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Military struggles involve militaries. Joel Send a noteboard - 20/11/2009 03:23:14 PM
Note the plural. ;)
This is a military struggle, between a nation and her allies and an army of religious extremists whose tactics include terrorism. alQaeda is an army, not a terrorist group. Unfortunately, they've been mislabeled.

This war is basically being fought because alQaeda and the other groups who adhere to the form of weaponized Islam that bin Laden & Co are peddling feel they have a religious and moral obligation to fight the U.S. for several reasons. They aren't killing cause they like to, they aren't killing because they're insane, they're killing because of issues such as (off the top of my head) U.S. troops in Saudi Arabia, U.S. support for secular (and oppressive) regimes in Arab countries, U.S. support for Israel, and U.S. economic sanctions on Iraq in the 90's. It isn't organized crime, it's a war, and this trial proves that the people in charge of leading America during this war are definitely not in the right frame of mind.

If it were war, there'd be a state to invade and occupy. Ther'd be an indigenous populace to neutralize and pacify. There'd be battles between opposing armies, not one army hunting for random snipers while trying to avoid homemade bombs. Perhaps the biggest proof it's not a war is that if it were, when a belligerent act was committed against Americans by foreign SOLDIERS, they could be killed on the battlefield in self defense, captured and held as POWs or captured and tried for war crimes. Bush was clear from the beginning they aren't POWs, but "enemy combatants" (a phrase whose meaning his administration drastically altered from its already murky one. ) Too bad, really; as soldiers they would've been subject to military tribunals, but the administration wanted a free hand to do with them as they pleased, and thought that would give it to them. The prospect of the White House doing whatever they want to whoever they want on no evidence or even charge is yet another reason for me to insist on due process as firmly as Jefferson and Adams. If they wanted tribunals they should've asked for a declaration of war (and, to be fair, the Democratic Senate never should've authorized The War That Is Not a War, but there was an election in six months so, cowards they are, they did. )

No, Al Qaeda doesn't represent a nation, a region, a populace or even most of even one sect of one religion. It's a bunch of brainwashed murderers led by a wealthy murderer or two who's biggest problem with the Western presence in the Mid-East is we keep getting in their way (though they certainly don't mind us enriching them. ) The particular issues you cite, with which I'm quite familiar, aren't their MOTIVES, but their PRETEXT. Saudi Arabia isn't a secular state, but they're definitely one outside of bin Ladens control, and yes, it pisses him off a lot, and it's symptomatic: Pretty much every country bin Laden would like to dominate from behind the scenes as he did Afghanistan is either 1) an aggressively hostile Shiite state or 2) an American fiefdom. That doesn't elevate him to the democratically elected leader of ANY state. He's a lot closer to Capone than Castro; the latter wanted to rule Chicago like a king and for a while he did, but no one in the US government ever dignified that by acknowledging his legitimacy.

It's simply not a war. Not in name or in fact; we went far out of our way to avoid calling it a war even though that would've DRAMATICALLY expanded the Presidents authority and curtailed much of Congress'. Representing an ideology, even if you're joined in that by a relatively large number of people, does not, in itself, make you a soldier, nor your cause a war. Not in Waco, and not in Pakistan.

I can only refer once again to the Father of American Conservatism in the hopes that the tendency to repudiate all things liberal and embrace all things conservative might do some good for once:

"We find in the rules laid down by the greatest English judges... [that] we are to look upon it as more beneficial that many guilty persons should escape unpunished than one innocent person should suffer. The reason is because it is of more importance to [the] community that innocence should be protected than it is that guilt should be punished, for guilt and crimes are so frequent in the world that all of them cannot be punished, and many times they happen in such a manner that it is not of much consequence to the public whether they are punished or not. But when innocence itself is brought to the bar and condemned, especially to die, the subject will exclaim, 'It is immaterial to me whether I behave well or ill, for virtue itself is no security.' And if such sentiment as this should take place in the mind of the subject there would be an end to all security whatsoever. " --John Adams, defending the British soldiers accused in the Boston Massacre

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No need to interrogate Osama bin Laden? - 20/11/2009 12:48:27 AM 997 Views
oO uhm, what? - 20/11/2009 12:54:13 AM 482 Views
Yeah, a lot of people were fuzzy on that till this started. - 20/11/2009 09:30:39 AM 509 Views
on the other hand, we're more than willing to take them out back with a confession. - 20/11/2009 06:34:12 PM 506 Views
As it seems we will. - 24/11/2009 09:41:18 AM 485 Views
New York is now asking for $75 MILLION for the KSM trial - 20/11/2009 01:43:26 AM 437 Views
Its to salve their conscinse - 20/11/2009 01:55:08 AM 439 Views
That's exactly the problem! - 20/11/2009 01:58:37 AM 464 Views
If this trial were being held in any other country - 20/11/2009 01:56:07 AM 465 Views
It's a terrible precedent no matter how you look at it. - 20/11/2009 02:13:46 AM 492 Views
It IS a terrible precdent, hence you and others are citing it 65 years after WWII ended. - 20/11/2009 09:23:45 AM 379 Views
Spare me the bullshit. - 20/11/2009 01:57:16 PM 375 Views
I will if you will. - 20/11/2009 02:55:30 PM 464 Views
No, you won't. You never will. - 20/11/2009 06:14:30 PM 361 Views
You're putting your cart before your horse is the problem. - 23/11/2009 05:40:46 AM 461 Views
No, that's not right. You don't read very closely. - 23/11/2009 02:21:54 PM 375 Views
In this case my reading comprehension is more than adequate. - 24/11/2009 09:16:39 AM 421 Views
You don't think this is a military struggle? Wow. - 20/11/2009 02:52:26 PM 417 Views
Allow me to point out... - 20/11/2009 03:02:33 PM 398 Views
Well, Timothy McVeigh was in OUR Army. - 20/11/2009 03:55:18 PM 515 Views
That's the thing, they aren't a terrorist group - 20/11/2009 04:54:31 PM 440 Views
It would help if you would offer any argument in favour of your stance. - 20/11/2009 08:43:08 PM 385 Views
I only use the word army cause I can't think of a better one - 21/11/2009 04:32:01 AM 398 Views
Yes. "Terrorist group". - 21/11/2009 12:02:04 PM 475 Views
Yeah I guess you're right - 22/11/2009 01:34:34 AM 386 Views
Military struggles involve militaries. - 20/11/2009 03:23:14 PM 551 Views
Once again, bullshit. - 20/11/2009 06:09:31 PM 521 Views
Aaaah, I see; it's a question of who's the master, is it? - 23/11/2009 07:47:43 AM 527 Views
You're wasting your time - 23/11/2009 02:24:57 PM 423 Views
This is wrong - 20/11/2009 07:41:35 PM 421 Views
We're a long way from the shore of Tripoli. - 23/11/2009 05:59:19 AM 469 Views
Nevertheless, uniforms or a nation is not a requirement - 23/11/2009 03:09:22 PM 431 Views
Rightly or wrongly, I disagree. - 24/11/2009 08:48:25 AM 477 Views
That is bad - 21/11/2009 12:31:04 AM 410 Views
You're not going far enough, man. - 20/11/2009 11:03:08 AM 457 Views
Blah blah blah blah blah *NM* - 20/11/2009 01:57:39 PM 193 Views
I just can't imagine how they expect to get a fair trial. - 20/11/2009 03:17:28 AM 383 Views
The Code of Conduct - 20/11/2009 07:23:02 PM 487 Views
The mention of God is interesting. *NM* - 21/11/2009 05:24:14 AM 306 Views
Your little diatribe in the beginning only makes me glad... - 22/11/2009 05:32:57 AM 542 Views
I understand your "jihadist narrative" - 22/11/2009 06:36:41 PM 527 Views
enemy combatants and terrorists - 23/11/2009 08:03:25 PM 497 Views
They're not different because from the Third World, but because terrorists. - 24/11/2009 08:09:13 AM 618 Views
not every soldier in history has worn a uniform - 24/11/2009 11:00:34 PM 293 Views
One example would be Ethan Allen and his Green Mountain Boys - 25/11/2009 06:23:08 PM 469 Views
Just for fun, let's call them fundamentalist vigilantes. *NM* - 24/11/2009 11:12:09 PM 167 Views
Works for me. - 01/12/2009 09:12:29 AM 448 Views

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