Active Users:834 Time:16/09/2025 02:59:28 PM
At this point we're just arguing about perspective, seems to me. Legolas Send a noteboard - 28/05/2017 07:11:55 PM

View original postThe fact that these people speak Arabic in various dialects with varying degrees of mutual intelligibility does not make them a single entity. No unifying consciousness binds them together - not language, not national borders, not shared history and not even religion. They don't feel a connection to one another. The phrase "Arab world" is a complete misnomer. Syrian Alawis feel a stronger connection to "non-Arab" (i.e., people who don't speak Arabic, because Syrians aren't Arabs) Persians, while Syrian Sunnis seem to have an affinity for "non-Arab" Turks.

It's evident that the many Arabic-speaking countries don't constitute a single political entity, haven't done so since a very long time ago, and very likely never will again. Pan-Arabism still exists but as a marginal phenomenon without real influence.

But it's equally evident that there are still linguistic and cultural ties binding them together, since after all their written language remains the same, even if that's a bit artificial and ideologically motivated. They still have a largely shared literature, movie industry, popular music and I might add a remarkable fondness for Eurovision-like TV contests between the different Arab countries in music and poetry. And then there are also some limited political and economic cooperation agreements, such as the Arab League and the GAFTA (Greater Arab Free Trade Area).

None of those things makes them a single nation, or even a closely allied group of nations like the European Union (the Arab League, I think we all agree, is utterly useless); but they do make them a clearly distinct group of nations of the kind that is sometimes described as a 'world', such as 'English-speaking world' or the like. And yes, the majorities in these countries who speak Arabic would describe themselves as 'Arabs' as well as 'Syrians', 'Egyptians' etc., why shouldn't they? Are you seriously claiming that people whose families have spoken Arabic and participated in Arabic culture for centuries shouldn't call themselves Arabs, just because of genetics?


View original postThe language of all these peoples is called Arabic, but we know that even there it isn't unified. Their cultures are a mix of indigenous ideas particular to their regions, culture from previous Arabic and non-Arabic empires and modern developments. It's like trying to say that "Europe" is a cultural monolith because of Christianity.

If you stopped trying to make everything so black and white, you'd realize nobody in this thread is calling the Arab world a 'cultural monolith'. There are things they have in common and things that they don't.
Reply to message
Terrible thing in Manchester last night. - 23/05/2017 03:34:11 PM 1099 Views
Pogroms - 23/05/2017 04:29:06 PM 523 Views
You can't stop psychos from doing psychopathic things. - 23/05/2017 05:40:15 PM 489 Views
I'm not sure i understand. - 23/05/2017 05:54:33 PM 512 Views
That's a quite obtuse answer - 23/05/2017 08:34:20 PM 516 Views
Hiding? - 23/05/2017 08:58:11 PM 562 Views
What do you mean, exactly, by "stop making ourselves targets" then? - 23/05/2017 09:47:43 PM 491 Views
First off, we agree completely on one thing - 23/05/2017 10:51:22 PM 534 Views
What hasn't been consistent about our foreign policy in that region? - 23/05/2017 11:13:57 PM 570 Views
I thought it was obvious that I didn't mean consistently shit. - 23/05/2017 11:36:58 PM 543 Views
It's always about us, then, isn't it? - 24/05/2017 02:34:52 AM 518 Views
For me, it is. - 24/05/2017 07:49:03 AM 511 Views
Don't forget getting an education if you are female *NM* - 23/05/2017 09:38:26 PM 284 Views
They might have a point with that one. I haven't seen much value from it. - 23/05/2017 09:53:19 PM 464 Views
You are going to get rocks thrown at you *NM* - 23/05/2017 10:29:45 PM 253 Views
There aren't many left who would bother. *NM* - 23/05/2017 10:52:14 PM 276 Views
Me and the jihadis - victory by sticking around! *NM* - 24/05/2017 11:11:35 AM 271 Views
Picking a concert that would be mostly teenage girls makes it extra disgusting *NM* - 23/05/2017 09:37:25 PM 269 Views
Not really. It's a logical extension of the whole rationale. - 23/05/2017 09:50:30 PM 553 Views
He said 'extra disgusting'. Not 'less logical'. *NM* - 23/05/2017 10:29:21 PM 288 Views
I am not sure logic applies to the issue. - 23/05/2017 10:41:32 PM 453 Views
I can see that - 24/05/2017 11:47:59 AM 518 Views
It makes me wonder about the attacker - 23/05/2017 11:00:40 PM 514 Views
I wonder about what these people sea in a good who wants this kind of thing - 24/05/2017 05:58:25 PM 498 Views
It really does. That shit makes the blood boil. *NM* - 24/05/2017 05:23:33 PM 296 Views
Isis Shmisis. Daesh is just the end result of the radicalization of many Muslims. - 23/05/2017 11:58:42 PM 488 Views
Blaming the Ottomans, while largely correct, is less satisfying to them. - 24/05/2017 03:21:14 AM 517 Views
There's lots of nationalist feeling, surely. - 24/05/2017 06:48:59 PM 515 Views
Your errors are legion here. - 24/05/2017 10:03:53 PM 499 Views
Really? I see precisely one point which, according to you, is a factual error. - 26/05/2017 11:41:00 PM 537 Views
You're not looking very hard, then - 27/05/2017 03:23:36 PM 575 Views
At this point we're just arguing about perspective, seems to me. - 28/05/2017 07:11:55 PM 650 Views
No, I think that you're missing the point - 28/05/2017 09:49:34 PM 413 Views
Alright, I did miss that point. - 29/05/2017 07:33:36 PM 467 Views
You can't do anything - 24/05/2017 05:00:31 PM 472 Views
Be honest. We both know I am a major hardass and you like it. *NM* - 24/05/2017 05:19:21 PM 250 Views
Oh I do - 25/05/2017 10:27:08 AM 585 Views
My opinion? We (USA) should either bomb ISIS into oblivion or back off and let them kill each other *NM* - 24/05/2017 05:38:37 PM 306 Views
When I see those girl's faces and think about how easily it could be my 11 year old daughter - 24/05/2017 05:53:01 PM 509 Views
I would prefer to annihilate them, if possible, without boots on the ground. - 24/05/2017 06:03:49 PM 471 Views
I admit my reaction is as much emotional as rational but boots may be needed - 24/05/2017 06:37:51 PM 559 Views
Are you serious? - 28/05/2017 09:56:07 PM 420 Views
There is no tool for not allowing citizens back in the country - 29/05/2017 10:11:42 PM 449 Views
Re: There is no tool for not allowing citizens back in the country *NM* - 29/05/2017 10:11:52 PM 277 Views
Wow, talk about mission creep hitting after just one (incoherent) message - 30/05/2017 03:07:46 PM 679 Views
Speak for yourself. - 30/05/2017 06:57:16 PM 503 Views
You have thus argued for the death of education. - 31/05/2017 02:51:11 PM 499 Views
No, I've argued for substance over form. - 31/05/2017 07:07:28 PM 570 Views
Well, fuck you too then - 02/06/2017 01:43:47 AM 671 Views
Tom, he's dyslexic. Stop being a dick. - 02/06/2017 09:37:27 AM 454 Views
I'm such a n00b *NM* - 24/05/2017 06:03:50 PM 262 Views

Reply to Message