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No, Ghavrel was doing that ßelals Girl Send a noteboard - 25/05/2013 12:03:09 AM

We were told by Ghavrel in the post that started this subthread that it's wrong for Christians to condemn Islam and its current issues because our own religion doesn't have a squeaky clean history. So, if he feels that Christians today aren't allowed to take the moral high ground because of actions comitted by other Christians centuries before we were even born, then yeah, we've kinda already been lumped in with them by him and it isn't strange that Jeordam is therefore operating off of that assumption when he replies to Ghavrel's subsequent posts.

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Maybe it is time to start treating muslims a little differently? Anonymous2000 - 23/05/2013 03:55:28 AM 3117 Views
Nah, you're just a bigot. *NM* Ghavrel - 23/05/2013 08:21:33 AM 1041 Views
Yes, I am against religions that call for violence. *NM* Anonymous2000 - 23/05/2013 12:23:31 PM 959 Views
Wasn't aware you were against Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Zoroastrianism, Shinto... *NM* Ghavrel - 23/05/2013 12:59:04 PM 1005 Views
Where does Christianity call for violence? Jeordam - 23/05/2013 03:55:11 PM 1608 Views
Dueteronomy 13: 1-5 states that you must kill prophets of other religions. Hieshyn - 23/05/2013 07:44:48 PM 1723 Views
The Old Testament is not Christianity. It is where Christianity CAME from. *NM* HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 09:25:12 PM 964 Views
FALSE! Dannymac - 24/05/2013 01:41:50 PM 1741 Views
*sigh* And in fulfilling the "law" he created a new covenant which supplanted the old.. HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 06:09:43 PM 1694 Views
All the death of Christ did was attone for the sins of the world. Hieshyn - 26/05/2013 03:00:26 AM 1931 Views
Sorry, you are wrong. HyogaRott - 28/05/2013 04:17:51 PM 1711 Views
...I can think of a rather larger difference. Starts with J and ends with S. *NM* Ghavrel - 28/05/2013 11:54:28 PM 1044 Views
Yeah, but not really, both religions acknowledge his existence, but differ on his role. HyogaRott - 29/05/2013 06:00:03 PM 1714 Views
Net result: All of God's children can enter into Heaven. Hieshyn - 30/05/2013 05:26:20 PM 1933 Views
No. The New Covenant SUPPLEMENTS, not supplants, the Old. Joel - 12/08/2013 02:45:55 AM 2001 Views
Ok....and? Jeordam - 23/05/2013 10:36:55 PM 1583 Views
You asked for an example, I gave one. I'm not here to argue with you. *NM* Hieshyn - 26/05/2013 02:57:27 AM 972 Views
You might want to slap some qualifiers on there *NM* Isaac - 23/05/2013 07:50:43 PM 987 Views
Actually, I very intentionally didn't put any qualifiers on that... Jeordam - 23/05/2013 10:38:24 PM 1647 Views
The Cleansing of the Temple shows a legitimized use of physical force. *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 05:05:55 AM 1028 Views
Oh, boo hoo.... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 03:50:18 PM 1684 Views
LOL. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 04:45:50 PM 1629 Views
Violence.... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 05:32:47 PM 1665 Views
Whipping people to drive them away of something is violence. It's not negotiable. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 06:06:42 PM 1507 Views
You are something... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 06:29:03 PM 1594 Views
We've gone from "Where does Christianity call for violence?" to "not all violence is bad." *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 09:09:30 PM 1034 Views
To be fair, that is a good journey to make. Joel - 12/08/2013 02:51:17 AM 1611 Views
Also, spanking has been pretty soundly debunked as good parenting. Maybe not a good analogy. *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 06:16:18 PM 993 Views
Because children are more behaved now.... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 06:21:43 PM 1546 Views
I don't favor spanking but the studies 'debunking it' are mostly 'bunk' Isaac - 24/05/2013 10:29:28 PM 1640 Views
Yes. nossy - 24/05/2013 10:42:51 PM 1551 Views
Re: Yes. Isaac - 25/05/2013 12:22:56 AM 1641 Views
Congratulations; you now understand why (or one reason) my posts tend to run long. Joel - 12/08/2013 02:53:24 AM 1832 Views
You know better than that. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 06:52:32 AM 1623 Views
I think you just claimed that my statement as to my opinion is anecdotal evidence of that opinion Isaac - 25/05/2013 09:26:21 AM 1713 Views
I was talking about your reference to your upbringing as relevant to the statistical trend. *NM* Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 09:49:19 AM 932 Views
Yes, but I wasn't claiming it was relevant in that way Isaac - 25/05/2013 10:15:52 AM 1577 Views
... ? *NM* Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 12:58:43 PM 1022 Views
I couldn't remember the code for *NM* Isaac - 25/05/2013 07:57:48 PM 928 Views
I wouldn't belong to any other kind of religion. Cannoli - 25/05/2013 01:21:45 AM 1609 Views
And the night was finished with a mob of white men attacking the police in the name of bigotry snoopcester - 23/05/2013 09:51:02 AM 1505 Views
In the name of a religion that preaches violence? Anonymous2000 - 23/05/2013 12:21:59 PM 1662 Views
Islam "preaches" violence just about as much as Christianity does. Nebhead - 23/05/2013 12:46:00 PM 1650 Views
it's actually pretty funny because many people understand Islam to, derivatively, mean peace Fox and Ravens - 23/05/2013 01:44:18 PM 1636 Views
Your argument is logically flawed Tom - 23/05/2013 02:02:33 PM 1713 Views
Re: Your argument is logically flawed Fox and Ravens - 23/05/2013 02:34:22 PM 1732 Views
No, it actaully does not. HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 01:51:51 PM 1693 Views
Maybe they will be, I don't know, KILLED for standing up Nighthawk - 23/05/2013 02:24:59 PM 1516 Views
Exactly HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 03:52:25 PM 1660 Views
Couple of things nossy - 23/05/2013 08:13:57 PM 1965 Views
Unfortunately they are NOT consistant in their messaging... see my link HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 09:30:53 PM 1810 Views
Well, "consistent" doesn't mean "never says things HyogaRott doesn't support." nossy - 23/05/2013 09:46:51 PM 1578 Views
There is a difference between putting forth a good PR spin occasionally and making a stand. HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 01:55:48 AM 1609 Views
Really? Of all the criticisms you could make of Qaradawi, you whine about that? Legolas - 23/05/2013 09:58:50 PM 1635 Views
I think the key point there is that the MCB supported him for a visa in spite of that... Isaac - 23/05/2013 11:05:14 PM 1646 Views
So much for my attempt to bring a little levity to things. Legolas - 24/05/2013 08:07:24 PM 1664 Views
My ability to detect humor and sarcasm in writing is very sporadic Isaac - 24/05/2013 10:28:03 PM 1524 Views
That's a shame. Legolas - 24/05/2013 11:55:37 PM 1480 Views
Re: That's a shame. Isaac - 25/05/2013 02:25:31 AM 1512 Views
Re: That's a shame. Legolas - 25/05/2013 12:17:13 PM 1468 Views
Sure, I'll bite. Legolas - 23/05/2013 09:23:54 PM 1681 Views
Until the "unwashed masses" no longer show up dancing in the streets... HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 09:40:59 PM 1573 Views
I hope you like black and white. nossy - 23/05/2013 09:50:03 PM 1474 Views
Not sure which point you think I missed that I should have responded to... HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 01:52:20 AM 1599 Views
I think I must have confused you. nossy - 24/05/2013 08:46:42 PM 1469 Views
I suppose that depends on which "points" precisely you thought you were making. Legolas - 23/05/2013 09:54:55 PM 1547 Views
Not really HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 02:36:41 AM 1575 Views
Yawn. Bored now. Legolas - 24/05/2013 08:18:27 PM 1506 Views
whatever *NM* HyogaRott - 28/05/2013 04:18:56 PM 872 Views
Do "unwashed masses" publicly APOLOGIZING for terrorism count? Joel - 12/08/2013 03:04:56 AM 1811 Views
Re: No, it actaully does not. Stephen - 24/05/2013 02:29:04 AM 1680 Views
Now let's not start with bullshit here Tom - 23/05/2013 01:54:48 PM 1913 Views
Tom, this is a rare occurance when we agree. HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 03:59:49 PM 1498 Views
That may be so, but the response was addressed to Ben. Tom - 23/05/2013 04:13:47 PM 1607 Views
Oops, my bad messed up reading the discussion tree... HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 06:15:34 PM 1551 Views
Excellent post - anyone that thinks all religions are the same is a complete moron. Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:32:26 AM 1741 Views
I don't approve of a great deal of popular Islamic thought. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 05:13:51 AM 1765 Views
My thoughts exactly. *NM* ironclad - 24/05/2013 09:13:18 AM 894 Views
I agree. *NM* Stephen - 24/05/2013 12:05:46 PM 977 Views
Do you think that it will truly happen? Jeordam - 24/05/2013 05:47:50 PM 1678 Views
Might have something to do with colonialists ruining everything they can get their hands on. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 06:09:13 PM 1615 Views
The first step on the road to recovery is aknowledging your responsibility for where you are and do HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 06:22:42 PM 1567 Views
Oh, so its our fault... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 06:38:14 PM 1549 Views
It's always our fault *NM* ßelals Girl - 24/05/2013 07:40:24 PM 1078 Views
In general, I agree nossy - 24/05/2013 09:01:53 PM 1705 Views
That word "our" is interesting, don't you think? Legolas - 24/05/2013 09:09:24 PM 1582 Views
That was beautiful. *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 09:12:09 PM 994 Views
No, Ghavrel was doing that ßelals Girl - 25/05/2013 12:03:09 AM 1652 Views
I'm sure we all do it, that's kind of the point. Legolas - 25/05/2013 12:26:25 AM 1532 Views
but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. ßelals Girl - 25/05/2013 02:20:21 AM 1685 Views
Exactly. Tom - 25/05/2013 06:26:57 AM 1626 Views
Hyperbole? nossy - 25/05/2013 09:57:56 PM 1470 Views
Has anyone ever told you that? Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:33:32 PM 1760 Views
No, I really don't think so. Legolas - 25/05/2013 11:18:05 AM 1539 Views
*bashes face against keyboard in frustration* ßelals Girl - 25/05/2013 09:28:58 PM 1478 Views
Perhaps I should bow out and let Ghavrel speak for himself, then. Legolas - 25/05/2013 09:53:28 PM 1662 Views
It's accurate. *NM* Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:25:04 PM 960 Views
Re: but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. nossy - 25/05/2013 09:49:48 PM 1560 Views
Re: but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 12:48:45 AM 1672 Views
Hm nossy - 26/05/2013 10:10:49 AM 1624 Views
Also, yeah. Historically oppressive groups aren't equal to historically oppressed groups. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:31:58 PM 1634 Views
Too simplistic AND a blatant justification for double standards I thought you didn't have ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 01:02:07 AM 1580 Views
That's not racism. Racism requires systematic oppression. *NM* Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 01:14:08 AM 944 Views
No ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 01:57:11 AM 1633 Views
Where whitey firmly belongs, in no small part because of posts like that. Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 02:00:59 AM 1589 Views
Lulz, you're claiming every member of a group deserves something because of what I said? ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 02:11:36 AM 1576 Views
And now you know how Muslims feel. *NM* Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 03:48:33 AM 991 Views
I already knew ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 04:02:02 AM 1526 Views
Just about every group has historically oppressed and BEEN oppressed at some time. Joel - 12/08/2013 04:00:54 AM 1655 Views
No. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:28:24 PM 1545 Views
Oh, I don't think he's talking about past "colonialism" only. Tom - 25/05/2013 06:18:11 AM 1587 Views
Possibly. Some people do, to be sure, and there is some truth in that view. Legolas - 25/05/2013 11:27:36 AM 1462 Views
What a load of bullshit. Tom - 25/05/2013 06:14:02 AM 1560 Views
I don't think you can reasonably claim to separate Salafi thought from the geopolitics of the time. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:23:03 PM 1582 Views
This is why I want to get the HELL out of there. Joel - 12/08/2013 04:16:39 AM 1692 Views
The difference with Islam is they lost the empire game but they were conquers random thoughts - 27/05/2013 12:42:05 AM 1686 Views
I'm gonna have to disagree with some of that. Legolas - 27/05/2013 07:06:53 PM 1534 Views
Yes it was very complex and the Crusaders were not saints (even the sainted ones) random thoughts - 29/05/2013 04:15:57 AM 1638 Views
Fair enough on all counts, then. *NM* Legolas - 29/05/2013 07:37:34 PM 923 Views
No, it had a bunch of opportunistic brown folks systematically dismantling it for centuries. Joel - 12/08/2013 03:43:00 AM 1599 Views
Some of my ancestors lived and caved and bashed each over the heads with rocks random thoughts - 26/05/2013 04:38:56 PM 1583 Views
Well yes. nossy - 26/05/2013 05:08:08 PM 1517 Views
I would prefer to say that random thoughts - 27/05/2013 01:26:57 AM 1721 Views
Of course you would. nossy - 27/05/2013 10:19:46 AM 1640 Views
I in no way support profiling people based on race or religion random thoughts - 29/05/2013 04:11:01 AM 1737 Views
Ok. nossy - 29/05/2013 08:54:34 PM 1728 Views
I think about the evolution of Western religion a lot. Joel - 12/08/2013 03:23:37 AM 1968 Views
There has been 14,000+ terrorist actions in the name of Islam since 9/11. Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:30:30 AM 1790 Views
That isn't a grown up answer. snoopcester - 23/05/2013 04:35:16 PM 1647 Views
Re: In the name of a religion that preaches violence? ßelals Girl - 23/05/2013 07:28:42 PM 1610 Views
His head will only be chopped off is he draws or insults Muhammad! *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:34:21 AM 980 Views
What does he have to do to get on TV? *NM* ßelals Girl - 24/05/2013 07:45:53 PM 911 Views
Statistically snoopcester - 24/05/2013 10:22:29 AM 1682 Views
What kind of horrifying bugs to you guys HAVE over there??? ßelals Girl - 24/05/2013 02:13:23 PM 1683 Views
Hardly any snoopcester - 24/05/2013 02:16:46 PM 1798 Views
Your solution is profiling...because it's time to *stop* thinking all folks are the same? *NM* Sareitha Sedai - 23/05/2013 02:36:32 PM 887 Views
I don't think we've ever encouraged people to think all folks are the same Isaac - 23/05/2013 07:29:54 PM 1522 Views
"Perhaps it's time to stop thinking all folks are the same?" ~A2k Sareitha Sedai - 23/05/2013 07:49:12 PM 1503 Views
I think he's pointing to the encuragement of willful blindedness with that remark Isaac - 23/05/2013 08:15:55 PM 1551 Views
I think probably not. nossy - 23/05/2013 07:57:53 PM 1587 Views
See Tom's post above for the facts..... *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:36:18 AM 908 Views
That your original post was absurd? Thank you, but I got that on my own. *NM* nossy - 24/05/2013 09:09:21 PM 895 Views
It shows what a silly little fool you are, but that's your choice. *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 09:19:04 PM 899 Views
Hey man, you're the one who told me Tom's post had the facts. nossy - 24/05/2013 09:20:53 PM 1516 Views
It means exactly what I said. He did a great job! *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 09:23:44 PM 933 Views
Yes, he did. nossy - 24/05/2013 09:30:42 PM 1528 Views
Also, don't tell him I said I take him seriously. *NM* nossy - 24/05/2013 09:34:59 PM 970 Views
But wouldn't religion-based profile activities... Jeordam - 23/05/2013 10:54:33 PM 1489 Views
My brain is slow right now, but I think I completely agree. nossy - 23/05/2013 11:00:31 PM 1604 Views
You mean like this? Larry - 24/05/2013 08:15:16 PM 1709 Views
Sorry bu the comparison isn't valid random thoughts - 25/05/2013 09:50:34 PM 1530 Views
+1 - Larry is an honest guy and will realize his error. *NM* Anonymous2000 - 25/05/2013 10:53:14 PM 921 Views
Numbers alone do not change the validity of such Larry - 25/05/2013 11:15:17 PM 1587 Views
Yes it does. Anonymous2000 - 26/05/2013 12:23:27 AM 1594 Views
*sigh* Larry - 26/05/2013 12:46:49 AM 1457 Views
I think asking most Americans for recognition of a non-binary political paradigm is a bit much. *NM* Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 01:16:30 AM 938 Views
no liberalisn is sane and well thought in comparison random thoughts - 26/05/2013 04:04:39 PM 1505 Views
no but they do tell a story random thoughts - 26/05/2013 04:27:26 PM 1410 Views
UPDATE - Cleric/Teacher of one of the murderers praises him for "courage". Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 09:22:24 PM 1623 Views
Do you have a functional link? *NM* Stephen - 25/05/2013 12:19:01 AM 945 Views
The link works for me (Yahoo news) - here is the text. Anonymous2000 - 25/05/2013 02:05:41 AM 1802 Views
Re: Maybe it is time to start treating muslims a little differently? dart_board - 27/05/2013 02:28:31 PM 2326 Views
Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. nossy - 27/05/2013 03:22:41 PM 1660 Views
Just as a little aside Tom - 28/05/2013 12:51:48 AM 1523 Views
Ever helpful. nossy - 28/05/2013 10:23:12 PM 1727 Views
Re: Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. dart_board - 28/05/2013 04:56:55 PM 2306 Views
Re: Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. nossy - 28/05/2013 10:18:40 PM 1691 Views
Re: Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. dart_board - 29/05/2013 08:57:17 PM 2270 Views
I'm having warm feelings. nossy - 29/05/2013 09:38:45 PM 1674 Views
Re: I'm having warm feelings. dart_board - 30/05/2013 12:46:57 AM 2085 Views
"Who else? Major League Baseball. " Joel - 12/08/2013 04:34:48 AM 1900 Views
I can't believe I missed this thread. *NM* Dan - 01/06/2013 10:08:08 AM 1251 Views
How much did you miss it, really? Joel - 12/08/2013 04:38:21 AM 1616 Views
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