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Re: Bah, hogwash! DomA Send a noteboard - 27/05/2010 08:14:16 PM
RJ clearly says that a non-channeler had succeeded in killing Asmo. This refutes the idea that only a channeler could have killed him.


What?

When did RJ said a non-channeller could have killed Asmo?

Please tell me this isn't how you misinterpret the quote about Fain....

Telling us Fain didn't do it not because he wouldn't have had a motive but because he never had the opportunity to be in the right place at the right time in no way implies Fain might have succeeded had he been in that room... It just means "Fain didn't have an opportunity to kill Asmodean". How you interpret it (I think it's the quote you refer to, anyway) make about as much sense as saying that with that quote RJ confirmed that Fain and Asmodean knew one another.

A non-channeller could kill Asmodean in the right circumstances, but it's extremely unlikely one has in the specific circumstances of the murder, as Asmodean died near instantly, and he was some distance away from his killer (excluding a dagger through the heart or his throat slit) - a mundane killer would have to use a projectile weapon, and in WOT none but shocklances would kill instantly.
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An analysis of Asmodean's last seconds Etzel - 27/05/2010 12:12:50 PM 2673 Views
I hate to say it, as I love this mystery.... GateKeeper - 27/05/2010 03:01:08 PM 1400 Views
Surely, there can never be enough Asmo threads! *NM* Etzel - 27/05/2010 04:18:06 PM 756 Views
I have a theory on the killer that doesn't involve Slayer... FanEditor10 - 28/05/2010 03:41:23 AM 1200 Views
It's not really obvious... Etzel - 28/05/2010 09:08:27 AM 1139 Views
In addition to Etzel's comments newyorkersedai - 28/05/2010 09:08:45 PM 1057 Views
I'm pretty sure the Myrdraal that killed Caradin's family was a Proto-version of SH *NM* darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 09:56:58 PM 678 Views
Smacking & ordering Carridin, yes - but no evidence it killed his kin *NM* newyorkersedai - 29/05/2010 04:40:15 PM 648 Views
Re: Smacking & ordering Carridin, yes - but no evidence it killed his kin darius_sedai - 29/05/2010 09:16:01 PM 1205 Views
Far-fetched, IMO DomA - 27/05/2010 04:01:05 PM 1509 Views
very well said *NM* darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 04:19:10 PM 783 Views
I don't want Slayer to be the killer Etzel - 27/05/2010 04:33:06 PM 1191 Views
The way you twist things, it certainly seems so! fionwe1987 - 27/05/2010 05:07:22 PM 1300 Views
Bah, hogwash! Etzel - 27/05/2010 05:17:37 PM 1160 Views
Re: Bah, hogwash! DomA - 27/05/2010 08:14:16 PM 1187 Views
The point is... Etzel - 28/05/2010 08:38:49 AM 1235 Views
Yes, but Fain is a far cry from your average non-channeler darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 12:01:44 PM 1284 Views
As is Slayer Etzel - 28/05/2010 12:25:07 PM 1146 Views
There is no evidence of this at all darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 12:32:37 PM 1113 Views
Yeah, the evil guys don't manage to harm the good guys Etzel - 28/05/2010 12:38:57 PM 1097 Views
so far we've seen Slayer kill a sleeping guy and his wife darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 12:45:14 PM 1111 Views
I disagree. *NM* Etzel - 28/05/2010 12:50:02 PM 1223 Views
You always twist the quotes to make them say what Jordan didn't intend to say.... DomA - 28/05/2010 02:20:09 PM 1180 Views
I think this is your interpretation Etzel - 28/05/2010 02:50:14 PM 1124 Views
Yeah right... fionwe1987 - 27/05/2010 08:35:35 PM 1239 Views
See my replies above. *NM* Etzel - 28/05/2010 08:40:42 AM 1027 Views
Re: Bah, hogwash! Sidious - 28/05/2010 08:28:16 AM 1005 Views
See my repy to DomA. *NM* Etzel - 28/05/2010 08:39:15 AM 981 Views
None of this explains how Slayer had opportunity that others didn't darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 05:12:48 PM 1335 Views
We often see... Etzel - 27/05/2010 05:33:19 PM 1188 Views
I just keep coming back to Slayer needs wild explanations while Graendal is more obvious darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 05:52:13 PM 1259 Views
Ok, as we said in the other thread, let's RAFO! *NM* Etzel - 27/05/2010 05:57:49 PM 1268 Views
Agreed *NM* darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 06:03:51 PM 706 Views
Indeed Sidious - 28/05/2010 08:39:14 AM 1126 Views
Well... Etzel - 28/05/2010 10:19:46 AM 1205 Views
Re: Well... darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 12:20:15 PM 1191 Views
I adressed the points regarding the Fain-comparsion above Etzel - 28/05/2010 12:35:08 PM 1119 Views
your Slayer theory is ridiculously complex! darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 12:37:08 PM 1172 Views
It just requires to combine some clues from the first 5 books & some common sense Etzel - 28/05/2010 12:44:10 PM 1131 Views
common sense? darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 12:51:25 PM 1127 Views
See my posts above. *NM* Etzel - 28/05/2010 02:50:56 PM 1140 Views
Re: Well... Sidious - 28/05/2010 02:27:40 PM 1295 Views
No... Etzel - 28/05/2010 03:04:41 PM 1199 Views
let's try this another way darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 03:14:07 PM 1188 Views
The main problem with Graendal is... Etzel - 28/05/2010 05:31:09 PM 1115 Views
Graendal has a pretty significant role in TFoH darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 06:54:39 PM 1212 Views
Re: The main problem with Graendal is... DomA - 28/05/2010 09:20:27 PM 1259 Views
my first thought was it was Sammael or Graendal. Come LoC it was clear to me that it was Graendal. darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 09:44:38 PM 1328 Views
RJ used the expression... Etzel - 29/05/2010 08:17:08 AM 1115 Views
be careful ... your stretching far enough you might hurt yourself darius_sedai - 29/05/2010 01:12:29 PM 1218 Views
Re: No... Sidious - 28/05/2010 03:38:49 PM 1085 Views
Re: I don't want Slayer to be the killer DomA - 27/05/2010 07:47:40 PM 1173 Views
Couple of questions scalius - 27/05/2010 09:53:05 PM 1181 Views
Be'lal managed to get out NO! darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 10:08:33 PM 1033 Views
Hmmm scalius - 27/05/2010 10:27:55 PM 1155 Views
Re: Hmmm RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 10:34:30 PM 1032 Views
I don't think you can actually cut BF weaves darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 10:45:34 PM 1065 Views
Hmmm I wonder about that. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 10:58:46 PM 1132 Views
I think it would be impossible for someone to react that quickly darius_sedai - 27/05/2010 11:13:01 PM 1224 Views
We've seen it done. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 28/05/2010 06:32:08 PM 1071 Views
Not the same thing darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 07:00:13 PM 1054 Views
Re: Couple of questions DomA - 28/05/2010 03:29:29 PM 1225 Views
As said... Etzel - 28/05/2010 08:36:28 AM 1154 Views
Of course you do. Trying to deny it is just silly. Everyone knows your bias. *NM* Tom - 27/05/2010 08:43:18 PM 596 Views
No, seriously, if actually Graendal did it, it's ok to me, too Etzel - 27/05/2010 09:08:48 PM 1173 Views
Re: No, seriously, if actually Graendal did it, it's ok to me, too Sidious - 28/05/2010 08:25:46 AM 1153 Views
But look... Etzel - 28/05/2010 09:01:12 AM 1181 Views
if there are clues in TFoH I find it hard to believe that Slayer is involved darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 12:29:40 PM 1069 Views
The scene of Asmo's murder contains clues, of course Etzel - 28/05/2010 12:32:13 PM 1146 Views
Re: The scene of Asmo's murder contains clues, of course darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 12:35:22 PM 1149 Views
RJ said the main clues are in the books before LoC. *NM* Etzel - 28/05/2010 12:40:23 PM 1196 Views
Re: RJ said the main clues are in the books before LoC. *NM* darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 12:52:30 PM 1071 Views
Yeah, I know. *NM* Etzel - 28/05/2010 02:51:32 PM 1134 Views
Yet Slayer is no where to be seen between his vanishing after TSR and the start of WH darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 03:09:44 PM 1152 Views
??? Sidious - 28/05/2010 02:19:17 PM 1111 Views
Of course RJ implied that. You should read his quotes about Asmo! *NM* Etzel - 28/05/2010 02:52:32 PM 1139 Views
Here is what RJ said EDIT darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 03:29:19 PM 911 Views
Indeed Etzel - 28/05/2010 05:18:35 PM 1068 Views
Re: Indeed darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 05:26:38 PM 1039 Views
But he was already introduced to us before the murder, and that is all that matters. *NM* Etzel - 28/05/2010 05:33:02 PM 1082 Views
Re: But he was already introduced to us before the murder, and that is all that matters. *NM* darius_sedai - 28/05/2010 07:05:27 PM 1061 Views
LOL!! Sidious - 28/05/2010 03:29:35 PM 885 Views
Too much? Etzel - 28/05/2010 05:16:44 PM 1139 Views
Re: Far-fetched, IMO saidarisnowtainted - 02/06/2010 07:34:58 PM 1258 Views
Sent by whom? And how on earth would he be expected to interrupt a Forsaken plot? *NM* darius_sedai - 02/06/2010 11:13:04 PM 719 Views
Re: Sent by whom? And how on earth would he be expected to interrupt a Forsaken plot? saidarisnowtainted - 19/06/2010 12:59:54 AM 966 Views
Slayer takes orders from the Forsaken darius_sedai - 19/06/2010 03:30:37 AM 1161 Views
Re: Slayer takes orders from the Forsaken saidarisnowtainted - 24/06/2010 09:03:18 AM 1393 Views
The orders to not kill Rand didn't happen until the next book darius_sedai - 26/06/2010 02:32:26 PM 871 Views
Re: The orders to not kill Rand didn't happen until the next book saidarisnowtainted - 01/07/2010 10:13:53 PM 1289 Views
Re: An analysis of Asmodean's last seconds RugbyPlayingAshaman - 27/05/2010 06:19:18 PM 1094 Views
Re: An analysis of Asmodean's last seconds DomA - 27/05/2010 09:16:21 PM 1094 Views
Lanfear killed Asmo..... trzaska2000 - 28/05/2010 05:05:55 AM 1070 Views
Doesn't make sense Etzel - 28/05/2010 11:09:14 AM 1099 Views
Sorry, Lanfear did it..... trzaska2000 - 29/05/2010 03:47:44 AM 1033 Views
Considering that RJ didn't even necessarily want to reveal it, it was pretty random, yeah. *NM* Etzel - 29/05/2010 08:25:54 AM 673 Views
Death is Moridin "when death took him"; need I say more *NM* Knightscape - 28/05/2010 10:07:14 AM 711 Views
There is a quote that refutes this... Etzel - 28/05/2010 10:22:12 AM 1143 Views
He could have recognized Moridan.....due to the True Power in his eyes. trzaska2000 - 29/05/2010 03:49:49 AM 1092 Views
No other Forsaken immediately recognizes Moridin as Ishy because of the saa. *NM* Etzel - 29/05/2010 08:26:44 AM 674 Views
RJ failed, Etzel's analysis is sharp, and I'm gonna abandon the Asmo question forever newyorkersedai - 28/05/2010 08:55:01 PM 1164 Views
Re: RJ failed, Etzel's analysis is sharp, and I'm gonna abandon the Asmo question forever *NM* newyorkersedai - 28/05/2010 09:24:41 PM 767 Views
I think I found an RJ quote that kills the Slayer theory darius_sedai - 29/05/2010 01:57:20 PM 1052 Views
If Slayer is actually the killer... Etzel - 29/05/2010 02:20:32 PM 1112 Views
Please, RJ would do as he always had and immediately RAFOd a question like that darius_sedai - 29/05/2010 02:26:10 PM 1094 Views
Well, I don't think so. Etzel - 29/05/2010 02:43:28 PM 1113 Views
yet he never gave an answer like this one darius_sedai - 29/05/2010 02:57:35 PM 1188 Views
Again... Etzel - 29/05/2010 03:09:06 PM 1185 Views
Taking things NO darius_sedai - 29/05/2010 03:12:24 PM 1145 Views
RJ pretty much said it wasn't Slayer. FanEditor10 - 06/06/2010 05:44:05 AM 979 Views
If Slayer never met Asmo in the books he could not have killed him darius_sedai - 06/06/2010 12:46:40 PM 981 Views
But Slayer could have met Asmo, when he was killed.. *NM* Etzel - 06/06/2010 01:06:01 PM 1037 Views
Directly contradicts what RJ said "they did not meet in the books" darius_sedai - 06/06/2010 02:51:50 PM 997 Views
Not "before" the murder. *NM* Etzel - 06/06/2010 06:03:34 PM 1036 Views
Re: Not "before" the murder. *NM* darius_sedai - 06/06/2010 10:25:16 PM 994 Views
He answers the question, if they met "before" the murder. *NM* Etzel - 07/06/2010 07:18:50 AM 709 Views
not if it didn't happen in the books darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 12:08:34 PM 932 Views
I'm relieved then... Etzel - 07/06/2010 12:13:58 PM 942 Views
it's nearly as simplistic as knowing Graendal did it darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 12:48:42 PM 1069 Views
Compilation of the clues I could find on Slayer and Graendal darius_sedai - 29/05/2010 04:26:58 PM 1205 Views
I think Asmo's killer was as surprised as he. TaskmasterJack - 29/05/2010 09:26:03 PM 1109 Views
That's what I've always thought as well. Seriana Sedai - 29/05/2010 10:06:56 PM 1031 Views
That's always been my theory too Sidious - 29/05/2010 10:18:30 PM 1136 Views
*nods* darius_sedai - 29/05/2010 11:23:18 PM 1147 Views
Re: That's always been my theory too Seriana Sedai - 30/05/2010 07:35:50 AM 1070 Views
You know, there's no direct proof suggesting that Asmo's killer was "surprised"..... trzaska2000 - 01/06/2010 04:04:56 AM 1025 Views
That's why I said "I think" and offered my opinion. TaskmasterJack - 01/06/2010 09:46:09 PM 1080 Views
except the Author said it was a murder of opportunity darius_sedai - 01/06/2010 11:13:14 PM 1050 Views
That is simply false. Etzel - 02/06/2010 10:00:27 AM 1124 Views
RJ stated it was a murder of opportunity ... I never said "only" darius_sedai - 02/06/2010 11:49:23 AM 1180 Views
Of course, it is false Etzel - 02/06/2010 12:13:11 PM 1105 Views
Here are the quotes darius_sedai - 02/06/2010 12:39:29 PM 1034 Views
As said, those quotes simply don't support that the murder was basically just an unplanned accident. *NM* Etzel - 02/06/2010 02:14:29 PM 703 Views
I disagree. It's pretty much black and white that the opportunity/timing is the key factor to darius_sedai - 02/06/2010 02:39:03 PM 943 Views
Actually I like it because it fits Slayer better than Graendal, as pointed out. *NM* Etzel - 02/06/2010 02:51:24 PM 566 Views
that makes no sense at all *NM* darius_sedai - 02/06/2010 02:53:28 PM 761 Views
RJ pretty much said it wasn't Slayer. FanEditor10 - 06/06/2010 05:47:13 AM 1109 Views
Well... Etzel - 06/06/2010 10:46:13 AM 1106 Views
Logic darius_sedai - 06/06/2010 02:53:27 PM 1064 Views
You're falling into Etzelian logic there... DomA - 06/06/2010 03:25:30 PM 1063 Views
I'm just being a smartass *NM* darius_sedai - 06/06/2010 03:36:00 PM 731 Views
It's good that Etzel sticks to his guns Sidious - 06/06/2010 04:42:01 PM 1171 Views
OMG, Taim and Mesaana were getting it on in the pantry darius_sedai - 06/06/2010 09:49:57 PM 1032 Views
That reminds me... Fanatic-Templar - 19/06/2010 04:46:58 AM 1057 Views
That's not anyone's logic, this argument is simply utter nonsense. *NM* Etzel - 07/06/2010 12:08:05 PM 1111 Views
just like thinking Slayer was the killer is darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 12:09:34 PM 1050 Views
Yeah... Etzel - 07/06/2010 12:21:31 PM 1152 Views
thinking the top assassin killed someone when it's been stated over and over darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 12:56:48 PM 1108 Views
Those quotes pretty much show that Graendal is careful... *NM* Etzel - 07/06/2010 01:03:26 PM 1112 Views
No they show that she is deliberate! darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 01:12:29 PM 1135 Views
That are just semantics Etzel - 07/06/2010 01:36:12 PM 1206 Views
and you think it's obvious that Slayer was the premier Shadow assassin prior to WH? darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 02:06:47 PM 1081 Views
As I explained you several times, I can see why RJ thought it is obvious, yes... Etzel - 07/06/2010 02:17:01 PM 1048 Views
Why wouldn't Graendal head to Caemlyn at that point? darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 02:36:24 PM 1132 Views
And where was she then, when Rand attacked Rahvin? Etzel - 07/06/2010 02:54:33 PM 1173 Views
Re: And where was she then, when Rand attacked Rahvin? darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 03:01:14 PM 1138 Views
You should re-read the scene where Moghedien tells Nynaeve about it... Etzel - 07/06/2010 03:12:55 PM 1201 Views
That's a different thing than Moghedien saying the plan was canceled darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 03:15:32 PM 1209 Views
That is essentially what Moghedien said. Etzel - 07/06/2010 03:33:35 PM 969 Views
um no it's not darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 04:17:04 PM 1054 Views
It's told after that... Etzel - 07/06/2010 04:46:31 PM 1017 Views
No it doesn't. It tells us that Rahvin, just like all the others had a side plan in place darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 04:55:43 PM 1172 Views
Yeah... Etzel - 07/06/2010 05:17:59 PM 1096 Views
Funny I feel the same way you do ... darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 05:25:48 PM 1089 Views
Ah, whatever... Etzel - 07/06/2010 05:35:22 PM 1012 Views
We are on the exact same page darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 05:42:48 PM 1072 Views
Re: We are on the exact same page Sidious - 07/06/2010 05:52:37 PM 1142 Views
LMAO darius_sedai - 07/06/2010 06:07:16 PM 1518 Views
I promised Etzel long ago... Fanatic-Templar - 19/06/2010 04:49:11 AM 1079 Views
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