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I agree for the most part, but disagree on one thing. Lanfear Send a noteboard - 14/09/2009 07:52:10 PM
If raw strength in the power is considered, then Aginor is second to Ishamael. But as you've pointed out, Aginor was a sniveling little weasle with no skill. Without skill, Aginor's superior strength means little which is why that loser grovels before Demandred and many of the rest.

Aginor knows he has less skill as a weaver than the other chosen and he lacks the combat instincts that are crucial (see Demandred's ability to immediately ascertain what he is up against at the end of Winter's Heart compared to the other chosen's reactions) to one power duel. Aginor can channel more of the power than anyone except Ishamael, but Aginor's below average skill and battle prowess make him less of a threat than others like Demandred who might be able to channel slightly less power, but more than make up for it with superior skill and instincts.

It looks to me like you've defined powerful as a mixture of raw one power channeling ability, plus skill/dexterity, plus battle instincts. With that many factors to look at, Robert Jordan hasn't given enough information to make certain conclusions.

But just between you and me, Sidious, I'm the second most powerful!



You're totally right that Aginor was probably second in strength. However, when RJ made his point about strength vs skill by using Alivia and Cyndane, and directly telling us about it in his blog, it was convincing evidence that a channeler's skills and knowledge can bridge vast gaps in strength. RJ went as far to say that Alivia was 'much stronger' than Cyndane in that battle, but that skill and knowledge evened it out. Thus when channelers like Graendal or Semirhage duel, it is likely that they can bridge almost any strength gap, if there is one. It's not like there's much to bridge... any of the Forsaken are close to the highest strength possible in saidin or saidar.


Graendal or Semirhage could bridge a strength gap, as long as the person they are up against has less than average skill or less than average battle prowess/instincts. For example, if Graendal or Semirhage fight me, I'd kill them.

Moghedien and I didn't fight back against Graendal last time b/c we were ordered not to by Shaidar Haran and Moridin. If I wanted to, I would have kicked Graendal's arse.



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The top 6 Forsaken - similar in the One Power - 12/09/2009 09:27:20 PM 1762 Views
Some thoughts about Semmy - 12/09/2009 09:59:50 PM 954 Views
Re: Some thoughts about Semmy - 13/09/2009 08:33:28 AM 1002 Views
Of course... - 13/09/2009 08:36:39 AM 809 Views
I've been thinking the same for years - 12/09/2009 11:25:02 PM 917 Views
The Big White Book says... - 12/09/2009 11:46:43 PM 981 Views
Not Aginor - 13/09/2009 08:36:37 AM 991 Views
Re: Not Aginor - 13/09/2009 03:16:13 PM 881 Views
Re: Not Aginor - 13/09/2009 05:47:14 PM 924 Views
Fact is, the bwb is untrustworthy - 13/09/2009 05:54:28 PM 840 Views
We must either use all the quotes from the BWB or none of them - 13/09/2009 06:07:46 PM 893 Views
Or... - 13/09/2009 08:41:23 PM 836 Views
Re: Or... - 14/09/2009 04:46:52 AM 795 Views
But, RJ himself said that the BWB was written from the standpoint of a scholar - 14/09/2009 04:42:59 PM 824 Views
Re: Not Aginor - 13/09/2009 08:17:28 PM 799 Views
It all depends on how you define "powerful" - 14/09/2009 02:30:31 AM 916 Views
I agree 101%. *NM* - 14/09/2009 03:49:51 AM 463 Views
I think power is much more than raw strength - 14/09/2009 05:00:10 AM 800 Views
I agree for the most part, but disagree on one thing. - 14/09/2009 07:52:10 PM 929 Views
Re: The top 6 Forsaken - similar in the One Power - 12/09/2009 11:48:03 PM 847 Views
the other reason - 13/09/2009 03:24:24 PM 781 Views
So is graendal similar to lanfear then? - 13/09/2009 05:41:42 PM 784 Views
Graendal could fight Lanfear and win - 13/09/2009 06:01:57 PM 1324 Views
Graendal herself says... - 13/09/2009 09:08:46 PM 807 Views
Re: Graendal herself says... - 14/09/2009 04:48:37 AM 829 Views
Doesn't Graendal have an Angreal now? - 17/09/2009 03:29:10 AM 861 Views
Re: Graendal herself says... - 15/09/2009 05:36:53 PM 721 Views
Lanfear was more powerful than Graendal, but Cyndane has less power - 13/09/2009 10:19:35 PM 812 Views
Re: So is graendal similar to lanfear then? - 13/09/2009 06:05:11 PM 926 Views
I agree with this - 13/09/2009 06:15:24 PM 947 Views
Compulsion=any other deadly weave. Doesn't really change matters - 13/09/2009 10:23:40 PM 802 Views
Excellent point *NM* - 13/09/2009 10:35:08 PM 470 Views
But it did give her an edge, and against two forsaken. *NM* - 13/09/2009 11:12:09 PM 445 Views
Hm? When? *NM* - 14/09/2009 09:04:10 PM 372 Views
tPoD, when she compelled Cyndane and Moghedien. *NM* - 14/09/2009 10:19:23 PM 423 Views
Not at all - 14/09/2009 04:51:48 AM 866 Views
Using Compulsion on someone doesn't seem mechanically different - 14/09/2009 09:03:41 PM 711 Views
I'm not so sure about that - 14/09/2009 09:36:45 PM 819 Views
Totally agree - 14/09/2009 10:26:07 PM 624 Views
I don't agree. - 15/09/2009 04:33:04 PM 931 Views
Re: So is graendal similar to lanfear then? - 14/09/2009 04:34:24 PM 765 Views
But Graendal confronted her... twice! *NM* - 13/09/2009 07:48:29 PM 398 Views
Apparently only the third time counts *NM* - 13/09/2009 08:00:37 PM 432 Views
Really? - 13/09/2009 08:36:33 PM 780 Views
No falsely... - 13/09/2009 11:25:40 PM 998 Views
That's pretty much my opinion in a nutshell - 14/09/2009 04:56:15 AM 928 Views
And, of course, the male and female OP strength ranks might not even correlate that much - 14/09/2009 04:41:58 PM 744 Views
They correlate on some critical points - 14/09/2009 06:57:43 PM 875 Views
That's not exactly what I'm referring to. - 15/09/2009 04:36:29 PM 695 Views
But then we are discussing the same thing - 15/09/2009 06:59:04 PM 837 Views
I think, outside of semantics, our main disagreement doesn't lie amid the higher tiers - 16/09/2009 03:53:09 PM 712 Views
Probably - 16/09/2009 06:31:27 PM 854 Views
Re: Probably - 16/09/2009 07:19:03 PM 822 Views
Re: Probably - 16/09/2009 08:59:31 PM 773 Views
Re: Probably - 18/09/2009 07:03:09 PM 1107 Views
Ahh the old debate... - 17/09/2009 12:42:36 AM 792 Views
Re: Ahh the old debate... - 17/09/2009 05:26:52 AM 743 Views
I only disagree on one point, I think they are all rather equal in potential, incl. Ishamael - 14/09/2009 04:28:12 PM 799 Views
I do think Ishamel is special - 14/09/2009 07:04:03 PM 886 Views
He's special the same way any individual is special. - 14/09/2009 11:36:42 PM 839 Views
Re: He's special the same way any individual is special. - 15/09/2009 08:36:20 AM 810 Views
Re: He's special the same way any individual is special. - 15/09/2009 03:48:34 PM 799 Views
Re: He's special the same way any individual is special. - 15/09/2009 04:39:39 PM 797 Views
Re: He's special the same way any individual is special. - 15/09/2009 04:53:00 PM 791 Views
Re: He's special the same way any individual is special. - 15/09/2009 06:47:45 PM 750 Views
The more interesting question is... - 14/09/2009 06:34:11 PM 743 Views
Hmmm - 14/09/2009 07:04:34 PM 771 Views
I think we'll see Graendal vs. Aran'gar. - 14/09/2009 07:31:16 PM 840 Views
Ah yes, that makes sense, and would be great! *NM* - 14/09/2009 07:40:29 PM 641 Views
Yeah. Though I think its no competition. Graendal has got to be better than a walking tree! - 14/09/2009 07:50:09 PM 735 Views
They do imply that Graendal is a lot more dangerous than she looks - 14/09/2009 09:08:43 PM 765 Views
I've never underestimated Graendal - 14/09/2009 09:42:49 PM 817 Views
Yeah... her frivolity was always a red flag for me too. - 14/09/2009 10:18:40 PM 800 Views
To me, she is the most lethal. - 15/09/2009 05:18:10 PM 618 Views
Yup... - 15/09/2009 06:39:20 PM 666 Views
I still like Lanfear more - 15/09/2009 06:51:03 PM 762 Views
Bah! She's an idiot! - 15/09/2009 07:06:06 PM 761 Views
only in love *NM* - 15/09/2009 07:23:29 PM 727 Views
Graendal did not beat me and Moghedien - 15/09/2009 05:59:39 PM 842 Views
Agreed - 15/09/2009 06:36:48 PM 738 Views
Ummm... how do we know? - 15/09/2009 06:40:57 PM 861 Views
Re: Ummm... how do we know? - 15/09/2009 06:56:21 PM 783 Views
Hmmm... - 15/09/2009 07:07:45 PM 943 Views

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