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The denominational distinctions within Christiandom aren't of concern to me... fionwe1987 Send a noteboard - 08/05/2022 05:09:12 PM

In a question of what should be law in a secular nation, whether the imposed belief is Catholic or Evangelical is a meaningless distinction. Neither denomination has any right to make the decision for every person in the country.


Second, even in some dead Red States, the divide is close to 50/50 on permitting abortion when conception is from rape or incest, according to NYT polls. The same polls indicate that while the great majority of Americans support some access to abortion, they also favor restrictions similar to what exist in Europe, which are far more restrictive that what currently exist in Blue States. I believe Germany restricts abortion access after 12 weeks which is less than the 15 in some Red State laws. So stating that Americans favor unlimited access to abortion, i.e. the status quo in Blue States, is not accurate.


Which leads to my final thought on this. Notice all the hyperbole is emanating from the edges? Notice who is conspicuously silent? Republicans not associated with the Religious Right. Why? They realize if Roe vs. Wade is repealed, it could completely fuck up what otherwise looked to be an historic debacle of a midterm election for the Democrats. It would mobilize the vote and possibly save Democratic control of Congress.
Yes, there is demand for restrictions on abortion. And that's a conversation a lot of people would be willing to have if the fundamental right was not at stake. The more the Right attacks that right, the more maximalist the position the Left takes. It's a kind of political virtue signaling on both sides. It's deeply unhealthy.


Which is exactly how the system is supposed to work. You vote out those who support beliefs contrary to your own. It took 50 years of working the system for the Religious Right to be on the verge of declaring victory over abortion. I'm betting doing the same from the Blue side will take a whole lot less.

Answer me this. The position taken by many here is that the decision should be made democratically, not via the courts, right? Well, Republicans have had full control of Congress, and trifecta control of multiple states for many periods since Roe. Why have they not sought a legislative end to Roe? Pushed for a Constitutional Amendment that would overturn Roe?

If you think judicial fiat is not the way to adjudicate this issue, why resort to the very thing Liberals are accused of (even though the Court that handed down Roe was hardly captured by Liberals, a fact conveniently ignored by everyone here)?

This message last edited by fionwe1987 on 08/05/2022 at 05:26:59 PM
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Abortion in the South, and soon, probably all over the country - 25/04/2022 01:26:45 AM 998 Views
that is the trouble here - 25/04/2022 05:02:46 PM 223 Views
"The party of "bodily autonomy"" - 26/04/2022 04:51:05 PM 188 Views
That is a perverts motte and bailey argument - 26/04/2022 06:27:51 PM 189 Views
The issue is abortion. - 26/04/2022 07:39:00 PM 171 Views
Tell me your feelings about Lochner - 26/04/2022 07:53:00 PM 175 Views
Simple, it was wrongly decided. - 26/04/2022 09:51:27 PM 169 Views
I think that is enough for the day - 26/04/2022 11:07:42 PM 167 Views
I honestly don't give a fig about the constitution here... - 26/04/2022 07:00:57 PM 202 Views
You can't have your cake and eat it too. - 26/04/2022 07:42:51 PM 189 Views
Uhhh - 26/04/2022 07:54:13 PM 173 Views
I mean, yeah. - 26/04/2022 09:58:19 PM 157 Views
You seem to be arguing with an alternate version of me... - 27/04/2022 04:46:46 AM 194 Views
Broad popular support? - 27/04/2022 04:54:49 PM 177 Views
Cannoli is not wrong. - 26/04/2022 05:09:49 PM 200 Views
Cannoli is a contemptuous moron - 26/04/2022 06:56:33 PM 181 Views
I am contemptuous of you (and I suspect your vocabulary skills) - 26/04/2022 09:30:55 PM 189 Views
Was the Catholic Church EVIL . - 26/04/2022 07:01:50 PM 194 Views
Roland, I am neither supporting nor denying any specific theology in my original comment. - 26/04/2022 08:28:31 PM 163 Views
And I am problematizing your claim - 26/04/2022 08:34:17 PM 157 Views
Theodicy - 26/04/2022 08:55:50 PM 195 Views
Re: Theodicy - 26/04/2022 09:45:35 PM 175 Views
and yet... - 26/04/2022 10:35:58 PM 187 Views
What is the Andrea Dworkin line again? - 26/04/2022 11:06:30 PM 180 Views
You're correct about that. We are most assuredly talking past one another. - 26/04/2022 11:39:01 PM 153 Views
Have not had a drink yet. - 26/04/2022 11:46:59 PM 161 Views
Leaked draft opinion - 03/05/2022 06:42:20 PM 201 Views
John Roberts confirms it is real - 03/05/2022 07:37:26 PM 181 Views
Results were leaked, not opinions. - 03/05/2022 08:02:10 PM 162 Views
If you want to parse the history you are welcome to do so. - 03/05/2022 08:32:06 PM 172 Views
You're either being willfully ignorant or disingenuous - 03/05/2022 09:26:49 PM 179 Views
There's a very simple alternate reason - 05/05/2022 06:36:26 AM 167 Views
“Wants to get the word out there ASAP” - 05/05/2022 02:02:00 PM 157 Views
Re: “Wants to get the word out there ASAP” - 06/05/2022 09:18:24 PM 168 Views
He said, not coming up with any retort of his own. - 09/05/2022 03:04:07 PM 153 Views
Re: He said, not coming up with any retort of his own. - 09/05/2022 05:01:43 PM 137 Views
Don't blame me for your failures. - 09/05/2022 05:21:48 PM 137 Views
Leaking also kind of locks in the 5 justices into a more radical decision - 05/05/2022 04:08:58 PM 157 Views
Precisely. - 06/05/2022 09:22:16 PM 133 Views
Obvious intent my ass - 05/05/2022 06:32:10 AM 158 Views
Treasonous Pieces of Junk - 05/05/2022 01:58:23 PM 169 Views
I cannot commit treason - 06/05/2022 09:20:20 PM 163 Views
Neither am I. - 09/05/2022 03:02:54 PM 153 Views
Projecting what? - 09/05/2022 05:02:59 PM 147 Views
Is this a parody account? - 09/05/2022 05:25:39 PM 163 Views
Nope. - 12/05/2022 10:23:24 PM 155 Views
Well, if it's not a parody... - 13/05/2022 07:46:45 PM 141 Views
Go look up what it means to “project” - 13/05/2022 05:04:19 PM 165 Views
Stop shifting the goalposts - 13/05/2022 07:45:21 PM 147 Views
There is no goalpost shifting - 17/05/2022 12:48:18 PM 158 Views
Parody Account: Hypocrite, or Just Stupid? - 17/05/2022 07:26:49 PM 142 Views
actually, Trump was impeached - 05/05/2022 02:05:16 PM 156 Views
By Democrats and a few Republicans - 06/05/2022 09:21:38 PM 145 Views
you wrote: - 06/05/2022 09:34:09 PM 142 Views
Ummm - 06/05/2022 09:42:57 PM 148 Views
Interesting is one word for it... - 05/05/2022 06:38:23 AM 152 Views
That's your thought.... - 06/05/2022 05:34:21 PM 185 Views
Hardly just mine - 06/05/2022 09:23:32 PM 145 Views
Interesting... - 06/05/2022 10:33:56 PM 180 Views
Roe has restrictions - 07/05/2022 03:16:32 AM 145 Views
So popular opinion is what decides recognition of life... - 06/05/2022 10:44:08 PM 155 Views
Nice try - 07/05/2022 03:19:35 AM 139 Views
No one said that, and you know it... - 07/05/2022 05:56:04 AM 140 Views
Well that's a lot of empty noise - 07/05/2022 02:46:48 PM 151 Views
Then stop listening to yourself… - 07/05/2022 06:56:45 PM 196 Views
Serious reading comprehension fail here... - 08/05/2022 05:01:28 PM 155 Views
That is the Catholic Church's position after 1869, but lets do Idaho and LA - 07/05/2022 10:08:39 PM 157 Views
And the Minoans practiced child sacrifice... - 09/05/2022 11:51:44 PM 142 Views
So we are in agreement if we circle around - 10/05/2022 02:34:19 AM 143 Views
Well, we agree it will get worse - 10/05/2022 04:05:33 PM 142 Views
Thanks for explaining why Roe was egregiously wrong. - 09/05/2022 03:56:52 PM 146 Views
Roe imposed nothing - 09/05/2022 05:05:36 PM 148 Views
Actually, it does impose - 09/05/2022 05:19:38 PM 212 Views
Re: Actually, it does impose - 13/05/2022 05:09:04 PM 154 Views
Roe imposed abortion on states that banned it. - 09/05/2022 05:26:56 PM 160 Views
States rights do not trump individual rights - 13/05/2022 05:12:13 PM 141 Views
States rights regulate individual rights - 13/05/2022 07:42:52 PM 173 Views
I am not allowed to get divorced in my state of Texas if my spouse is pregnant. - 15/05/2022 07:59:19 PM 155 Views
Cool - 16/05/2022 12:10:57 AM 163 Views
So our state energy grid - 16/05/2022 01:41:50 AM 155 Views
Wow, not sure I've seen you so angry before - 16/05/2022 08:12:58 AM 167 Views
Are you off your meds? - 16/05/2022 12:35:18 PM 150 Views
I live in the world the US set up Internment Camps in living memory, I known survivors. - 16/05/2022 06:00:07 PM 134 Views
You're literally arguing with yourself. - 16/05/2022 08:00:37 PM 131 Views
That is precisely what I am afraid of - 16/05/2022 08:07:41 PM 127 Views
That can literally be flipped right on to the other side. - 16/05/2022 08:19:02 PM 145 Views
Just a reminder freedom of movement is not in the US Constitution - 16/05/2022 08:25:42 PM 149 Views
Again, you put words into my mouth that I've never said. - 16/05/2022 08:32:38 PM 141 Views
Who the fuck cares? - 17/05/2022 12:54:48 PM 169 Views
Parody account strikes back! - 17/05/2022 07:14:24 PM 138 Views
a few final thoughts - 07/05/2022 07:18:38 PM 231 Views
In some ways, it probably would've been better if Roe v Wade had never happened. - 07/05/2022 08:20:17 PM 179 Views
I can always count on you for rational discussion. *NM* - 07/05/2022 09:19:57 PM 146 Views
He really is wonderful. - 09/05/2022 04:29:00 PM 160 Views
Let me join in. Yes. Legolas is good people. *NM* - 10/05/2022 02:52:37 PM 92 Views
History and Histrionic or perhaps - 07/05/2022 10:25:23 PM 142 Views
The denominational distinctions within Christiandom aren't of concern to me... - 08/05/2022 05:09:12 PM 261 Views
There is an easy answer for you. - 09/05/2022 03:53:42 PM 151 Views

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