AM
850 Views
Re: Cool cool. I have a question on a semi-related note, about Protestant Gospels
- 12/05/2011 08:52:48 PM
873 Views
The NIV is terrible. The NASB has the best translation I have found (of the NT, at least).
- 12/05/2011 10:43:58 PM
1017 Views
I find this really weird, to be honest
- 13/05/2011 05:48:28 AM
926 Views
Well, it wasn't just Athanasius. But yes, we are lucky in that respect. *NM*
- 13/05/2011 06:32:48 AM
366 Views
Athanasius's list reflected the victory of Pauline Christianity
- 13/05/2011 02:52:53 PM
842 Views
There's a school of thought that says that's a strong vindication of Athanasius.
- 14/05/2011 02:37:49 AM
795 Views
- 14/05/2011 02:37:49 AM
795 Views
Since I haven't gotten around to asking yet...
- 13/05/2011 07:14:01 PM
838 Views

*NM*