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For example, the Great Captain Bryne doesn't agree with you... Etzel Send a noteboard - 16/12/2009 08:25:19 PM
They're not going to be fighting alongside real Shadow troops, and by themselves they're even less effective than the Trolloc army that attacked Rand in Knife of Dreams.

As for the Dragonsworn, I've been convinced by DomA that they're the work of Lanfear.


Plot-wise it also doesn't make any sense that RJ would let Roedran gather an army since WH, which is insignificant.

Consider e.g. that, while Moridin launches his Shadowspawn invasion from the Blight, Demandred would attack Andor with Roedran's army (possibly supported by Taim's cronies & BA). We know that Roedran had spies in the Caemlyn Palace.

At the same time Demandred could order his Dragonsworn bands to make guerilla attacks on cities, towns and villages in half of all the Westlands' nations to throw them yet into more chaos. Besides that, the DF gathered by Moghedien and Cyndane will raise in all the Westlands.

If Demandred managed to get most of the Dragonsworn leaders in the west under his thumb plus Murandy, it would explain why he was quite busy and how he greatly served chaos. Besides, Demandred is probably a general as good as the Great Captains, and look what Ituralde achieved (Ituralde even says with 100 AM added to his troops, he could probably smash the entire Seanchan army).

To me such a sceanrio seems much more satisfying than a complete deux ex machina Sharan army or - even worse - one from the Land of the Madmen (which is only mentioned in the Guide).
This message last edited by Etzel on 16/12/2009 at 08:35:17 PM
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The legend of Murandy's unimportance Etzel - 15/12/2009 03:02:16 PM 1406 Views
But it's still a small country Sidious - 15/12/2009 03:06:24 PM 778 Views
Again, Murandy might be a bit smaller Etzel - 15/12/2009 03:10:11 PM 817 Views
Re: Again, Murandy might be a bit smaller Sidious - 15/12/2009 04:44:22 PM 739 Views
The Dragonsworn made chaos in half of the Westlands. Etzel - 15/12/2009 04:55:00 PM 1031 Views
Agreed, only Sammael, Rhavin and Be'lal really laid claim to nations darius_sedai - 15/12/2009 07:12:17 PM 755 Views
to confirm you amirebram - 15/12/2009 10:47:22 PM 773 Views
I'm just not convinced that this would be a coup major enough to earn Demandred DO Kudos. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 15/12/2009 03:06:54 PM 785 Views
As said, controlling Murandy plus chaos by the Dragonsworn in 6 Westland nations. *NM* Etzel - 15/12/2009 03:11:25 PM 347 Views
well no, arad doman and tarabon were not his.... *NM* mazza3 - 15/12/2009 03:57:27 PM 388 Views
Umm.., care to elaborate? *NM* Etzel - 15/12/2009 04:10:15 PM 342 Views
I was pretty sure that the Dragonsworn as a fighting force were destroyed. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 15/12/2009 04:07:38 PM 725 Views
But the Dragonsworn caused much chaos everywhere they were through the series... Etzel - 15/12/2009 04:28:42 PM 697 Views
But that's not the Shadow's aim. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 15/12/2009 06:32:38 PM 772 Views
What if the only way to free the DO involves the world lacking the order necessary to contain him? darius_sedai - 15/12/2009 11:59:47 PM 710 Views
I have always said that Demandred is loosely based on Hannibal Barca... Shannow - 15/12/2009 04:29:22 PM 800 Views
Those a pretty flimsy conformities, IMO... Etzel - 15/12/2009 04:53:04 PM 746 Views
Of course.. Shannow - 15/12/2009 05:06:04 PM 754 Views
The Seanchan have elephants too ... S'redit I think they call them darius_sedai - 16/12/2009 12:04:40 AM 865 Views
Yes, but with so many Trollocs who needs vast armies of men? darius_sedai - 15/12/2009 07:15:08 PM 727 Views
Re: I'm just not convinced that this would be a coup major enough to earn Demandred DO Kudos. dadof5 - 15/12/2009 08:15:05 PM 794 Views
Re: I'm just not convinced that this would be a coup major enough to earn Demandred DO Kudos. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 15/12/2009 08:28:02 PM 704 Views
But this has been going on since at least aCoS darius_sedai - 16/12/2009 12:07:08 AM 694 Views
Re: But this has been going on since at least aCoS RugbyPlayingAshaman - 16/12/2009 03:01:00 PM 737 Views
well, it's not like the Forsaken have been particularly impressive thus far darius_sedai - 16/12/2009 06:51:38 PM 705 Views
It's about the impact of action. Timing. amirebram - 15/12/2009 10:53:03 PM 710 Views
Why does Demandred say: "We" will be ready? Why not "I" will be ready? Shannow - 15/12/2009 04:06:42 PM 911 Views
Well... Etzel - 15/12/2009 04:22:57 PM 768 Views
Re: Why does Demandred say: "We" will be ready? Why not "I" will be ready? RugbyPlayingAshaman - 15/12/2009 07:59:16 PM 751 Views
It is insignificant. Fanatic-Templar - 15/12/2009 10:49:20 PM 706 Views
It's importance lies in it's strategic location. Rurouni_Kenshin - 16/12/2009 04:46:20 AM 715 Views
I think some Murandians might mention Trollocs gathering there. Fanatic-Templar - 16/12/2009 07:05:29 AM 736 Views
what if they're wearing dresses and lady masks? *NM* Deadsy - 16/12/2009 09:10:57 AM 335 Views
Do the ladies in Murandy wear masks? I don't recall. Fanatic-Templar - 16/12/2009 09:24:46 AM 719 Views
masks to look like ladies *NM* Deadsy - 16/12/2009 04:11:07 PM 352 Views
Note to self: Avoid the Murandian ladies... *NM* BlackAdder - 16/12/2009 05:06:04 PM 346 Views
Moridin is gathering the Trollocs in the Blight, as we learn in TGS! Etzel - 16/12/2009 12:13:38 PM 714 Views
A Murandian army is insignificant. Fanatic-Templar - 16/12/2009 07:59:54 PM 708 Views
For example, the Great Captain Bryne doesn't agree with you... Etzel - 16/12/2009 08:25:19 PM 708 Views
Maybe he's based in an alternate universe? BlackAdder - 16/12/2009 09:26:53 PM 703 Views
He doesn't? Fanatic-Templar - 16/12/2009 11:37:34 PM 690 Views
Like the supposed unimportance of Murandy, it's a typical misunderstanding... Etzel - 17/12/2009 11:56:16 AM 786 Views
Re: A Murandian army is insignificant. Sidious - 16/12/2009 08:27:28 PM 716 Views
Surely you jest. Fanatic-Templar - 16/12/2009 11:39:23 PM 632 Views
Re: Surely you jest. Sidious - 17/12/2009 06:35:57 AM 682 Views
Well that depends. Fanatic-Templar - 17/12/2009 08:33:12 PM 702 Views
As said, it's additional chaos and strife. Etzel - 16/12/2009 12:01:05 PM 1130 Views
Its illogical to assume that Westlanders... Heiko - 16/12/2009 12:25:08 AM 716 Views
But that is exactly... Etzel - 16/12/2009 11:53:11 AM 715 Views
I agree mostly. It's a common RJ theme Deadsy - 16/12/2009 07:42:39 AM 750 Views
Honestly, at this point BlackAdder - 16/12/2009 09:07:35 AM 734 Views
In my view... Etzel - 16/12/2009 12:10:20 PM 668 Views
Re: In my view... BlackAdder - 16/12/2009 04:08:41 PM 711 Views
Kisman's pov shows Demandred has been involved in the BT Light in the Night - 17/12/2009 06:01:49 AM 844 Views
I think... Etzel - 17/12/2009 12:07:05 PM 679 Views
You're right Light in the Night - 17/12/2009 12:33:35 PM 719 Views
Interesting. BlackAdder - 17/12/2009 05:41:20 PM 653 Views
Aran'gar playing Demandred... Etzel - 17/12/2009 06:23:23 PM 713 Views
Ah, right that order is certainly out of character with Demandred. *NM* BlackAdder - 17/12/2009 06:40:32 PM 306 Views
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