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See, there's another one of those BS stats tricks, 'family members' includes suicides and murder Isaac Send a noteboard - 26/07/2012 06:47:54 PM
Now you get to decide if you want to own one yourself. Valid arguments can be made on both sides. Statistics show a gun is more likely to being used on a member of your family than a bad guy but being arrogant and willing follow some common sense practices like trigger locks I think I can avoid that and keep a gun safely. I may be self delusional but such is life.


They count the death from firearms taking place in the owner's home, which is a real specific thing not including prevented muggings for instance. And they include not just accidental shootings but suicides and murder of family members, well you're always way more likely to kill or be killed someone you know well, and it seems damned dishonest to imply keeping a gun in your house for robbers is more likely to result in little Timmy getting Excedrin Migraine Headache #357 from playing with the gun or getting shot by a spooked dad then a robber. Not when most of those 'household deaths' will be suicide and most of the remainder will be 'expedited divorces'.

Kellerman's BS '43 times more likely' study has been debunked so many times by so many groups it's absurd. HE never included cases where the trigger was not pulled and the intruder simply detained till cops arrived, he repeatedly refused to allow others to check his data, he included in home by gun suicide, and it goes on. Yet people here the narrative so often it sinks in.


The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.
- Albert Einstein

King of Cairhien 20-7-2
Chancellor of the Landsraad, Archduke of Is'Mod
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Do you have strong feelings/opinions about gun control? - 25/07/2012 05:48:56 AM 1494 Views
Kind of? - 25/07/2012 05:59:39 AM 943 Views
Agreed - 25/07/2012 06:20:44 AM 813 Views
Re: Agreed - 25/07/2012 06:29:16 AM 930 Views
A lot of people are uncomfortable about homsexuality. Let's ban that too. - 25/07/2012 09:26:46 PM 919 Views
Feisty. - 25/07/2012 09:54:31 PM 1026 Views
I'm pro-guns, but I don't think I have strong feelings about anything - 25/07/2012 07:36:31 AM 855 Views
I am mostly in agreement with you. - 26/07/2012 02:11:56 AM 728 Views
Fully automatic weapons are already forbidden, aren't they? - 27/07/2012 02:19:57 AM 850 Views
Pretty strong (as someone born, raised and living outside the US) - 25/07/2012 11:23:52 AM 944 Views
I'm okay with guns in very limited circumstances. - 25/07/2012 11:41:13 AM 986 Views
Re: I'm okay with guns in very limited circumstances. - 25/07/2012 01:21:36 PM 894 Views
Inevitable thread, but mostly I feel people enters this debate without knowing enough about guns - 25/07/2012 02:05:12 PM 1099 Views
I have to admit that I didn't read most of that, sorry. - 25/07/2012 02:47:05 PM 993 Views
Re: I have to admit that I didn't read most of that, sorry. - 25/07/2012 03:00:07 PM 870 Views
Re: - 25/07/2012 03:30:44 PM 910 Views
Okay, that makes no sense - 25/07/2012 04:32:28 PM 927 Views
Re: Re: - 25/07/2012 05:50:23 PM 958 Views
Re: I have to admit that I didn't read most of that, sorry. - 25/07/2012 10:48:46 PM 957 Views
I understand, but you probably should if time permits - 25/07/2012 03:49:49 PM 1070 Views
It is unlikely to, for a while. - 25/07/2012 10:37:30 PM 952 Views
Oh, but you have time to read Cannoli though - 26/07/2012 01:10:50 AM 890 Views
... his was shorter? - 26/07/2012 02:41:48 PM 811 Views
Yeah but mine had diagrams! - 26/07/2012 03:46:49 PM 894 Views
I do sometimes need pictures. - 26/07/2012 04:55:17 PM 750 Views
Re: I do sometimes need pictures. - 26/07/2012 04:57:57 PM 893 Views
*NM* - 26/07/2012 05:23:11 PM 426 Views
Where exactly did you get those numbers? - 27/07/2012 07:23:31 PM 904 Views
He's right as far as numbers go. - 27/07/2012 08:08:02 PM 944 Views
Wikipedia, the unchallenged source for acurate and complete citation - 27/07/2012 08:19:40 PM 978 Views
Sorry, I totally forgot about this post, hadn't noticed your replies. - 31/07/2012 07:42:43 PM 898 Views
I'm not surprised there were missing incidents - 31/07/2012 08:18:04 PM 870 Views
Re: I'm not surprised there were missing incidents - 31/07/2012 09:14:34 PM 846 Views
Re: I'm not surprised there were missing incidents - 31/07/2012 11:56:05 PM 1013 Views
Norway? Scotland? - 25/07/2012 09:31:49 PM 849 Views
You can keep this up - 25/07/2012 09:56:28 PM 837 Views
Hi, Cannoli. - 25/07/2012 10:30:56 PM 856 Views
well it could have at least double posted the edited version - 26/07/2012 10:40:32 PM 811 Views
Most of those numbers come from inner city violence - 26/07/2012 10:40:34 PM 1025 Views
Re: Hi, Cannoli. - 09/08/2012 09:07:03 PM 914 Views
The UK tightened gun laws after the Dunblane massacre. - 25/07/2012 10:58:08 PM 799 Views
I have no problem with guns, but I agree that assault weapons shouldn't be legal for ordinary people - 25/07/2012 02:56:38 PM 942 Views
The problem with banning assualt weapons is the defention is mostly cosmetic - 25/07/2012 05:29:35 PM 816 Views
Bullshit - 26/07/2012 01:52:59 PM 958 Views
I call Bullshit on your Bullshit - 26/07/2012 02:59:09 PM 874 Views
Or - 26/07/2012 03:20:12 PM 783 Views
There a lot of us with military training and some were in that theater - 26/07/2012 03:43:52 PM 794 Views
HE was talking about normal people. - 26/07/2012 04:53:16 PM 906 Views
I think we are talking past each other - 26/07/2012 05:55:48 PM 872 Views
Possibly. We do do that. - 26/07/2012 06:52:58 PM 902 Views
In addition to random thoughts's points... - 26/07/2012 03:10:56 PM 828 Views
You're partially right but mostly wrong - 26/07/2012 05:46:27 PM 884 Views
Correct me if I'm wrong.... - 25/07/2012 03:53:07 PM 1039 Views
You're wrong - 25/07/2012 04:37:22 PM 811 Views
Yes. - 25/07/2012 05:09:36 PM 815 Views
Yes and I am glad it's not my problem. - 25/07/2012 06:41:56 PM 953 Views
Dude, your burglary argument makes no sense - 25/07/2012 11:09:37 PM 846 Views
It makes lots of sense, actually. - 25/07/2012 11:55:59 PM 855 Views
They don't bring guns here. Huh. *NM* - 26/07/2012 12:59:15 AM 414 Views
they don't typically bring guns here either - 26/07/2012 02:01:14 AM 952 Views
That's how I understand it too but I'm dubious, many criminals are dumber than a bag of hammers - 26/07/2012 02:22:18 AM 805 Views
Ha! - 26/07/2012 12:07:20 PM 726 Views
One of my Marine friends became a Fort Worth cop when he got out - 26/07/2012 03:11:12 PM 918 Views
You get some wild stories - 26/07/2012 06:09:52 PM 921 Views
Like I've always said, you can't un-invent the gun - 25/07/2012 11:05:22 PM 816 Views
Agreed. It's really a lot like health care, in a way. - 26/07/2012 12:07:20 AM 924 Views
the argument of if America should have a lot guns is a long over - 26/07/2012 03:29:50 PM 785 Views
See, there's another one of those BS stats tricks, 'family members' includes suicides and murder - 26/07/2012 06:47:54 PM 813 Views
Sure, but you can legislate certain excessive firearms. - 26/07/2012 09:41:12 PM 904 Views
assault rifles are banned - 26/07/2012 10:51:28 PM 856 Views
Touchy - 28/07/2012 04:33:46 AM 1038 Views

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