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See, there's another one of those BS stats tricks, 'family members' includes suicides and murder Isaac Send a noteboard - 26/07/2012 06:47:54 PM
Now you get to decide if you want to own one yourself. Valid arguments can be made on both sides. Statistics show a gun is more likely to being used on a member of your family than a bad guy but being arrogant and willing follow some common sense practices like trigger locks I think I can avoid that and keep a gun safely. I may be self delusional but such is life.


They count the death from firearms taking place in the owner's home, which is a real specific thing not including prevented muggings for instance. And they include not just accidental shootings but suicides and murder of family members, well you're always way more likely to kill or be killed someone you know well, and it seems damned dishonest to imply keeping a gun in your house for robbers is more likely to result in little Timmy getting Excedrin Migraine Headache #357 from playing with the gun or getting shot by a spooked dad then a robber. Not when most of those 'household deaths' will be suicide and most of the remainder will be 'expedited divorces'.

Kellerman's BS '43 times more likely' study has been debunked so many times by so many groups it's absurd. HE never included cases where the trigger was not pulled and the intruder simply detained till cops arrived, he repeatedly refused to allow others to check his data, he included in home by gun suicide, and it goes on. Yet people here the narrative so often it sinks in.


The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.
- Albert Einstein

King of Cairhien 20-7-2
Chancellor of the Landsraad, Archduke of Is'Mod
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Do you have strong feelings/opinions about gun control? - 25/07/2012 05:48:56 AM 1510 Views
Kind of? - 25/07/2012 05:59:39 AM 960 Views
Agreed - 25/07/2012 06:20:44 AM 834 Views
Re: Agreed - 25/07/2012 06:29:16 AM 943 Views
A lot of people are uncomfortable about homsexuality. Let's ban that too. - 25/07/2012 09:26:46 PM 939 Views
Feisty. - 25/07/2012 09:54:31 PM 1041 Views
I'm pro-guns, but I don't think I have strong feelings about anything - 25/07/2012 07:36:31 AM 874 Views
I am mostly in agreement with you. - 26/07/2012 02:11:56 AM 744 Views
Fully automatic weapons are already forbidden, aren't they? - 27/07/2012 02:19:57 AM 869 Views
Pretty strong (as someone born, raised and living outside the US) - 25/07/2012 11:23:52 AM 958 Views
I'm okay with guns in very limited circumstances. - 25/07/2012 11:41:13 AM 1009 Views
Re: I'm okay with guns in very limited circumstances. - 25/07/2012 01:21:36 PM 916 Views
Inevitable thread, but mostly I feel people enters this debate without knowing enough about guns - 25/07/2012 02:05:12 PM 1117 Views
I have to admit that I didn't read most of that, sorry. - 25/07/2012 02:47:05 PM 1013 Views
Re: I have to admit that I didn't read most of that, sorry. - 25/07/2012 03:00:07 PM 892 Views
Re: - 25/07/2012 03:30:44 PM 933 Views
Okay, that makes no sense - 25/07/2012 04:32:28 PM 939 Views
Re: Re: - 25/07/2012 05:50:23 PM 974 Views
Re: I have to admit that I didn't read most of that, sorry. - 25/07/2012 10:48:46 PM 973 Views
I understand, but you probably should if time permits - 25/07/2012 03:49:49 PM 1087 Views
It is unlikely to, for a while. - 25/07/2012 10:37:30 PM 977 Views
Oh, but you have time to read Cannoli though - 26/07/2012 01:10:50 AM 911 Views
... his was shorter? - 26/07/2012 02:41:48 PM 833 Views
Yeah but mine had diagrams! - 26/07/2012 03:46:49 PM 910 Views
I do sometimes need pictures. - 26/07/2012 04:55:17 PM 764 Views
Re: I do sometimes need pictures. - 26/07/2012 04:57:57 PM 913 Views
*NM* - 26/07/2012 05:23:11 PM 435 Views
Where exactly did you get those numbers? - 27/07/2012 07:23:31 PM 925 Views
He's right as far as numbers go. - 27/07/2012 08:08:02 PM 958 Views
Wikipedia, the unchallenged source for acurate and complete citation - 27/07/2012 08:19:40 PM 999 Views
Sorry, I totally forgot about this post, hadn't noticed your replies. - 31/07/2012 07:42:43 PM 915 Views
I'm not surprised there were missing incidents - 31/07/2012 08:18:04 PM 888 Views
Re: I'm not surprised there were missing incidents - 31/07/2012 09:14:34 PM 865 Views
Re: I'm not surprised there were missing incidents - 31/07/2012 11:56:05 PM 1032 Views
Norway? Scotland? - 25/07/2012 09:31:49 PM 865 Views
You can keep this up - 25/07/2012 09:56:28 PM 851 Views
Hi, Cannoli. - 25/07/2012 10:30:56 PM 870 Views
well it could have at least double posted the edited version - 26/07/2012 10:40:32 PM 825 Views
Most of those numbers come from inner city violence - 26/07/2012 10:40:34 PM 1043 Views
Re: Hi, Cannoli. - 09/08/2012 09:07:03 PM 941 Views
The UK tightened gun laws after the Dunblane massacre. - 25/07/2012 10:58:08 PM 820 Views
I have no problem with guns, but I agree that assault weapons shouldn't be legal for ordinary people - 25/07/2012 02:56:38 PM 958 Views
The problem with banning assualt weapons is the defention is mostly cosmetic - 25/07/2012 05:29:35 PM 836 Views
Bullshit - 26/07/2012 01:52:59 PM 976 Views
I call Bullshit on your Bullshit - 26/07/2012 02:59:09 PM 895 Views
Or - 26/07/2012 03:20:12 PM 804 Views
There a lot of us with military training and some were in that theater - 26/07/2012 03:43:52 PM 814 Views
HE was talking about normal people. - 26/07/2012 04:53:16 PM 931 Views
I think we are talking past each other - 26/07/2012 05:55:48 PM 891 Views
Possibly. We do do that. - 26/07/2012 06:52:58 PM 917 Views
In addition to random thoughts's points... - 26/07/2012 03:10:56 PM 849 Views
You're partially right but mostly wrong - 26/07/2012 05:46:27 PM 897 Views
Correct me if I'm wrong.... - 25/07/2012 03:53:07 PM 1061 Views
You're wrong - 25/07/2012 04:37:22 PM 833 Views
Yes. - 25/07/2012 05:09:36 PM 832 Views
Yes and I am glad it's not my problem. - 25/07/2012 06:41:56 PM 963 Views
Dude, your burglary argument makes no sense - 25/07/2012 11:09:37 PM 863 Views
It makes lots of sense, actually. - 25/07/2012 11:55:59 PM 870 Views
They don't bring guns here. Huh. *NM* - 26/07/2012 12:59:15 AM 422 Views
they don't typically bring guns here either - 26/07/2012 02:01:14 AM 968 Views
That's how I understand it too but I'm dubious, many criminals are dumber than a bag of hammers - 26/07/2012 02:22:18 AM 819 Views
Ha! - 26/07/2012 12:07:20 PM 740 Views
One of my Marine friends became a Fort Worth cop when he got out - 26/07/2012 03:11:12 PM 941 Views
You get some wild stories - 26/07/2012 06:09:52 PM 942 Views
Like I've always said, you can't un-invent the gun - 25/07/2012 11:05:22 PM 832 Views
Agreed. It's really a lot like health care, in a way. - 26/07/2012 12:07:20 AM 947 Views
the argument of if America should have a lot guns is a long over - 26/07/2012 03:29:50 PM 799 Views
See, there's another one of those BS stats tricks, 'family members' includes suicides and murder - 26/07/2012 06:47:54 PM 830 Views
Sure, but you can legislate certain excessive firearms. - 26/07/2012 09:41:12 PM 928 Views
assault rifles are banned - 26/07/2012 10:51:28 PM 873 Views
Touchy - 28/07/2012 04:33:46 AM 1054 Views

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