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Re: You must tell me of this special math... Tor Send a noteboard - 20/11/2012 04:29:40 PM


Nope, they mustn't. Not from the maths alone. And I'm fairly sure I would have remembered if the books had mentioned standard deviations at any point.

From the math alone, any two strengths equidistant from the mean will have the same probability of occurrence. That is baked into the definition of normal distribution, not a matter of opinion.


Absolutely. But it doesn't follow that Lanfear and Morgase are equidistant from the mean.

Edit: What I mean is that you can't argue that Lanfear and Morgase are equidistant from the mean on the basis of maths alone, you have to have something from the books.

And while it seems to be commonly accepted that Lanfear is as strong as a woman can be, I don't think it's established that Morgase is as weak as it's possible to be, and even if it was, Jordan didn't neccessarily truncate the distribution symmetrically.
Fram kamerater!
This message last edited by Tor on 20/11/2012 at 04:45:35 PM
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How many standard deviations is Lanfear Lanfear - 15/11/2012 06:04:39 PM 2574 Views
Well... vandevere - 15/11/2012 07:02:45 PM 1573 Views
Hmm... Sidious - 15/11/2012 07:25:34 PM 1667 Views
see we CAN agree on stuff darius_sedai - 15/11/2012 07:56:12 PM 1516 Views
Sidious - 18/11/2012 08:37:22 PM 1372 Views
We've always been close with everything except the scale darius_sedai - 18/11/2012 10:29:07 PM 1397 Views
Re: DomA - 18/11/2012 11:07:17 PM 1588 Views
Re: Sidious - 19/11/2012 05:16:00 AM 1420 Views
Re: DomA - 19/11/2012 03:13:01 PM 1413 Views
They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5% Shannow - 19/11/2012 03:19:19 PM 1465 Views
Re: They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5% DomA - 19/11/2012 04:01:43 PM 1622 Views
Re: They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5% darius_sedai - 19/11/2012 09:04:04 PM 1389 Views
Hmmm... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 02:08:40 AM 1441 Views
Perhaps, but Egwene is also being a bit dramatic in the scene as she managed darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:28:57 AM 1435 Views
Nope... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:13:13 PM 1507 Views
I believe she is being over dramatic darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 03:26:24 PM 1356 Views
Keep believing that... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:30:14 PM 1502 Views
*shrugs* darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 03:49:10 PM 1481 Views
Tired and forkroot are the same now? fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:55:22 PM 1377 Views
No it's the literary device darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:04:28 PM 1487 Views
This is getting ridiculous... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 04:43:13 PM 1348 Views
You are missing my point completely darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:50:46 PM 1277 Views
Impossible. Daigian is exactly 0.32SD below the mean Shannow - 19/11/2012 11:06:04 AM 1424 Views
You keep saying that, but it is either a linear or a non-linear distribution darius_sedai - 19/11/2012 09:09:32 PM 1503 Views
That's the whole point. Thanks for finally seeing it. Shannow - 19/11/2012 09:43:27 PM 1455 Views
keep believing that ... but you making up numbers isn't really relevant *NM* darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:29:44 AM 876 Views
Please show me a number that is made up. The 0.32SD for Daigian is a rule of statistics. Shannow - 20/11/2012 07:15:48 AM 1359 Views
Go read Fionwe's post about it *NM* darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 02:33:19 PM 884 Views
Is that before or after she started juicing? Praziquantel - 15/11/2012 11:04:14 PM 1415 Views
Wouldn't it be 1 in 105 million? Lanfear - 21/11/2012 04:56:19 PM 1301 Views
Are you sure that it is a normal distribution? Dreadlord - 16/11/2012 04:21:02 PM 1468 Views
Ugh. I hate power level discussions. For real world applications, it should be kind of meaningless beetnemesis - 16/11/2012 10:28:49 PM 1353 Views
I don't really agree Sidious - 18/11/2012 08:40:53 PM 1338 Views
Perhaps, but we've seen that a MUCH weaker Channeler can win in a duel darius_sedai - 19/11/2012 09:13:48 PM 1369 Views
Re: Perhaps, but we've seen that a MUCH weaker Channeler can win in a duel Sidious - 20/11/2012 08:10:01 AM 1363 Views
probably ... Lanfear/Cyndane is clearly remarkably skilled darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 02:35:09 PM 1398 Views
Since I've proven that it's not a normal distribution in units of absolute strength, SDs don't apply Shannow - 17/11/2012 07:48:21 PM 1433 Views
You have proven nothing, except that you have an opinion *NM* darius_sedai - 18/11/2012 02:21:35 AM 858 Views
You simply don't get it. It is mathematically a fact. There is no opinion involved. Shannow - 18/11/2012 02:19:40 PM 1212 Views
Only because you've assigned numeric values. That you created. darius_sedai - 18/11/2012 02:40:51 PM 1392 Views
It doesn't matter what figure you use... Shannow - 18/11/2012 03:01:56 PM 1295 Views
What if Daigian is one third Lanfear's strength? fionwe1987 - 18/11/2012 04:37:58 PM 1431 Views
We have a limit for Daigian's strength, as you well know. Shannow - 18/11/2012 05:41:49 PM 1352 Views
Are you kidding me? fionwe1987 - 18/11/2012 09:07:38 PM 1507 Views
Sure you can darius_sedai - 18/11/2012 10:09:31 PM 1417 Views
Re: Sure you can DomA - 18/11/2012 10:54:50 PM 1394 Views
You're right, though its 37.5% fionwe1987 - 19/11/2012 12:21:29 AM 1367 Views
Oops, typo! darius_sedai - 19/11/2012 02:54:25 AM 1422 Views
Again, not possible, due to Daigian being just 0.3SD below the Mean Shannow - 19/11/2012 08:37:01 AM 1365 Views
Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys... fionwe1987 - 19/11/2012 04:05:12 PM 1287 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys... Sidious - 19/11/2012 05:55:02 PM 1229 Views
Egwene is about as strong as Melaine and Amys combined darius_sedai - 19/11/2012 09:19:50 PM 1353 Views
Re: Egwene is about as strong as Melaine and Amys combined fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 02:11:26 AM 1432 Views
Forkroot in every case darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:32:26 AM 1349 Views
No! fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:15:16 PM 1365 Views
I'm not going to go re-read the books to you on this darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 03:39:46 PM 1341 Views
You need to read it for yourself, since you're completely confused. fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:54:26 PM 1352 Views
Not going to argue this with you. darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:09:44 PM 1260 Views
Your own example disproved your point... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 04:39:25 PM 1400 Views
let's see, she's both asleep and would need hours to regain her strength darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:43:17 PM 1290 Views
Enough! fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:04:06 PM 1365 Views
LOL ... whatever. You go on believing that ... no one else sees it this way. *NM* darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:20:52 PM 848 Views
What a brilliant argument! fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:25:18 PM 1365 Views
this is why I refuse to continue this debate darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:31:11 PM 1320 Views
Re: Your own example disproved your point... Sidious - 20/11/2012 05:10:15 PM 1376 Views
Barasine + Katerine isn't that much less than darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:26:31 PM 1374 Views
Re: Barasine + Katerine isn't that much less than Sidious - 20/11/2012 05:31:50 PM 1366 Views
Re: Barasine + Katerine isn't that much less than darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:42:53 PM 1332 Views
Excuse me? fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:28:48 PM 1415 Views
see we can agree on the relative strength of Egwene v. Forsaken darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:35:07 PM 1374 Views
??? Sidious - 20/11/2012 05:37:01 PM 1453 Views
2 middling sisters darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:45:27 PM 1388 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 02:26:47 AM 1298 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys... Sidious - 20/11/2012 09:03:40 AM 1366 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys... darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 02:59:08 PM 1362 Views
None of this is backed by any evidence... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:24:12 PM 1282 Views
who said Cadsuane was 1.5x Moiraine or more? darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:03:13 PM 1299 Views
Nope... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 04:41:35 PM 1311 Views
wrong darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:48:50 PM 1276 Views
My bad. Mized up 1/3 and 2/3. fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:05:05 PM 1355 Views
gotcha *NM* darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:46:21 PM 821 Views
Better evidence? LOL! fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:18:55 PM 1347 Views
Huh? How did you come to that conclusion? darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:40:56 PM 1348 Views
Exactly *NM* Sidious - 20/11/2012 04:55:28 PM 1327 Views
BEcause Cadsuane is close on the heels of Egwene? fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:10:50 PM 1236 Views
I'm not arguing that. I agree that Cadsuane is pretty close to Egwene darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:50:34 PM 1405 Views
Re: Better evidence? LOL! Sidious - 20/11/2012 05:00:47 PM 1260 Views
Interesting, but let's go with your figures... Shannow - 19/11/2012 06:54:54 AM 1432 Views
Indeed Sidious - 19/11/2012 08:16:44 AM 1444 Views
Rand is sort of a special case darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:25:02 AM 1328 Views
Regarding Mesaana... Sidious - 20/11/2012 08:42:56 AM 1339 Views
You continue to mix two things darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 03:24:44 PM 1252 Views
No Sidious - 20/11/2012 04:54:19 PM 1499 Views
You are mistaken darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 05:04:40 PM 1300 Views
Yes she did Darius! Sidious - 20/11/2012 05:27:36 PM 1276 Views
Yet there is no duel darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 06:01:17 PM 1269 Views
Explain the .3xSD thing to me... fionwe1987 - 19/11/2012 04:58:57 PM 1525 Views
Probably, but the AS have no idea what 37.5% means darius_sedai - 19/11/2012 02:59:26 AM 1298 Views
It's irrelevant DomA - 19/11/2012 03:46:42 AM 1380 Views
Agreed. Daigian is the marker of the absolute bottom of Aes Sedai strength. Shannow - 19/11/2012 06:55:41 AM 1340 Views
Daigian Sidious - 19/11/2012 08:12:19 AM 1338 Views
It is a direct marker due to RJ's quote Shannow - 19/11/2012 08:50:26 AM 1396 Views
You missed my point Sidious - 19/11/2012 09:08:42 AM 1296 Views
Re: You missed my point DomA - 19/11/2012 02:18:33 PM 1431 Views
Asmodean would never have made the comment about 13 weakest AS darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:41:11 AM 1314 Views
Re: Asmodean would never have made the comment about 13 weakest AS Sidious - 20/11/2012 09:07:49 AM 1287 Views
Which would make an average AS around a 30 darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:58:56 PM 1195 Views
Re: Sure you can Tor - 19/11/2012 09:22:09 AM 1454 Views
Care to explain this... fionwe1987 - 19/11/2012 05:06:28 PM 1231 Views
Indeed Tor - 20/11/2012 07:16:37 AM 1441 Views
Explained far better than I ever could. Bravo. Shannow - 20/11/2012 07:30:29 AM 1320 Views
Well duh. fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 02:57:24 PM 1419 Views
Incorrect. Shannow - 20/11/2012 04:28:07 PM 1403 Views
No fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 04:44:16 PM 1379 Views
Re: No Tor - 20/11/2012 04:48:36 PM 1364 Views
That depends... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:18:46 PM 1220 Views
Re: That depends... Tor - 20/11/2012 05:31:03 PM 1823 Views
You're integrating without lower limits... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 02:55:06 PM 1356 Views
Re: You're integrating without lower limits... Tor - 20/11/2012 04:37:57 PM 1398 Views
It matters. fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:22:40 PM 1407 Views
We are not talking about a normal distribution in any case darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:44:24 AM 1188 Views
Re: We are not talking about a normal distribution in any case Tor - 20/11/2012 07:02:47 AM 1394 Views
You must tell me of this special math... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 03:10:09 PM 1281 Views
Re: You must tell me of this special math... Tor - 20/11/2012 04:29:40 PM 1342 Views
Morghase is a placeholder... fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 04:45:42 PM 1430 Views
Re: Morghase is a placeholder... Tor - 20/11/2012 04:49:54 PM 1698 Views
Why? fionwe1987 - 20/11/2012 05:23:29 PM 1358 Views
Re: Why? Tor - 20/11/2012 05:36:45 PM 1670 Views
Well... Sidious - 18/11/2012 08:43:59 PM 1405 Views
Re: Well... DomA - 19/11/2012 03:40:44 PM 1373 Views
Wow. Shannow - 19/11/2012 03:53:47 PM 1409 Views
Re: Wow. DomA - 19/11/2012 04:26:09 PM 1430 Views
Some points Sidious - 19/11/2012 06:03:00 PM 1457 Views
Well then you're both wrong I'm afraid Sidious - 19/11/2012 06:09:36 PM 1345 Views
Re: Well then you're both wrong I'm afraid DomA - 19/11/2012 07:42:58 PM 1235 Views
this is why I think all of the Forsaken are very close in Power darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 04:51:20 AM 1409 Views
Agreed Sidious - 20/11/2012 08:13:37 AM 1464 Views
probably darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 06:18:45 PM 1301 Views
Re: this is why I think all of the Forsaken are very close in Power DomA - 20/11/2012 02:45:18 PM 1320 Views
I think RJ went out of his way to keep strength a bit of a mystery darius_sedai - 20/11/2012 08:42:44 PM 1359 Views
Indeed... DomA - 21/11/2012 05:44:18 PM 1265 Views
I agree darius_sedai - 22/11/2012 01:43:02 AM 1545 Views
Math gurus...Is it possible to find the missing variable... Lanfear - 21/11/2012 05:12:24 PM 1345 Views
the problem is that the Mean is not going to tell us much really darius_sedai - 22/11/2012 02:55:03 AM 1416 Views
Re: the problem is that the Mean is not going to tell us much really Lanfear - 22/11/2012 03:15:33 AM 1705 Views
I do not think you can calculate the Mean without knowing the Units of Power darius_sedai - 22/11/2012 03:53:59 AM 1478 Views
Re: Math gurus...Is it possible to find the missing variable... Tor - 23/11/2012 02:59:12 PM 1811 Views
Disregard this post *NM* Tor - 23/11/2012 03:02:24 PM 1091 Views
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