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Re: Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... Seriana Sedai Send a noteboard - 15/07/2010 10:50:05 PM

Because I think her death was a statement about Rand's character. He went from not wanting to kill any women or innocents to nuking the palace where he was pretty sure Graendal probably was but her innocent pets certainly were. It's a huge leap for him. It's profound. I think if Graendal survived it that would invalidate a lot of what we felt when he did that, makes it less of a game changer.

But this doesn't make sense. Rand broke lose, violated his principles, violated good sense, and decided he's going to do whatever it takes to kill Graendal, so that he can leave Arad Doman safe and carry on with his "important tasks".

Well, he thinks he killed her, but Arad Doman is going to continue to suffer. Should it turn out that Graendal is alive, it will only add to the lesson Rand needed to learn that ignoring humanity and doing anything you want to to destroy an enemy is not right.

Should it be that Rand killing all those pets of hers was, in the end, futile, would only add to the theme.


Once the lesson has already been learned? That would be pretty futile.

All this is quite apart from the very logical reasons which point to her not dying.


There is no logical reason for her not dying. Every hypothesis on her survival has been thus:

Graendal is a genius,
[Any number of unsupported imagined possibilities],
Therefore, Graendal survived.

And ignoring all the evidence that indicates she is dead.

I agree. That moment means nothing if she's alive.
Graendal is my favorite Forsaken far and away. If there is anyone I want to still be alive it is her, but especially this late in the series it just makes no sense to me. I don't think it's impossible, I just don't personally find it logical.
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What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? Sidious - 13/07/2010 09:00:05 AM 2290 Views
Too convulted to make any sense... Etzel - 13/07/2010 09:22:26 AM 1230 Views
Too convulted...... Jeordam - 14/07/2010 07:26:26 PM 1476 Views
The logic is rather... Etzel - 15/07/2010 05:09:30 PM 1137 Views
What is the reason Delana is with Graendal? Artsapat - 13/07/2010 09:31:36 AM 1315 Views
Indeed... Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:06:32 AM 1217 Views
Re: Indeed... Sidious - 13/07/2010 10:10:43 AM 1295 Views
That is wrong Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:19:32 AM 1123 Views
Re: That is wrong Sidious - 13/07/2010 10:29:16 AM 1223 Views
It's not at all... Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:35:49 AM 1088 Views
Plus... Etzel - 13/07/2010 12:18:12 PM 1032 Views
I agree with part and disagree with part. Logain - 14/07/2010 06:39:36 PM 1124 Views
exactly darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 06:43:14 PM 1121 Views
Does the Compulsion fit Graendal? Lohikaarme - 13/07/2010 03:40:36 PM 1162 Views
sorry but no dacole - 13/07/2010 09:49:13 AM 1240 Views
Exactly Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:14:06 AM 1089 Views
Yeah dacole provided powerful evidence *NM* Sidious - 13/07/2010 10:25:13 AM 602 Views
Actually... Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:30:24 AM 1122 Views
Or, as with Moghedien. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 13/07/2010 02:35:44 PM 1282 Views
It makes perfect sense. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 13/07/2010 02:33:09 PM 1149 Views
I won't be 100% sure she's dead until we get a solid "she's toast" from either the text darius_sedai - 13/07/2010 04:21:18 PM 1172 Views
This is actually the first thing that I thought of in that scene *NM* darius_sedai - 13/07/2010 04:08:48 PM 752 Views
Until I have absolute proof to the contrary.(Confirmation by Harriot or BS) krassos - 13/07/2010 04:20:49 PM 1067 Views
If Graendal didn't know Rand would use balefire, why would she have Delana do the Compulsion? beetnemesis - 13/07/2010 04:57:10 PM 1368 Views
Yes, Graendal completely outsmarted Rand. Fanatic-Templar - 13/07/2010 05:56:30 PM 1226 Views
I just think it's funny that people make fun of such a basic plan as convoluted. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 13/07/2010 06:33:44 PM 1218 Views
Indeed... imagine how a truly complex plan would confound them Sidious - 13/07/2010 08:41:54 PM 1140 Views
Re: Indeed... imagine how a truly complex plan would confound them Underwood - 13/07/2010 09:09:09 PM 1182 Views
You draw too much attention to yourself, Mr Underwood *NM* Sidious - 14/07/2010 05:13:42 AM 693 Views
Ha, nice! *NM* Underwood - 14/07/2010 04:05:00 PM 590 Views
What are you talking about? I was agreeing with you, it's absurdly simple. Fanatic-Templar - 13/07/2010 09:27:22 PM 1194 Views
Huh Sidious - 14/07/2010 05:22:51 AM 1177 Views
Why did the lair explode? Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 06:17:32 AM 1152 Views
*NM* Skeeve the Great - 14/07/2010 01:58:17 PM 753 Views
While I generally agree with you...you missed an important detail. Mik - 14/07/2010 02:06:31 PM 1323 Views
What did Rand tell Ramshalan... Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 04:29:04 PM 1029 Views
Re: What did Rand tell Ramshalan... darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:52:11 PM 1119 Views
... Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 09:22:21 PM 1293 Views
he doesn't have to read Rands mind darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 09:41:59 PM 1051 Views
Provide a quote. Fanatic-Templar - 15/07/2010 04:10:06 AM 1184 Views
read the chapter darius_sedai - 10/08/2010 09:22:02 PM 1029 Views
Right, that's why I asked. Because I know you can't. Fanatic-Templar - 10/08/2010 10:00:14 PM 1176 Views
sigh ... always so aggressive ... why you gotta hate darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 03:23:31 AM 1253 Views
Was that what I asked for? Fanatic-Templar - 11/08/2010 04:05:41 AM 999 Views
sorry misunderstood what you were looking for darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 04:50:17 PM 1026 Views
Oh if that's what you want darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 04:45:19 PM 1183 Views
Yes, he pretty much says out loud that he can't just wipe out her fortress. Fanatic-Templar - 11/08/2010 06:57:39 PM 1069 Views
Re: Yes, he pretty much says out loud that he can't just wipe out her fortress. darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 09:20:10 PM 1054 Views
why does it have to be a well thought out plan? darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:14:17 PM 1061 Views
She would have to teach her pawn Compulsion. Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 04:30:12 PM 1060 Views
No she'd only have to show Delana a weave to duplicate darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:48:24 PM 1111 Views
Nonsense. Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 09:30:01 PM 1166 Views
yet Sorilea, can duplicate Cadsuane's weaves after one quick glance darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 09:52:01 PM 1161 Views
Which ones? Fanatic-Templar - 15/07/2010 04:14:23 AM 1044 Views
Re: Which ones? Sidious - 15/07/2010 05:25:28 AM 1150 Views
Well. Fanatic-Templar - 15/07/2010 06:53:29 AM 1030 Views
Actually I think it's one of those things that make AS so stupid darius_sedai - 10/08/2010 09:36:43 PM 1112 Views
the Sorilea moment is when they first meet Semirhage darius_sedai - 10/08/2010 09:32:26 PM 1203 Views
Thanks for the quote. Fanatic-Templar - 10/08/2010 10:02:36 PM 1250 Views
Re: I just think it's funny that people make fun of such a basic plan as convoluted. saidarisnowtainted - 14/07/2010 05:40:11 PM 1059 Views
She's so smart, she knows Rand will bring along Nynaeve to check Delana's Compulsion BlackAdder - 13/07/2010 08:32:19 PM 1039 Views
we've seen any number of times that a Channeler can make an exact copy of weaves darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:10:41 PM 1169 Views
Ramshalan didn't know the plan as you claim Skeeve the Great - 14/07/2010 04:16:29 PM 961 Views
he knew enough to alert Graendal to the danger darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:50:26 PM 1213 Views
No. Don't think so. Tom - 13/07/2010 08:35:34 PM 1028 Views
I so desperately want you to be right. Seriana Sedai - 14/07/2010 06:30:16 AM 1198 Views
Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... fionwe1987 - 14/07/2010 06:53:48 AM 1130 Views
Re: Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 07:10:49 AM 1198 Views
Re: Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... Seriana Sedai - 15/07/2010 10:50:05 PM 1121 Views
Yip Sidious - 14/07/2010 04:33:03 PM 1084 Views
Lame. eucatastrophe - 14/07/2010 10:44:47 AM 1025 Views
Not really darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:15:38 PM 996 Views
she's dead, get over it *NM* Yunalesca - 14/07/2010 01:12:15 PM 662 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? saidarisnowtainted - 14/07/2010 05:44:38 PM 1028 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 14/07/2010 07:21:29 PM 1124 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? saidarisnowtainted - 10/08/2010 09:12:17 PM 1219 Views
Sounds about right. Wonder if he intends to try and get Callandor? *NM* Lord Haart - 13/08/2010 07:41:47 AM 422 Views
*shrug* Seems a bit complex to me... Jeordam - 14/07/2010 07:17:49 PM 1429 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? Underwood - 15/07/2010 04:38:09 PM 1144 Views
Honestly, if she's still alive, how is she going to die? Gher - 16/07/2010 05:49:06 AM 1046 Views
Ahh, just remembered that some people think some Forsaken will survive Tarmon Gai'don. Still... *NM* Gher - 16/07/2010 05:51:41 AM 545 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? scooter - 10/11/2010 04:09:41 AM 1020 Views
Why? *Towers of Midnight spoilers* Fanatic-Templar - 10/11/2010 04:41:11 AM 998 Views
Because he was right, that's why. Terez - 11/11/2010 03:39:39 AM 994 Views
Not by my reckoning. *Still contains ToM spoilers* Fanatic-Templar - 11/11/2010 04:22:59 AM 975 Views
No one ever gets every detail right - it's impossible Terez - 11/11/2010 06:06:26 AM 1245 Views
Yes, but I don't think this was a detail. *Still ToM spoilers.* Fanatic-Templar - 11/11/2010 06:31:40 AM 1154 Views
Re: Why? *Towers of Midnight spoilers* scooter - 11/11/2010 04:12:38 AM 1123 Views
Please try to maintain some decorum. *Also ToM spoilers* Fanatic-Templar - 11/11/2010 04:45:08 AM 1060 Views
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