he is as strong as a Forsaken from almost his first moments touching the Source (he's stronger than Aginor in EoTW and a match for Be'lal and Ishamael in TDR) in all honesty his strength has been inconsistent throughout the series, but he's never been weaker than any Forsaken Male. Egwene and Elayne were both well short of their ultimate strength when he manhandles them and Verin and Alana are probably no more than Mean level Sisters so him overpowering them is a no brainer ... on my scale the stongest they can be is 32 ... Maybe 1 SD above a Mean of 24 or so ... combined they wouldn't be much more than 1/2 of a Forsaken male.
When you consider a Forsaken is going to be at a minimum an Effective strength of 85 it's going to take the most Powerful sisters (Myrelle or higher) to even be a strength match for a single weak Forsaken on a strength basis ... at a minimum they would need 3 of the Strongest Sisters to have a reliable strength match and even that would easily be countered by superior skill. If Nynaeve was ball park 85 in Ebou Dar, Ispan and Falion combined would be around around a 60-65 and their shield would be viable. Even if they lost 10% of their raw power they would gain effectiveness from linking and could hold Nynaeve.
I agree that for most of the series Egwene is around a 65-70 (between 80-90% or her potential), but I don't think she's hit her full potential ( 80 IMO) until maybe TGS when we see some significant increases in her abilities. Even in KoD she briefly considers taking on 5 AS until she realizes she's been forkrooted. And in ToM, after her massive use of Power using Vora's sa'angreal probably pushed her to her full potential, she is confident she can defeat Mesaana in single combat, which lends to her being much closer to Forsaken Strength than AS strength. And let's not forget that RJ noted that Egwene/Elayne/Aviendha are ONE level below the Forsaken.
When you consider a Forsaken is going to be at a minimum an Effective strength of 85 it's going to take the most Powerful sisters (Myrelle or higher) to even be a strength match for a single weak Forsaken on a strength basis ... at a minimum they would need 3 of the Strongest Sisters to have a reliable strength match and even that would easily be countered by superior skill. If Nynaeve was ball park 85 in Ebou Dar, Ispan and Falion combined would be around around a 60-65 and their shield would be viable. Even if they lost 10% of their raw power they would gain effectiveness from linking and could hold Nynaeve.
I agree that for most of the series Egwene is around a 65-70 (between 80-90% or her potential), but I don't think she's hit her full potential ( 80 IMO) until maybe TGS when we see some significant increases in her abilities. Even in KoD she briefly considers taking on 5 AS until she realizes she's been forkrooted. And in ToM, after her massive use of Power using Vora's sa'angreal probably pushed her to her full potential, she is confident she can defeat Mesaana in single combat, which lends to her being much closer to Forsaken Strength than AS strength. And let's not forget that RJ noted that Egwene/Elayne/Aviendha are ONE level below the Forsaken.
Egwene does not believe that she can defeat Mesaana alone. Her initial quote doesn't imply that she would do it alone. She may have planned an ambush or to confront Mesaana on her own terms, or with an angreal.
Later she says... "Egwene gritted her teeth and sent herself away. She didn't dare face the woman directly."
That is once again direct evidence that Egwene feels she can't fight one of the Forsaken directly. This is now after she has felt Mesaana's strength and perhaps seen her skill. Her opinion is unchanged to when she spoke about the Forsaken in Salidar.
Wheel of Time board admin
Fan of Lanfear
Fan of Lanfear
How many standard deviations is Lanfear
15/11/2012 06:04:39 PM
- 1962 Views
Hmm...
15/11/2012 07:25:34 PM
- 1114 Views
see we CAN agree on stuff
15/11/2012 07:56:12 PM
- 972 Views
18/11/2012 08:37:22 PM
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Re:
18/11/2012 11:07:17 PM
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Re:
19/11/2012 05:16:00 AM
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Re:
19/11/2012 03:13:01 PM
- 924 Views
They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5%
19/11/2012 03:19:19 PM
- 898 Views
Re: They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5%
19/11/2012 04:01:43 PM
- 1129 Views
Re: They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5%
19/11/2012 09:04:04 PM
- 866 Views
Hmmm...
20/11/2012 02:08:40 AM
- 925 Views
Perhaps, but Egwene is also being a bit dramatic in the scene as she managed
20/11/2012 04:28:57 AM
- 894 Views
Nope...
20/11/2012 03:13:13 PM
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I believe she is being over dramatic
20/11/2012 03:26:24 PM
- 833 Views
Keep believing that...
20/11/2012 03:30:14 PM
- 960 Views
*shrugs*
20/11/2012 03:49:10 PM
- 914 Views
Tired and forkroot are the same now?
20/11/2012 03:55:22 PM
- 837 Views
No it's the literary device
20/11/2012 04:04:28 PM
- 948 Views
Impossible. Daigian is exactly 0.32SD below the mean
19/11/2012 11:06:04 AM
- 880 Views
You keep saying that, but it is either a linear or a non-linear distribution
19/11/2012 09:09:32 PM
- 937 Views
That's the whole point. Thanks for finally seeing it.
19/11/2012 09:43:27 PM
- 891 Views
keep believing that ... but you making up numbers isn't really relevant *NM*
20/11/2012 04:29:44 AM
- 615 Views
Please show me a number that is made up. The 0.32SD for Daigian is a rule of statistics.
20/11/2012 07:15:48 AM
- 857 Views
Ugh. I hate power level discussions. For real world applications, it should be kind of meaningless
16/11/2012 10:28:49 PM
- 869 Views
I don't really agree
18/11/2012 08:40:53 PM
- 816 Views
Perhaps, but we've seen that a MUCH weaker Channeler can win in a duel
19/11/2012 09:13:48 PM
- 875 Views
Re: Perhaps, but we've seen that a MUCH weaker Channeler can win in a duel
20/11/2012 08:10:01 AM
- 852 Views
Since I've proven that it's not a normal distribution in units of absolute strength, SDs don't apply
17/11/2012 07:48:21 PM
- 901 Views
You have proven nothing, except that you have an opinion *NM*
18/11/2012 02:21:35 AM
- 600 Views
You simply don't get it. It is mathematically a fact. There is no opinion involved.
18/11/2012 02:19:40 PM
- 741 Views
Only because you've assigned numeric values. That you created.
18/11/2012 02:40:51 PM
- 856 Views
It doesn't matter what figure you use...
18/11/2012 03:01:56 PM
- 757 Views
What if Daigian is one third Lanfear's strength?
18/11/2012 04:37:58 PM
- 883 Views
Sure you can
18/11/2012 10:09:31 PM
- 911 Views
Re: Sure you can
18/11/2012 10:54:50 PM
- 857 Views
You're right, though its 37.5%
19/11/2012 12:21:29 AM
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Oops, typo!
19/11/2012 02:54:25 AM
- 898 Views
Again, not possible, due to Daigian being just 0.3SD below the Mean
19/11/2012 08:37:01 AM
- 827 Views
Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
19/11/2012 04:05:12 PM
- 790 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
19/11/2012 05:55:02 PM
- 720 Views
Egwene is about as strong as Melaine and Amys combined
19/11/2012 09:19:50 PM
- 841 Views
Re: Egwene is about as strong as Melaine and Amys combined
20/11/2012 02:11:26 AM
- 852 Views
Forkroot in every case
20/11/2012 04:32:26 AM
- 836 Views
No!
20/11/2012 03:15:16 PM
- 831 Views
I'm not going to go re-read the books to you on this
20/11/2012 03:39:46 PM
- 834 Views
You need to read it for yourself, since you're completely confused.
20/11/2012 03:54:26 PM
- 802 Views
Not going to argue this with you.
20/11/2012 04:09:44 PM
- 779 Views
Your own example disproved your point...
20/11/2012 04:39:25 PM
- 854 Views
let's see, she's both asleep and would need hours to regain her strength
20/11/2012 04:43:17 PM
- 766 Views
Enough!
20/11/2012 05:04:06 PM
- 843 Views
LOL ... whatever. You go on believing that ... no one else sees it this way. *NM*
20/11/2012 05:20:52 PM
- 586 Views
Re: Your own example disproved your point...
20/11/2012 05:10:15 PM
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Barasine + Katerine isn't that much less than
20/11/2012 05:26:31 PM
- 894 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
20/11/2012 02:26:47 AM
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Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
20/11/2012 09:03:40 AM
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Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
20/11/2012 02:59:08 PM
- 864 Views
None of this is backed by any evidence...
20/11/2012 03:24:12 PM
- 770 Views
who said Cadsuane was 1.5x Moiraine or more?
20/11/2012 04:03:13 PM
- 782 Views
Nope...
20/11/2012 04:41:35 PM
- 826 Views
wrong
20/11/2012 04:48:50 PM
- 757 Views
Better evidence? LOL!
20/11/2012 03:18:55 PM
- 841 Views
Huh? How did you come to that conclusion?
20/11/2012 04:40:56 PM
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BEcause Cadsuane is close on the heels of Egwene?
20/11/2012 05:10:50 PM
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I'm not arguing that. I agree that Cadsuane is pretty close to Egwene
20/11/2012 05:50:34 PM
- 849 Views
Interesting, but let's go with your figures...
19/11/2012 06:54:54 AM
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Indeed
19/11/2012 08:16:44 AM
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Rand is sort of a special case
20/11/2012 04:25:02 AM
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Regarding Mesaana...
20/11/2012 08:42:56 AM
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You continue to mix two things
20/11/2012 03:24:44 PM
- 741 Views
No
20/11/2012 04:54:19 PM
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You are mistaken
20/11/2012 05:04:40 PM
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Probably, but the AS have no idea what 37.5% means
19/11/2012 02:59:26 AM
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It's irrelevant
19/11/2012 03:46:42 AM
- 827 Views
Agreed. Daigian is the marker of the absolute bottom of Aes Sedai strength.
19/11/2012 06:55:41 AM
- 805 Views
Daigian
19/11/2012 08:12:19 AM
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It is a direct marker due to RJ's quote
19/11/2012 08:50:26 AM
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You missed my point
19/11/2012 09:08:42 AM
- 802 Views
Asmodean would never have made the comment about 13 weakest AS
20/11/2012 04:41:11 AM
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Re: Asmodean would never have made the comment about 13 weakest AS
20/11/2012 09:07:49 AM
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Re: Sure you can
19/11/2012 09:22:09 AM
- 924 Views
Care to explain this...
19/11/2012 05:06:28 PM
- 782 Views
Indeed
20/11/2012 07:16:37 AM
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Explained far better than I ever could. Bravo.
20/11/2012 07:30:29 AM
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Well duh.
20/11/2012 02:57:24 PM
- 911 Views
Incorrect.
20/11/2012 04:28:07 PM
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No
20/11/2012 04:44:16 PM
- 877 Views
You're integrating without lower limits...
20/11/2012 02:55:06 PM
- 846 Views
We are not talking about a normal distribution in any case
20/11/2012 04:44:24 AM
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Re: We are not talking about a normal distribution in any case
20/11/2012 07:02:47 AM
- 865 Views
You must tell me of this special math...
20/11/2012 03:10:09 PM
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Re: You must tell me of this special math...
20/11/2012 04:29:40 PM
- 805 Views
Morghase is a placeholder...
20/11/2012 04:45:42 PM
- 882 Views
Well...
18/11/2012 08:43:59 PM
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Re: Well...
19/11/2012 03:40:44 PM
- 887 Views
Wow.
19/11/2012 03:53:47 PM
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Well then you're both wrong I'm afraid
19/11/2012 06:09:36 PM
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Re: Well then you're both wrong I'm afraid
19/11/2012 07:42:58 PM
- 691 Views
this is why I think all of the Forsaken are very close in Power
20/11/2012 04:51:20 AM
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Re: this is why I think all of the Forsaken are very close in Power
20/11/2012 02:45:18 PM
- 818 Views
I think RJ went out of his way to keep strength a bit of a mystery
20/11/2012 08:42:44 PM
- 837 Views
Math gurus...Is it possible to find the missing variable...
21/11/2012 05:12:24 PM
- 818 Views
the problem is that the Mean is not going to tell us much really
22/11/2012 02:55:03 AM
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Re: the problem is that the Mean is not going to tell us much really
22/11/2012 03:15:33 AM
- 1181 Views
I do not think you can calculate the Mean without knowing the Units of Power
22/11/2012 03:53:59 AM
- 989 Views