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No, Ghavrel was doing that ßelals Girl Send a noteboard - 25/05/2013 12:03:09 AM

We were told by Ghavrel in the post that started this subthread that it's wrong for Christians to condemn Islam and its current issues because our own religion doesn't have a squeaky clean history. So, if he feels that Christians today aren't allowed to take the moral high ground because of actions comitted by other Christians centuries before we were even born, then yeah, we've kinda already been lumped in with them by him and it isn't strange that Jeordam is therefore operating off of that assumption when he replies to Ghavrel's subsequent posts.

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Maybe it is time to start treating muslims a little differently? Anonymous2000 - 23/05/2013 03:55:28 AM 3119 Views
Nah, you're just a bigot. *NM* Ghavrel - 23/05/2013 08:21:33 AM 1042 Views
Yes, I am against religions that call for violence. *NM* Anonymous2000 - 23/05/2013 12:23:31 PM 959 Views
Wasn't aware you were against Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Zoroastrianism, Shinto... *NM* Ghavrel - 23/05/2013 12:59:04 PM 1005 Views
Where does Christianity call for violence? Jeordam - 23/05/2013 03:55:11 PM 1609 Views
Dueteronomy 13: 1-5 states that you must kill prophets of other religions. Hieshyn - 23/05/2013 07:44:48 PM 1723 Views
The Old Testament is not Christianity. It is where Christianity CAME from. *NM* HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 09:25:12 PM 964 Views
FALSE! Dannymac - 24/05/2013 01:41:50 PM 1743 Views
*sigh* And in fulfilling the "law" he created a new covenant which supplanted the old.. HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 06:09:43 PM 1695 Views
All the death of Christ did was attone for the sins of the world. Hieshyn - 26/05/2013 03:00:26 AM 1932 Views
Sorry, you are wrong. HyogaRott - 28/05/2013 04:17:51 PM 1712 Views
...I can think of a rather larger difference. Starts with J and ends with S. *NM* Ghavrel - 28/05/2013 11:54:28 PM 1044 Views
Yeah, but not really, both religions acknowledge his existence, but differ on his role. HyogaRott - 29/05/2013 06:00:03 PM 1715 Views
Net result: All of God's children can enter into Heaven. Hieshyn - 30/05/2013 05:26:20 PM 1934 Views
No. The New Covenant SUPPLEMENTS, not supplants, the Old. Joel - 12/08/2013 02:45:55 AM 2002 Views
Ok....and? Jeordam - 23/05/2013 10:36:55 PM 1583 Views
You asked for an example, I gave one. I'm not here to argue with you. *NM* Hieshyn - 26/05/2013 02:57:27 AM 972 Views
You might want to slap some qualifiers on there *NM* Isaac - 23/05/2013 07:50:43 PM 987 Views
Actually, I very intentionally didn't put any qualifiers on that... Jeordam - 23/05/2013 10:38:24 PM 1648 Views
The Cleansing of the Temple shows a legitimized use of physical force. *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 05:05:55 AM 1028 Views
Oh, boo hoo.... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 03:50:18 PM 1685 Views
LOL. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 04:45:50 PM 1631 Views
Violence.... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 05:32:47 PM 1666 Views
Whipping people to drive them away of something is violence. It's not negotiable. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 06:06:42 PM 1507 Views
You are something... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 06:29:03 PM 1595 Views
We've gone from "Where does Christianity call for violence?" to "not all violence is bad." *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 09:09:30 PM 1034 Views
To be fair, that is a good journey to make. Joel - 12/08/2013 02:51:17 AM 1612 Views
Also, spanking has been pretty soundly debunked as good parenting. Maybe not a good analogy. *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 06:16:18 PM 993 Views
Because children are more behaved now.... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 06:21:43 PM 1548 Views
I don't favor spanking but the studies 'debunking it' are mostly 'bunk' Isaac - 24/05/2013 10:29:28 PM 1641 Views
Yes. nossy - 24/05/2013 10:42:51 PM 1553 Views
Re: Yes. Isaac - 25/05/2013 12:22:56 AM 1642 Views
Congratulations; you now understand why (or one reason) my posts tend to run long. Joel - 12/08/2013 02:53:24 AM 1833 Views
You know better than that. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 06:52:32 AM 1624 Views
I think you just claimed that my statement as to my opinion is anecdotal evidence of that opinion Isaac - 25/05/2013 09:26:21 AM 1714 Views
I was talking about your reference to your upbringing as relevant to the statistical trend. *NM* Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 09:49:19 AM 932 Views
Yes, but I wasn't claiming it was relevant in that way Isaac - 25/05/2013 10:15:52 AM 1578 Views
... ? *NM* Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 12:58:43 PM 1022 Views
I couldn't remember the code for *NM* Isaac - 25/05/2013 07:57:48 PM 928 Views
I wouldn't belong to any other kind of religion. Cannoli - 25/05/2013 01:21:45 AM 1609 Views
And the night was finished with a mob of white men attacking the police in the name of bigotry snoopcester - 23/05/2013 09:51:02 AM 1506 Views
In the name of a religion that preaches violence? Anonymous2000 - 23/05/2013 12:21:59 PM 1664 Views
Islam "preaches" violence just about as much as Christianity does. Nebhead - 23/05/2013 12:46:00 PM 1651 Views
it's actually pretty funny because many people understand Islam to, derivatively, mean peace Fox and Ravens - 23/05/2013 01:44:18 PM 1638 Views
Your argument is logically flawed Tom - 23/05/2013 02:02:33 PM 1714 Views
Re: Your argument is logically flawed Fox and Ravens - 23/05/2013 02:34:22 PM 1734 Views
No, it actaully does not. HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 01:51:51 PM 1693 Views
Maybe they will be, I don't know, KILLED for standing up Nighthawk - 23/05/2013 02:24:59 PM 1517 Views
Exactly HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 03:52:25 PM 1661 Views
Couple of things nossy - 23/05/2013 08:13:57 PM 1965 Views
Unfortunately they are NOT consistant in their messaging... see my link HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 09:30:53 PM 1812 Views
Well, "consistent" doesn't mean "never says things HyogaRott doesn't support." nossy - 23/05/2013 09:46:51 PM 1579 Views
There is a difference between putting forth a good PR spin occasionally and making a stand. HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 01:55:48 AM 1609 Views
Really? Of all the criticisms you could make of Qaradawi, you whine about that? Legolas - 23/05/2013 09:58:50 PM 1636 Views
I think the key point there is that the MCB supported him for a visa in spite of that... Isaac - 23/05/2013 11:05:14 PM 1647 Views
So much for my attempt to bring a little levity to things. Legolas - 24/05/2013 08:07:24 PM 1665 Views
My ability to detect humor and sarcasm in writing is very sporadic Isaac - 24/05/2013 10:28:03 PM 1525 Views
That's a shame. Legolas - 24/05/2013 11:55:37 PM 1481 Views
Re: That's a shame. Isaac - 25/05/2013 02:25:31 AM 1513 Views
Re: That's a shame. Legolas - 25/05/2013 12:17:13 PM 1469 Views
Sure, I'll bite. Legolas - 23/05/2013 09:23:54 PM 1682 Views
Until the "unwashed masses" no longer show up dancing in the streets... HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 09:40:59 PM 1574 Views
I hope you like black and white. nossy - 23/05/2013 09:50:03 PM 1475 Views
Not sure which point you think I missed that I should have responded to... HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 01:52:20 AM 1600 Views
I think I must have confused you. nossy - 24/05/2013 08:46:42 PM 1471 Views
I suppose that depends on which "points" precisely you thought you were making. Legolas - 23/05/2013 09:54:55 PM 1548 Views
Not really HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 02:36:41 AM 1576 Views
Yawn. Bored now. Legolas - 24/05/2013 08:18:27 PM 1507 Views
whatever *NM* HyogaRott - 28/05/2013 04:18:56 PM 872 Views
Do "unwashed masses" publicly APOLOGIZING for terrorism count? Joel - 12/08/2013 03:04:56 AM 1812 Views
Re: No, it actaully does not. Stephen - 24/05/2013 02:29:04 AM 1681 Views
Now let's not start with bullshit here Tom - 23/05/2013 01:54:48 PM 1916 Views
Tom, this is a rare occurance when we agree. HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 03:59:49 PM 1500 Views
That may be so, but the response was addressed to Ben. Tom - 23/05/2013 04:13:47 PM 1609 Views
Oops, my bad messed up reading the discussion tree... HyogaRott - 23/05/2013 06:15:34 PM 1553 Views
Excellent post - anyone that thinks all religions are the same is a complete moron. Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:32:26 AM 1742 Views
I don't approve of a great deal of popular Islamic thought. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 05:13:51 AM 1766 Views
My thoughts exactly. *NM* ironclad - 24/05/2013 09:13:18 AM 894 Views
I agree. *NM* Stephen - 24/05/2013 12:05:46 PM 978 Views
Do you think that it will truly happen? Jeordam - 24/05/2013 05:47:50 PM 1680 Views
Might have something to do with colonialists ruining everything they can get their hands on. Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 06:09:13 PM 1616 Views
The first step on the road to recovery is aknowledging your responsibility for where you are and do HyogaRott - 24/05/2013 06:22:42 PM 1568 Views
Oh, so its our fault... Jeordam - 24/05/2013 06:38:14 PM 1551 Views
It's always our fault *NM* ßelals Girl - 24/05/2013 07:40:24 PM 1078 Views
In general, I agree nossy - 24/05/2013 09:01:53 PM 1707 Views
That word "our" is interesting, don't you think? Legolas - 24/05/2013 09:09:24 PM 1584 Views
That was beautiful. *NM* Ghavrel - 24/05/2013 09:12:09 PM 995 Views
No, Ghavrel was doing that ßelals Girl - 25/05/2013 12:03:09 AM 1654 Views
I'm sure we all do it, that's kind of the point. Legolas - 25/05/2013 12:26:25 AM 1533 Views
but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. ßelals Girl - 25/05/2013 02:20:21 AM 1686 Views
Exactly. Tom - 25/05/2013 06:26:57 AM 1627 Views
Hyperbole? nossy - 25/05/2013 09:57:56 PM 1471 Views
Has anyone ever told you that? Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:33:32 PM 1761 Views
No, I really don't think so. Legolas - 25/05/2013 11:18:05 AM 1540 Views
*bashes face against keyboard in frustration* ßelals Girl - 25/05/2013 09:28:58 PM 1479 Views
Perhaps I should bow out and let Ghavrel speak for himself, then. Legolas - 25/05/2013 09:53:28 PM 1662 Views
It's accurate. *NM* Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:25:04 PM 960 Views
Re: but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. nossy - 25/05/2013 09:49:48 PM 1562 Views
Re: but apparently it's only okay for some groups/people and not others. ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 12:48:45 AM 1674 Views
Hm nossy - 26/05/2013 10:10:49 AM 1625 Views
Also, yeah. Historically oppressive groups aren't equal to historically oppressed groups. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:31:58 PM 1635 Views
Too simplistic AND a blatant justification for double standards I thought you didn't have ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 01:02:07 AM 1582 Views
That's not racism. Racism requires systematic oppression. *NM* Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 01:14:08 AM 945 Views
No ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 01:57:11 AM 1635 Views
Where whitey firmly belongs, in no small part because of posts like that. Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 02:00:59 AM 1590 Views
Lulz, you're claiming every member of a group deserves something because of what I said? ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 02:11:36 AM 1577 Views
And now you know how Muslims feel. *NM* Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 03:48:33 AM 991 Views
I already knew ßelals Girl - 26/05/2013 04:02:02 AM 1527 Views
Just about every group has historically oppressed and BEEN oppressed at some time. Joel - 12/08/2013 04:00:54 AM 1656 Views
No. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:28:24 PM 1545 Views
Oh, I don't think he's talking about past "colonialism" only. Tom - 25/05/2013 06:18:11 AM 1588 Views
Possibly. Some people do, to be sure, and there is some truth in that view. Legolas - 25/05/2013 11:27:36 AM 1463 Views
What a load of bullshit. Tom - 25/05/2013 06:14:02 AM 1560 Views
I don't think you can reasonably claim to separate Salafi thought from the geopolitics of the time. Ghavrel - 25/05/2013 10:23:03 PM 1584 Views
This is why I want to get the HELL out of there. Joel - 12/08/2013 04:16:39 AM 1693 Views
The difference with Islam is they lost the empire game but they were conquers random thoughts - 27/05/2013 12:42:05 AM 1687 Views
I'm gonna have to disagree with some of that. Legolas - 27/05/2013 07:06:53 PM 1535 Views
Yes it was very complex and the Crusaders were not saints (even the sainted ones) random thoughts - 29/05/2013 04:15:57 AM 1639 Views
Fair enough on all counts, then. *NM* Legolas - 29/05/2013 07:37:34 PM 924 Views
No, it had a bunch of opportunistic brown folks systematically dismantling it for centuries. Joel - 12/08/2013 03:43:00 AM 1600 Views
Some of my ancestors lived and caved and bashed each over the heads with rocks random thoughts - 26/05/2013 04:38:56 PM 1584 Views
Well yes. nossy - 26/05/2013 05:08:08 PM 1518 Views
I would prefer to say that random thoughts - 27/05/2013 01:26:57 AM 1722 Views
Of course you would. nossy - 27/05/2013 10:19:46 AM 1642 Views
I in no way support profiling people based on race or religion random thoughts - 29/05/2013 04:11:01 AM 1738 Views
Ok. nossy - 29/05/2013 08:54:34 PM 1730 Views
I think about the evolution of Western religion a lot. Joel - 12/08/2013 03:23:37 AM 1969 Views
There has been 14,000+ terrorist actions in the name of Islam since 9/11. Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:30:30 AM 1792 Views
That isn't a grown up answer. snoopcester - 23/05/2013 04:35:16 PM 1648 Views
Re: In the name of a religion that preaches violence? ßelals Girl - 23/05/2013 07:28:42 PM 1610 Views
His head will only be chopped off is he draws or insults Muhammad! *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:34:21 AM 980 Views
What does he have to do to get on TV? *NM* ßelals Girl - 24/05/2013 07:45:53 PM 912 Views
Statistically snoopcester - 24/05/2013 10:22:29 AM 1683 Views
What kind of horrifying bugs to you guys HAVE over there??? ßelals Girl - 24/05/2013 02:13:23 PM 1685 Views
Hardly any snoopcester - 24/05/2013 02:16:46 PM 1799 Views
Your solution is profiling...because it's time to *stop* thinking all folks are the same? *NM* Sareitha Sedai - 23/05/2013 02:36:32 PM 888 Views
I don't think we've ever encouraged people to think all folks are the same Isaac - 23/05/2013 07:29:54 PM 1523 Views
"Perhaps it's time to stop thinking all folks are the same?" ~A2k Sareitha Sedai - 23/05/2013 07:49:12 PM 1504 Views
I think he's pointing to the encuragement of willful blindedness with that remark Isaac - 23/05/2013 08:15:55 PM 1551 Views
I think probably not. nossy - 23/05/2013 07:57:53 PM 1588 Views
See Tom's post above for the facts..... *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 03:36:18 AM 908 Views
That your original post was absurd? Thank you, but I got that on my own. *NM* nossy - 24/05/2013 09:09:21 PM 896 Views
It shows what a silly little fool you are, but that's your choice. *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 09:19:04 PM 900 Views
Hey man, you're the one who told me Tom's post had the facts. nossy - 24/05/2013 09:20:53 PM 1517 Views
It means exactly what I said. He did a great job! *NM* Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 09:23:44 PM 934 Views
Yes, he did. nossy - 24/05/2013 09:30:42 PM 1529 Views
Also, don't tell him I said I take him seriously. *NM* nossy - 24/05/2013 09:34:59 PM 971 Views
But wouldn't religion-based profile activities... Jeordam - 23/05/2013 10:54:33 PM 1491 Views
My brain is slow right now, but I think I completely agree. nossy - 23/05/2013 11:00:31 PM 1606 Views
You mean like this? Larry - 24/05/2013 08:15:16 PM 1710 Views
Sorry bu the comparison isn't valid random thoughts - 25/05/2013 09:50:34 PM 1531 Views
+1 - Larry is an honest guy and will realize his error. *NM* Anonymous2000 - 25/05/2013 10:53:14 PM 921 Views
Numbers alone do not change the validity of such Larry - 25/05/2013 11:15:17 PM 1588 Views
Yes it does. Anonymous2000 - 26/05/2013 12:23:27 AM 1596 Views
*sigh* Larry - 26/05/2013 12:46:49 AM 1459 Views
I think asking most Americans for recognition of a non-binary political paradigm is a bit much. *NM* Ghavrel - 26/05/2013 01:16:30 AM 939 Views
no liberalisn is sane and well thought in comparison random thoughts - 26/05/2013 04:04:39 PM 1506 Views
no but they do tell a story random thoughts - 26/05/2013 04:27:26 PM 1411 Views
UPDATE - Cleric/Teacher of one of the murderers praises him for "courage". Anonymous2000 - 24/05/2013 09:22:24 PM 1625 Views
Do you have a functional link? *NM* Stephen - 25/05/2013 12:19:01 AM 945 Views
The link works for me (Yahoo news) - here is the text. Anonymous2000 - 25/05/2013 02:05:41 AM 1803 Views
Re: Maybe it is time to start treating muslims a little differently? dart_board - 27/05/2013 02:28:31 PM 2328 Views
Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. nossy - 27/05/2013 03:22:41 PM 1661 Views
Just as a little aside Tom - 28/05/2013 12:51:48 AM 1524 Views
Ever helpful. nossy - 28/05/2013 10:23:12 PM 1729 Views
Re: Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. dart_board - 28/05/2013 04:56:55 PM 2308 Views
Re: Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. nossy - 28/05/2013 10:18:40 PM 1692 Views
Re: Please have a look at the attached list and tell me who "they" are, exactly. dart_board - 29/05/2013 08:57:17 PM 2271 Views
I'm having warm feelings. nossy - 29/05/2013 09:38:45 PM 1675 Views
Re: I'm having warm feelings. dart_board - 30/05/2013 12:46:57 AM 2086 Views
"Who else? Major League Baseball. " Joel - 12/08/2013 04:34:48 AM 1901 Views
I can't believe I missed this thread. *NM* Dan - 01/06/2013 10:08:08 AM 1252 Views
How much did you miss it, really? Joel - 12/08/2013 04:38:21 AM 1617 Views
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