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As I said, it wasn't intended as perfect analogy - it's about how much say should children have. Legolas Send a noteboard - 11/08/2023 06:44:33 PM

View original post4. We should artificially limit teething.

Really? I like how you added 'this one is a bit of a parody' for the last one, as if the other ones weren't.

But if you think about the topic a bit more seriously, there are plenty of other situations in which doctors do indeed try to intervene in entirely natural processes that negatively impact the patients' social life, mental health or future life prospects more generally, including during childhood. Ranging from minor stuff like braces for more regular teeth, to more intrusive ones like breast reduction surgery for girls with unusually large breasts that put too much strain on their backs, to even more serious ones like the various treatment options for children who are extremely tall or extremely short.

Of course, in all of those cases, pros and cons must be weighed and doctors may reach different recommendations for different patients depending on their individual circumstances - it's the same way for children with gender dysphoria. But I don't see any medical or logical reason why puberty blockers should be a priori off the table - of course, there are religious/philosophical reasons, but those are rather more subjective...



View original postWe'll go with your cancer statement. If the patient decides not to try the chemo, that is their decision. If they decide to do the chemo, that is their decision. They should make it with their parents and their doctors. And I see the point you're trying to make, but we must go back to something else you said.

I'm not sure you do see my point, because the main reason I brought this up concerned your views on how much children should get to decide for themselves, even if their parents have a different view. Because, from what I understood, once they're 18 you would actually allow them to decide for themselves? What about when they're minors but their parents are in fact on board with the puberty blockers? Or is your position that not only puberty blockers but quite simply all hormone treatment and surgery for trans people should be banned, even for adults?



View original postI've spent the last several years being told "THEY HAVE THE WRONG BRAIN IN THE WRONG BODY!" or "YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND THE MENTAL HEALTH STRUGGLE!" or "IF YOU DON'T KNOW ABOUT THEIR SUFFERING DON'T MAKE FUN OF THEM!"

View original postBut now I have to imagine being one? Either it's something I cannot understand, and it's a real thing, much like I'll never understand how it feels to carry a child in a womb, or it's something I can "imagine", and they aren't "bOrN tHaT wAy!1!"

I don't think you need to imagine actually being trans in order to think about the situation. Although you do need to be open-minded enough to consider the possibility of people thinking very differently from how you do and them not being automatically wrong on that account...
View original postIf it's the former, then I just don't get it, and these people are suffering something I can't comprehend, and shouldn't be called a bigot for not understanding. If it's the latter, then isn't that sort of blowing up the argument that's been made for the last several years?

As you mentioned above, you can't understand how it feels to carry a child in a womb either, but nevertheless you are aware that many people do carry children in their wombs and that it's generally desirable for them to have medical support in that process. This argument isn't making any sense to me.
View original postSo basically, I reject your comparison with cancer. A life-stealing disease, slowly devouring your body is not really comparable to mental anguish, no matter how deep. That's like comparing cancer to a vet's suicide. Both tragic, but it's apples and oranges.

See above - it was never meant to be a full analogy, but it was to gauge your views more generally on how much decision power children should have in difficult medical situations.
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“Can you imagine our reading that James Madison or Thomas Jefferson tried to overthrow the gov't?" - 03/08/2023 09:02:48 PM 659 Views
I'm curious as to your point in posting this. - 04/08/2023 03:17:48 AM 123 Views
The point is that these uneducated dumbass race-baiters dare to lecture us - 04/08/2023 05:33:36 PM 119 Views
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Academics have been pro Marxism for over 100 years. It's nothing new. *NM* - 08/08/2023 05:59:55 PM 51 Views
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In regards to more conservative, - 09/08/2023 08:35:03 PM 111 Views
I side with Greg and Tom in this discussion. - 08/08/2023 05:57:54 PM 108 Views
I don't suppose linking medical articles is going to help too much here, but... - 08/08/2023 11:28:05 PM 108 Views
Elizabeth, you know I have a non binary grandchild. - 09/08/2023 01:22:32 AM 107 Views
Yeah, I know, I just think that the statistics are dangerous. - 09/08/2023 04:36:40 AM 105 Views
Respectfully, do you truly believe this? - 09/08/2023 05:42:31 PM 108 Views
I'll bite... - 09/08/2023 06:39:46 PM 102 Views
Thanks. <3 *NM* - 09/08/2023 08:27:13 PM 52 Views
Your thoughts - 11/08/2023 04:14:37 PM 95 Views
Yes, that's true. - 11/08/2023 06:11:49 PM 99 Views
Re: Yes, that's true. - 12/08/2023 04:25:28 PM 95 Views
This is not bait, I am legitimately trying to understand. And if I understand correctly... - 11/08/2023 05:17:02 PM 98 Views
As I said, it wasn't intended as perfect analogy - it's about how much say should children have. - 11/08/2023 06:44:33 PM 103 Views
No, seriously, only the last one was intended as parody. And I'd like an explanation. - 14/08/2023 05:43:37 PM 91 Views
There aren't a lot of people committing suicide over their teeth coming in. - 14/08/2023 08:21:29 PM 89 Views
Indeed. - 14/08/2023 09:50:53 PM 93 Views
Re: No, seriously, only the last one was intended as parody. And I'd like an explanation. - 15/08/2023 04:14:57 PM 99 Views
See, you're willing to discuss, instead of insult. Others on this board might take note. - 17/08/2023 05:18:39 PM 96 Views
Yeah, well, I have the luxury of an outsider's position... - 23/08/2023 11:47:24 PM 83 Views
Nobody is an outsider when reality is being attacked. - 25/08/2023 05:40:43 PM 91 Views
Fun facts - 26/08/2023 06:22:57 AM 91 Views
Not really "fun" so much as "a sad reality of biology", but yes. - 27/08/2023 09:42:14 PM 81 Views
Imagine if you had the same attitude towards trans people. - 28/08/2023 12:02:34 AM 75 Views
I may be no endocrinologist, but I at least understand simple biology. XY =/= XX =/= XXY - 28/08/2023 05:40:14 PM 77 Views
Simple is definitely true. Shame you never learned biology past what you were taught in high school. - 28/08/2023 11:21:38 PM 84 Views
Right, cause we're "butterflies" - 29/08/2023 04:57:20 AM 86 Views
I go to mass more than you. *NM* - 29/08/2023 09:58:09 AM 49 Views
Wow, really? And you still mutilated your body and told God that He was wrong about you? - 31/08/2023 05:44:32 PM 85 Views
I must say, - 31/08/2023 07:04:47 PM 84 Views
Love is being true. Love is being honest. Love is God. - 31/08/2023 07:52:59 PM 78 Views
Really went off the deep end there huh... - 31/08/2023 10:39:02 PM 80 Views
At least my beliefs can't be disproven by a $40 test at Wal-Mart. - 02/09/2023 03:40:43 PM 74 Views
It's ok. Many of us are quite sad for you too. - 29/08/2023 11:10:32 AM 78 Views
I couldn't care less what unbelievers think. You'll meet the Truth, one day. - 31/08/2023 05:45:31 PM 76 Views
No such thing as damnation, but thanks. - 31/08/2023 06:55:23 PM 78 Views
Then nothing more needs to be said. See who support your lies, Ghav? They literally deny Love. *NM* - 31/08/2023 07:54:23 PM 42 Views
He understands love a lot better than you do. *NM* - 01/09/2023 04:46:14 AM 45 Views
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Of course I'm Christian. I confess the faith of the apostles and of the councils. - 03/09/2023 11:41:56 AM 72 Views
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It is not, and I am not. - 03/09/2023 09:06:48 PM 83 Views
You absolutely are - 03/09/2023 09:27:00 PM 68 Views
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I get that. But Ghav, supposedly, is. - 04/09/2023 12:09:55 AM 80 Views
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Yeah, I'm definitely an outsider, and so are you. - 28/08/2023 07:49:48 PM 80 Views
Ok. - 29/08/2023 05:09:14 AM 72 Views
I'll chew... - 11/08/2023 10:35:45 PM 108 Views
What's your stance on parents who refuse medical treatment for their children with cancer? - 11/08/2023 11:12:21 PM 102 Views
I think... - 11/08/2023 11:37:52 PM 101 Views
Really? - 12/08/2023 12:02:12 AM 94 Views
Am I being unreasonable? - 12/08/2023 05:16:06 AM 97 Views
Maybe not - 12/08/2023 03:38:50 PM 110 Views
Most of us don't really like "the gays," either. And referring to people as "blacks" is offensive. *NM* - 13/08/2023 12:34:32 AM 48 Views
... is referring to people as "whites" offensive? I really, really hope you say yes. *NM* - 14/08/2023 05:46:07 PM 48 Views
Unfortunately for whites, gays, blacks, and transgenders... - 14/08/2023 06:09:47 PM 81 Views
Their voice only counts *NM* - 14/08/2023 06:20:32 PM 44 Views
Touché *NM* - 14/08/2023 07:12:54 PM 48 Views
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You're not a dick. You're honest. - 14/08/2023 09:54:34 PM 81 Views
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Sad, but true. - 17/08/2023 05:22:11 PM 77 Views
Re: I think... - 13/08/2023 12:35:05 AM 96 Views
Re: I'll chew... - 12/08/2023 03:49:47 PM 101 Views
Re: I'll chew... - 14/08/2023 10:56:15 PM 86 Views
Re: I'll chew... - 15/08/2023 11:32:12 PM 90 Views
3 weeks later, did you have fun with this thread Tyr? *NM* - 28/08/2023 08:16:13 PM 42 Views
We went a bit afield, sure, but hey, the board has a discussion going, doesn't it? *NM* - 29/08/2023 05:00:03 AM 41 Views
Well take care - 31/08/2023 11:06:43 PM 85 Views
Same to you. - 03/09/2023 04:20:19 AM 71 Views
Seeing things as beautiful or rotting - 03/09/2023 05:21:50 PM 79 Views
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See this is about you - 03/09/2023 11:22:53 PM 89 Views
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How much history do you know about Samaritans? - 03/09/2023 11:39:54 PM 75 Views
Friend, you can cut the shit. - 04/09/2023 12:19:56 AM 80 Views
I was going to talk about Mount Gerizim you nitwit - 04/09/2023 01:36:16 AM 77 Views
Oh, my apologies then. - 04/09/2023 07:46:57 PM 75 Views

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