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Too convulted...... Jeordam Send a noteboard - 14/07/2010 07:26:26 PM
From a literal standpoint it only makes sense that Graendal was killed by Rand. The "Graendal somehow survived"-theories (which remind of the ideas that Sammael or Osan'gar survived somehow) would be an unnecessary twist such late in the story. Considering that RJ wanted to wrap up things, it's clear that Graendal was balefired in a powerful scene, because she wasn't needed anymore and to emphasise Rand's hardness. As it is made clear in the book, Graendal simply couldn't predict that Rand would "punch her in the face" in such a way.

Besides that, Graendal tells in TGS, prologue, that Aran'gar doesn't know where her lair is. Thus nothing suggests that Aran'gar would go to Graendal (Aran'gar can certainly find other, more neutral refugees).


As in Slayer, a character who we knew nothing about in regards to his powers....was hanging out in a place which he hasn't been to for decades....was watching a man who he knew could channel and kill him...but was watching a man who's location was unknown to him prior to this...who happened to stumble upon him...who he killed and took the body, harp, and removed all evidence (blood, disrupted environment, etc).

And *this* is too confulted? ;)

I'm just saying.

As for a huge twist like this at the end of the series...unlikely, but possible. As for Graendal not being able to recognize that Rand would "punch her in the face"....who said she had too. 1) There was more than enough time for a regular exit...let alone a dramatic, jump-through-the-gateway type of exit. 2) Do you honestly think that Rand could out think Graendal? How many mid-20 year olds can out think a trained, experienced professional?

~Jeordam
ex-Admin at wotmania (all things wot & art galleries)
Saving the Princess, Humanity, or the World-Entire since 1985
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What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? Sidious - 13/07/2010 09:00:05 AM 2290 Views
Too convulted to make any sense... Etzel - 13/07/2010 09:22:26 AM 1230 Views
Too convulted...... Jeordam - 14/07/2010 07:26:26 PM 1476 Views
The logic is rather... Etzel - 15/07/2010 05:09:30 PM 1137 Views
What is the reason Delana is with Graendal? Artsapat - 13/07/2010 09:31:36 AM 1314 Views
Indeed... Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:06:32 AM 1217 Views
Re: Indeed... Sidious - 13/07/2010 10:10:43 AM 1295 Views
That is wrong Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:19:32 AM 1123 Views
Re: That is wrong Sidious - 13/07/2010 10:29:16 AM 1223 Views
It's not at all... Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:35:49 AM 1088 Views
Plus... Etzel - 13/07/2010 12:18:12 PM 1032 Views
I agree with part and disagree with part. Logain - 14/07/2010 06:39:36 PM 1124 Views
exactly darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 06:43:14 PM 1121 Views
Does the Compulsion fit Graendal? Lohikaarme - 13/07/2010 03:40:36 PM 1162 Views
sorry but no dacole - 13/07/2010 09:49:13 AM 1240 Views
Exactly Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:14:06 AM 1089 Views
Yeah dacole provided powerful evidence *NM* Sidious - 13/07/2010 10:25:13 AM 602 Views
Actually... Etzel - 13/07/2010 10:30:24 AM 1122 Views
Or, as with Moghedien. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 13/07/2010 02:35:44 PM 1282 Views
It makes perfect sense. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 13/07/2010 02:33:09 PM 1149 Views
I won't be 100% sure she's dead until we get a solid "she's toast" from either the text darius_sedai - 13/07/2010 04:21:18 PM 1172 Views
This is actually the first thing that I thought of in that scene *NM* darius_sedai - 13/07/2010 04:08:48 PM 752 Views
Until I have absolute proof to the contrary.(Confirmation by Harriot or BS) krassos - 13/07/2010 04:20:49 PM 1067 Views
If Graendal didn't know Rand would use balefire, why would she have Delana do the Compulsion? beetnemesis - 13/07/2010 04:57:10 PM 1367 Views
Yes, Graendal completely outsmarted Rand. Fanatic-Templar - 13/07/2010 05:56:30 PM 1226 Views
I just think it's funny that people make fun of such a basic plan as convoluted. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 13/07/2010 06:33:44 PM 1218 Views
Indeed... imagine how a truly complex plan would confound them Sidious - 13/07/2010 08:41:54 PM 1140 Views
Re: Indeed... imagine how a truly complex plan would confound them Underwood - 13/07/2010 09:09:09 PM 1182 Views
You draw too much attention to yourself, Mr Underwood *NM* Sidious - 14/07/2010 05:13:42 AM 693 Views
Ha, nice! *NM* Underwood - 14/07/2010 04:05:00 PM 590 Views
What are you talking about? I was agreeing with you, it's absurdly simple. Fanatic-Templar - 13/07/2010 09:27:22 PM 1194 Views
Huh Sidious - 14/07/2010 05:22:51 AM 1177 Views
Why did the lair explode? Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 06:17:32 AM 1152 Views
*NM* Skeeve the Great - 14/07/2010 01:58:17 PM 753 Views
While I generally agree with you...you missed an important detail. Mik - 14/07/2010 02:06:31 PM 1323 Views
What did Rand tell Ramshalan... Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 04:29:04 PM 1029 Views
Re: What did Rand tell Ramshalan... darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:52:11 PM 1119 Views
... Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 09:22:21 PM 1293 Views
he doesn't have to read Rands mind darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 09:41:59 PM 1051 Views
Provide a quote. Fanatic-Templar - 15/07/2010 04:10:06 AM 1184 Views
read the chapter darius_sedai - 10/08/2010 09:22:02 PM 1029 Views
Right, that's why I asked. Because I know you can't. Fanatic-Templar - 10/08/2010 10:00:14 PM 1176 Views
sigh ... always so aggressive ... why you gotta hate darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 03:23:31 AM 1253 Views
Was that what I asked for? Fanatic-Templar - 11/08/2010 04:05:41 AM 999 Views
sorry misunderstood what you were looking for darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 04:50:17 PM 1026 Views
Oh if that's what you want darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 04:45:19 PM 1183 Views
Yes, he pretty much says out loud that he can't just wipe out her fortress. Fanatic-Templar - 11/08/2010 06:57:39 PM 1069 Views
Re: Yes, he pretty much says out loud that he can't just wipe out her fortress. darius_sedai - 11/08/2010 09:20:10 PM 1054 Views
why does it have to be a well thought out plan? darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:14:17 PM 1061 Views
She would have to teach her pawn Compulsion. Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 04:30:12 PM 1060 Views
No she'd only have to show Delana a weave to duplicate darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:48:24 PM 1111 Views
Nonsense. Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 09:30:01 PM 1166 Views
yet Sorilea, can duplicate Cadsuane's weaves after one quick glance darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 09:52:01 PM 1161 Views
Which ones? Fanatic-Templar - 15/07/2010 04:14:23 AM 1044 Views
Re: Which ones? Sidious - 15/07/2010 05:25:28 AM 1149 Views
Well. Fanatic-Templar - 15/07/2010 06:53:29 AM 1030 Views
Actually I think it's one of those things that make AS so stupid darius_sedai - 10/08/2010 09:36:43 PM 1112 Views
the Sorilea moment is when they first meet Semirhage darius_sedai - 10/08/2010 09:32:26 PM 1203 Views
Thanks for the quote. Fanatic-Templar - 10/08/2010 10:02:36 PM 1249 Views
Re: I just think it's funny that people make fun of such a basic plan as convoluted. saidarisnowtainted - 14/07/2010 05:40:11 PM 1059 Views
She's so smart, she knows Rand will bring along Nynaeve to check Delana's Compulsion BlackAdder - 13/07/2010 08:32:19 PM 1039 Views
we've seen any number of times that a Channeler can make an exact copy of weaves darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:10:41 PM 1168 Views
Ramshalan didn't know the plan as you claim Skeeve the Great - 14/07/2010 04:16:29 PM 961 Views
he knew enough to alert Graendal to the danger darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:50:26 PM 1213 Views
No. Don't think so. Tom - 13/07/2010 08:35:34 PM 1028 Views
I so desperately want you to be right. Seriana Sedai - 14/07/2010 06:30:16 AM 1198 Views
Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... fionwe1987 - 14/07/2010 06:53:48 AM 1129 Views
Re: Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... Fanatic-Templar - 14/07/2010 07:10:49 AM 1198 Views
Re: Graendal being alive would make more of a statement... Seriana Sedai - 15/07/2010 10:50:05 PM 1120 Views
Yip Sidious - 14/07/2010 04:33:03 PM 1084 Views
Lame. eucatastrophe - 14/07/2010 10:44:47 AM 1025 Views
Not really darius_sedai - 14/07/2010 04:15:38 PM 995 Views
she's dead, get over it *NM* Yunalesca - 14/07/2010 01:12:15 PM 662 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? saidarisnowtainted - 14/07/2010 05:44:38 PM 1028 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 14/07/2010 07:21:29 PM 1124 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? saidarisnowtainted - 10/08/2010 09:12:17 PM 1219 Views
Sounds about right. Wonder if he intends to try and get Callandor? *NM* Lord Haart - 13/08/2010 07:41:47 AM 422 Views
*shrug* Seems a bit complex to me... Jeordam - 14/07/2010 07:17:49 PM 1429 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? Underwood - 15/07/2010 04:38:09 PM 1144 Views
Honestly, if she's still alive, how is she going to die? Gher - 16/07/2010 05:49:06 AM 1046 Views
Ahh, just remembered that some people think some Forsaken will survive Tarmon Gai'don. Still... *NM* Gher - 16/07/2010 05:51:41 AM 544 Views
Re: What about this little 'Graendal survived' theory? scooter - 10/11/2010 04:09:41 AM 1020 Views
Why? *Towers of Midnight spoilers* Fanatic-Templar - 10/11/2010 04:41:11 AM 998 Views
Because he was right, that's why. Terez - 11/11/2010 03:39:39 AM 994 Views
Not by my reckoning. *Still contains ToM spoilers* Fanatic-Templar - 11/11/2010 04:22:59 AM 975 Views
No one ever gets every detail right - it's impossible Terez - 11/11/2010 06:06:26 AM 1245 Views
Yes, but I don't think this was a detail. *Still ToM spoilers.* Fanatic-Templar - 11/11/2010 06:31:40 AM 1154 Views
Re: Why? *Towers of Midnight spoilers* scooter - 11/11/2010 04:12:38 AM 1123 Views
Please try to maintain some decorum. *Also ToM spoilers* Fanatic-Templar - 11/11/2010 04:45:08 AM 1059 Views
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