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No. Ghavrel Send a noteboard - 25/05/2013 10:28:24 PM
  1. I'm a Christian.
  2. The first sentence of the post in question was "I think it's a misogynistic and authoritarian faith that doesn't, at least in this Wahabi period, devote nearly enough time to introspection"

Obviously, I don't have a problem with people criticizing Islam, since I do so in that very post. What I do have a problem with is people criticizing it without taking into perspective similar issues their own faith and race has faced in the past.

"We feel safe when we read what we recognise, what does not challenge our way of thinking.... a steady acceptance of pre-arranged patterns leads to the inability to question what we are told."
~Camilla

Ghavrel is Ghavrel is Ghavrel

*MySmiley*

This message last edited by Ghavrel on 25/05/2013 at 10:29:18 PM
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Maybe it is time to start treating muslims a little differently? Anonymous2000 - 23/05/2013 03:55:28 AM 2586 Views
Nah, you're just a bigot. *NM* Ghavrel - 23/05/2013 08:21:33 AM 737 Views
Yes, I am against religions that call for violence. *NM* Anonymous2000 - 23/05/2013 12:23:31 PM 640 Views
Wasn't aware you were against Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Zoroastrianism, Shinto... *NM* Ghavrel - 23/05/2013 12:59:04 PM 718 Views
Where does Christianity call for violence? Jeordam - 23/05/2013 03:55:11 PM 1107 Views
Dueteronomy 13: 1-5 states that you must kill prophets of other religions. Hieshyn - 23/05/2013 07:44:48 PM 1172 Views
The Old Testament is not Christianity. It is where Christianity CAME from. *NM* HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 09:25:12 PM 664 Views
FALSE! Dannymac - 24/05/2013 01:41:50 PM 1205 Views
*sigh* And in fulfilling the "law" he created a new covenant which supplanted the old.. HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 06:09:43 PM 1166 Views
All the death of Christ did was attone for the sins of the world. Hieshyn - 26/05/2013 03:00:26 AM 1316 Views
Sorry, you are wrong. HyogaRott - 28/05/2013 04:17:51 PM 1170 Views
...I can think of a rather larger difference. Starts with J and ends with S. *NM* Ghavrel - 28/05/2013 11:54:28 PM 746 Views
Yeah, but not really, both religions acknowledge his existence, but differ on his role. HyogaRott - 29/05/2013 06:00:03 PM 1183 Views
Net result: All of God's children can enter into Heaven. Hieshyn - 30/05/2013 05:26:20 PM 1369 Views
No. The New Covenant SUPPLEMENTS, not supplants, the Old. Joel - 12/08/2013 02:45:55 AM 1468 Views
Ok....and? Jeordam - 23/05/2013 10:36:55 PM 1035 Views
You asked for an example, I gave one. I'm not here to argue with you. *NM* Hieshyn - 26/05/2013 02:57:27 AM 666 Views
You might want to slap some qualifiers on there *NM* Isaac - 23/05/2013 07:50:43 PM 702 Views
Actually, I very intentionally didn't put any qualifiers on that... Jeordam - 23/05/2013 10:38:24 PM 1108 Views
The Cleansing of the Temple shows a legitimized use of physical force. *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 05:05:55 AM 752 Views
Oh, boo hoo.... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 03:50:18 PM 1178 Views
LOL. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 04:45:50 PM 1108 Views
Violence.... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 05:32:47 PM 1088 Views
Whipping people to drive them away of something is violence. It's not negotiable. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 06:06:42 PM 968 Views
You are something... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 06:29:03 PM 1036 Views
We've gone from "Where does Christianity call for violence?" to "not all violence is bad." *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 09:09:30 PM 730 Views
To be fair, that is a good journey to make. Joel - 12/08/2013 02:51:17 AM 1094 Views
Also, spanking has been pretty soundly debunked as good parenting. Maybe not a good analogy. *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 06:16:18 PM 696 Views
Because children are more behaved now.... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 06:21:43 PM 1013 Views
I don't favor spanking but the studies 'debunking it' are mostly 'bunk' Isaac - 24/05/2013 10:29:28 PM 1116 Views
Yes. nossy - 24/05/2013 10:42:51 PM 1056 Views
Re: Yes. Isaac - 25/05/2013 12:22:56 AM 1082 Views
Congratulations; you now understand why (or one reason) my posts tend to run long. Joel - 12/08/2013 02:53:24 AM 1321 Views
You know better than that. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 06:52:32 AM 1081 Views
I think you just claimed that my statement as to my opinion is anecdotal evidence of that opinion Isaac - 25/05/2013 09:26:21 AM 1187 Views
I was talking about your reference to your upbringing as relevant to the statistical trend. *NM* Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 09:49:19 AM 650 Views
Yes, but I wasn't claiming it was relevant in that way Isaac - 25/05/2013 10:15:52 AM 1050 Views
... ? *NM* Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 12:58:43 PM 686 Views
I couldn't remember the code for *NM* Isaac - 25/05/2013 07:57:48 PM 643 Views
I wouldn't belong to any other kind of religion. Cannoli - 25/05/2013 01:21:45 AM 1067 Views
And the night was finished with a mob of white men attacking the police in the name of bigotry snoopcester - 23/05/2013 09:51:02 AM 1001 Views
In the name of a religion that preaches violence? Anonymous2000 - 23/05/2013 12:21:59 PM 1153 Views
Islam "preaches" violence just about as much as Christianity does. Nebhead - 23/05/2013 12:46:00 PM 1087 Views
it's actually pretty funny because many people understand Islam to, derivatively, mean peace Fox and Ravens - 23/05/2013 01:44:18 PM 1090 Views
Your argument is logically flawed Tom - 23/05/2013 02:02:33 PM 1167 Views
Re: Your argument is logically flawed Fox and Ravens - 23/05/2013 02:34:22 PM 1190 Views
No, it actaully does not. HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 01:51:51 PM 1169 Views
Maybe they will be, I don't know, KILLED for standing up Nighthawk - 23/05/2013 02:24:59 PM 967 Views
Exactly HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 03:52:25 PM 1098 Views
Couple of things nossy - 23/05/2013 08:13:57 PM 1398 Views
Unfortunately they are NOT consistant in their messaging... see my link HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 09:30:53 PM 1289 Views
Well, "consistent" doesn't mean "never says things HyogaRott doesn't support." nossy - 23/05/2013 09:46:51 PM 1039 Views
There is a difference between putting forth a good PR spin occasionally and making a stand. HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 01:55:48 AM 998 Views
Really? Of all the criticisms you could make of Qaradawi, you whine about that? Legolas - 23/05/2013 09:58:50 PM 1116 Views
I think the key point there is that the MCB supported him for a visa in spite of that... Isaac - 23/05/2013 11:05:14 PM 1071 Views
So much for my attempt to bring a little levity to things. Legolas - 24/05/2013 08:07:24 PM 1108 Views
My ability to detect humor and sarcasm in writing is very sporadic Isaac - 24/05/2013 10:28:03 PM 979 Views
That's a shame. Legolas - 24/05/2013 11:55:37 PM 920 Views
Re: That's a shame. Isaac - 25/05/2013 02:25:31 AM 1014 Views
Re: That's a shame. Legolas - 25/05/2013 12:17:13 PM 929 Views
Sure, I'll bite. Legolas - 23/05/2013 09:23:54 PM 1093 Views
Until the "unwashed masses" no longer show up dancing in the streets... HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 09:40:59 PM 1021 Views
I hope you like black and white. nossy - 23/05/2013 09:50:03 PM 970 Views
Not sure which point you think I missed that I should have responded to... HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 01:52:20 AM 1027 Views
I think I must have confused you. nossy - 24/05/2013 08:46:42 PM 935 Views
I suppose that depends on which "points" precisely you thought you were making. Legolas - 23/05/2013 09:54:55 PM 1036 Views
Not really HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 02:36:41 AM 1050 Views
Yawn. Bored now. Legolas - 24/05/2013 08:18:27 PM 973 Views
whatever *NM* HyogaRott - 28/05/2013 04:18:56 PM 596 Views
Do "unwashed masses" publicly APOLOGIZING for terrorism count? Joel - 12/08/2013 03:04:56 AM 1282 Views
Re: No, it actaully does not. Stephen - 24/05/2013 02:29:04 AM 1164 Views
Now let's not start with bullshit here Tom - 23/05/2013 01:54:48 PM 1362 Views
Tom, this is a rare occurance when we agree. HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 03:59:49 PM 960 Views
That may be so, but the response was addressed to Ben. Tom - 23/05/2013 04:13:47 PM 1084 Views
Oops, my bad messed up reading the discussion tree... HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 06:15:34 PM 1044 Views
Excellent post - anyone that thinks all religions are the same is a complete moron. Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:32:26 AM 1197 Views
I don't approve of a great deal of popular Islamic thought. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 05:13:51 AM 1198 Views
My thoughts exactly. *NM* ironclad - 24/05/2013 09:13:18 AM 594 Views
I agree. *NM* Stephen - 24/05/2013 12:05:46 PM 651 Views
Do you think that it will truly happen? Jeordam - 24/05/2013 05:47:50 PM 1159 Views
Might have something to do with colonialists ruining everything they can get their hands on. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 06:09:13 PM 1043 Views
The first step on the road to recovery is aknowledging your responsibility for where you are and do HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 06:22:42 PM 1003 Views
Oh, so its our fault... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 06:38:14 PM 1062 Views
It's always our fault *NM* ßelals Girl - 24/05/2013 07:40:24 PM 779 Views
In general, I agree nossy - 24/05/2013 09:01:53 PM 1187 Views
That word "our" is interesting, don't you think? Legolas - 24/05/2013 09:09:24 PM 1034 Views
That was beautiful. *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 09:12:09 PM 714 Views
No, Ghavrel was doing that ßelals Girl - 25/05/2013 12:03:09 AM 1127 Views
I'm sure we all do it, that's kind of the point. Legolas - 25/05/2013 12:26:25 AM 980 Views
but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. ßelals Girl - 25/05/2013 02:20:21 AM 1171 Views
Exactly. Tom - 25/05/2013 06:26:57 AM 1106 Views
Hyperbole? nossy - 25/05/2013 09:57:56 PM 915 Views
Has anyone ever told you that? Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:33:32 PM 1176 Views
No, I really don't think so. Legolas - 25/05/2013 11:18:05 AM 978 Views
*bashes face against keyboard in frustration* ßelals Girl - 25/05/2013 09:28:58 PM 977 Views
Perhaps I should bow out and let Ghavrel speak for himself, then. Legolas - 25/05/2013 09:53:28 PM 1134 Views
It's accurate. *NM* Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:25:04 PM 662 Views
Re: but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. nossy - 25/05/2013 09:49:48 PM 1035 Views
Re: but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 12:48:45 AM 1152 Views
Hm nossy - 26/05/2013 10:10:49 AM 1118 Views
Also, yeah. Historically oppressive groups aren't equal to historically oppressed groups. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:31:58 PM 1108 Views
Too simplistic AND a blatant justification for double standards I thought you didn't have ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 01:02:07 AM 1099 Views
That's not racism. Racism requires systematic oppression. *NM* Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 01:14:08 AM 654 Views
No ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 01:57:11 AM 1118 Views
Where whitey firmly belongs, in no small part because of posts like that. Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 02:00:59 AM 1085 Views
Lulz, you're claiming every member of a group deserves something because of what I said? ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 02:11:36 AM 1048 Views
And now you know how Muslims feel. *NM* Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 03:48:33 AM 671 Views
I already knew ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 04:02:02 AM 1017 Views
Just about every group has historically oppressed and BEEN oppressed at some time. Joel - 12/08/2013 04:00:54 AM 1116 Views
No. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:28:24 PM 1030 Views
Oh, I don't think he's talking about past "colonialism" only. Tom - 25/05/2013 06:18:11 AM 1054 Views
Possibly. Some people do, to be sure, and there is some truth in that view. Legolas - 25/05/2013 11:27:36 AM 952 Views
What a load of bullshit. Tom - 25/05/2013 06:14:02 AM 1047 Views
I don't think you can reasonably claim to separate Salafi thought from the geopolitics of the time. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:23:03 PM 1063 Views
This is why I want to get the HELL out of there. Joel - 12/08/2013 04:16:39 AM 1196 Views
The difference with Islam is they lost the empire game but they were conquers random thoughts - 27/05/2013 12:42:05 AM 1175 Views
I'm gonna have to disagree with some of that. Legolas - 27/05/2013 07:06:53 PM 1015 Views
Yes it was very complex and the Crusaders were not saints (even the sainted ones) random thoughts - 29/05/2013 04:15:57 AM 1113 Views
Fair enough on all counts, then. *NM* Legolas - 29/05/2013 07:37:34 PM 627 Views
No, it had a bunch of opportunistic brown folks systematically dismantling it for centuries. Joel - 12/08/2013 03:43:00 AM 1050 Views
Some of my ancestors lived and caved and bashed each over the heads with rocks random thoughts - 26/05/2013 04:38:56 PM 1058 Views
Well yes. nossy - 26/05/2013 05:08:08 PM 1007 Views
I would prefer to say that random thoughts - 27/05/2013 01:26:57 AM 1220 Views
Of course you would. nossy - 27/05/2013 10:19:46 AM 1119 Views
I in no way support profiling people based on race or religion random thoughts - 29/05/2013 04:11:01 AM 1179 Views
Ok. nossy - 29/05/2013 08:54:34 PM 1191 Views
I think about the evolution of Western religion a lot. Joel - 12/08/2013 03:23:37 AM 1401 Views
There has been 14,000+ terrorist actions in the name of Islam since 9/11. Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:30:30 AM 1275 Views
That isn't a grown up answer. snoopcester - 23/05/2013 04:35:16 PM 1124 Views
Re: In the name of a religion that preaches violence? ßelals Girl - 23/05/2013 07:28:42 PM 1118 Views
His head will only be chopped off is he draws or insults Muhammad! *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:34:21 AM 696 Views
What does he have to do to get on TV? *NM* ßelals Girl - 24/05/2013 07:45:53 PM 620 Views
Statistically snoopcester - 24/05/2013 10:22:29 AM 1177 Views
What kind of horrifying bugs to you guys HAVE over there??? ßelals Girl - 24/05/2013 02:13:23 PM 1161 Views
Hardly any snoopcester - 24/05/2013 02:16:46 PM 1292 Views
Your solution is profiling...because it's time to *stop* thinking all folks are the same? *NM* Sareitha Sedai - 23/05/2013 02:36:32 PM 603 Views
I don't think we've ever encouraged people to think all folks are the same Isaac - 23/05/2013 07:29:54 PM 987 Views
"Perhaps it's time to stop thinking all folks are the same?" ~A2k Sareitha Sedai - 23/05/2013 07:49:12 PM 968 Views
I think he's pointing to the encuragement of willful blindedness with that remark Isaac - 23/05/2013 08:15:55 PM 1010 Views
I think probably not. nossy - 23/05/2013 07:57:53 PM 1067 Views
See Tom's post above for the facts..... *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:36:18 AM 616 Views
That your original post was absurd? Thank you, but I got that on my own. *NM* nossy - 24/05/2013 09:09:21 PM 614 Views
It shows what a silly little fool you are, but that's your choice. *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 09:19:04 PM 600 Views
Hey man, you're the one who told me Tom's post had the facts. nossy - 24/05/2013 09:20:53 PM 986 Views
It means exactly what I said. He did a great job! *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 09:23:44 PM 653 Views
Yes, he did. nossy - 24/05/2013 09:30:42 PM 1038 Views
Also, don't tell him I said I take him seriously. *NM* nossy - 24/05/2013 09:34:59 PM 639 Views
But wouldn't religion-based profile activities... Jeordam - 23/05/2013 10:54:33 PM 976 Views
My brain is slow right now, but I think I completely agree. nossy - 23/05/2013 11:00:31 PM 1115 Views
You mean like this? Larry - 24/05/2013 08:15:16 PM 1163 Views
Sorry bu the comparison isn't valid random thoughts - 25/05/2013 09:50:34 PM 998 Views
+1 - Larry is an honest guy and will realize his error. *NM* Anonymous2000 - 25/05/2013 10:53:14 PM 646 Views
Numbers alone do not change the validity of such Larry - 25/05/2013 11:15:17 PM 1085 Views
Yes it does. Anonymous2000 - 26/05/2013 12:23:27 AM 1078 Views
*sigh* Larry - 26/05/2013 12:46:49 AM 991 Views
I think asking most Americans for recognition of a non-binary political paradigm is a bit much. *NM* Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 01:16:30 AM 666 Views
no liberalisn is sane and well thought in comparison random thoughts - 26/05/2013 04:04:39 PM 967 Views
no but they do tell a story random thoughts - 26/05/2013 04:27:26 PM 906 Views
UPDATE - Cleric/Teacher of one of the murderers praises him for "courage". Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 09:22:24 PM 1085 Views
Do you have a functional link? *NM* Stephen - 25/05/2013 12:19:01 AM 658 Views
The link works for me (Yahoo news) - here is the text. Anonymous2000 - 25/05/2013 02:05:41 AM 1246 Views
Re: Maybe it is time to start treating muslims a little differently? dart_board - 27/05/2013 02:28:31 PM 1669 Views
Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. nossy - 27/05/2013 03:22:41 PM 1109 Views
Just as a little aside Tom - 28/05/2013 12:51:48 AM 1008 Views
Ever helpful. nossy - 28/05/2013 10:23:12 PM 1187 Views
Re: Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. dart_board - 28/05/2013 04:56:55 PM 1571 Views
Re: Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. nossy - 28/05/2013 10:18:40 PM 1159 Views
Re: Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. dart_board - 29/05/2013 08:57:17 PM 1607 Views
I'm having warm feelings. nossy - 29/05/2013 09:38:45 PM 1157 Views
Re: I'm having warm feelings. dart_board - 30/05/2013 12:46:57 AM 1462 Views
"Who else? Major League Baseball. " Joel - 12/08/2013 04:34:48 AM 1375 Views
I can't believe I missed this thread. *NM* Dan - 01/06/2013 10:08:08 AM 884 Views
How much did you miss it, really? Joel - 12/08/2013 04:38:21 AM 1075 Views
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