Not even Ishamael could shield another male Forsaken and an Aes Sedai at the same time...
Shannow Send a noteboard - 21/09/2010 06:46:42 PM
Nice end to Lan's part. Will update soon!
Well, it feels really nice to be right. Partially, at least!
The fact that Graendal had a PoV, and escaped Rand's huge Balefire attack with just a broken ankle to show, was definitely the highlight of this Prologue!
For once, I was actually scared of one of the Foresaken. This woman knows her job, alright! If only she had had a more major role before! Or maybe not, as a surprise big-wig, she's excellent!
So it turns out Rand did surprise her, though she figured out Nynaeve waskind of behind it almost at once. Then, true to character, she played it safe, in an impressive manner. If only Rahvin, Sammael and Be'lal had had this much sense, they'd have beaten Rand long ago! I do wish they'd had her come up with a good reason for using Delana though. That part was a little weak.
And Graendal now wants Nynaeve dead. It seems we'll see an epic fight between Nynaeve and a Foresaken after all!
Perrin's part was actually interesting to me. I'm unsurprised there's some distance between him and Faile. His story looks set to move in interesting directions.
Lan and Galad were nice, though Lan's part was too short, for my liking. I'd like to have had a longer PoV featuring him.
The final scene in the Blightborder was awesome. The dismal landscape and the hopeless bravery... this is the kind of stuff that screams the LB is approaching.
On the whole, a very nice prologue, and I'm very very glad Graendal is alive and seeking revenge. She is the First Foresaken who seems aware of Nynaeve and Egwene. She now has personal cause not only against Rand but Nyn as well. She also seems to plan to kill Min. Can it be that Graendal is part of Rand's entourage now? I doubt she remained behind in Arad Doman.
It is also interesting that she has the use of the TP again. And she can shield Delana and Aran'gar, wrap them in Air, and weave a Gateway all at once. Another little proof that I was right about how strong the strongest women are.
Well, it feels really nice to be right. Partially, at least!
The fact that Graendal had a PoV, and escaped Rand's huge Balefire attack with just a broken ankle to show, was definitely the highlight of this Prologue!
For once, I was actually scared of one of the Foresaken. This woman knows her job, alright! If only she had had a more major role before! Or maybe not, as a surprise big-wig, she's excellent!
So it turns out Rand did surprise her, though she figured out Nynaeve waskind of behind it almost at once. Then, true to character, she played it safe, in an impressive manner. If only Rahvin, Sammael and Be'lal had had this much sense, they'd have beaten Rand long ago! I do wish they'd had her come up with a good reason for using Delana though. That part was a little weak.
And Graendal now wants Nynaeve dead. It seems we'll see an epic fight between Nynaeve and a Foresaken after all!
Perrin's part was actually interesting to me. I'm unsurprised there's some distance between him and Faile. His story looks set to move in interesting directions.
Lan and Galad were nice, though Lan's part was too short, for my liking. I'd like to have had a longer PoV featuring him.
The final scene in the Blightborder was awesome. The dismal landscape and the hopeless bravery... this is the kind of stuff that screams the LB is approaching.
On the whole, a very nice prologue, and I'm very very glad Graendal is alive and seeking revenge. She is the First Foresaken who seems aware of Nynaeve and Egwene. She now has personal cause not only against Rand but Nyn as well. She also seems to plan to kill Min. Can it be that Graendal is part of Rand's entourage now? I doubt she remained behind in Arad Doman.
It is also interesting that she has the use of the TP again. And she can shield Delana and Aran'gar, wrap them in Air, and weave a Gateway all at once. Another little proof that I was right about how strong the strongest women are.
Firstly, let me say that I am not able to access the Prologue as I'm not based in the US.
However, based on what I've read, Graendal apparently shielded Arangar and Delana simultaneously (possibly without using her angreal) wrapped them in Air and wove a Gateway.
Now, it is doubtful that even Ishamael or Rand could do that to a Forsaken strength male and an average Aes Sedai at the same time, while spinning gateways and bonds of Air as well.
Graendal's angreal may explain it - if it doubles her strength, but you'd think that if she can do that to a Forsaken male plus an Aes Sedai, then Verin's little circle really shouldn't have presented her with any trouble.
Sometimes I just feel that Sanderson doesn't grasp the nuances of One Power mechanics that have been carefully constructed over the course of 15 years and 10 books prior to his entry into the series.
Towers of Midnight : Prologue discussion
- 21/09/2010 04:38:40 AM
9230 Views
Me Too! Guess who is alive!!
- 21/09/2010 04:44:40 AM
2632 Views
A dove, that's weird
- 21/09/2010 03:19:10 PM
2408 Views
Re: A dove, that's weird
- 21/09/2010 03:26:39 PM
2351 Views
What Ryan said. And we only assumed that they can only use those animals *NM*
- 21/09/2010 06:53:05 PM
1353 Views
You all can go to heck (and find me a link!) *NM*
- 21/09/2010 05:10:47 AM
1458 Views
Re: You all can go to heck (and find me a link!)
- 21/09/2010 05:14:26 AM
2530 Views
Anyone find the audiobook version? *NM*
- 21/09/2010 10:20:22 AM
1314 Views
If you're in the US, Audible.com. No clue about availability in the UK. *NM*
- 21/09/2010 06:29:45 PM
1341 Views
Could somebody post a link to where they got it? I want to go to a site where I can download now *NM*
- 21/09/2010 05:39:13 AM
1351 Views
Regarding Graendal
- 21/09/2010 10:12:42 AM
2715 Views
a very weak angreal
- 21/09/2010 04:55:15 PM
2238 Views
Graendal watched Aran'gar get nuked. Aran'gar is gone gone gone.
- 21/09/2010 10:11:41 PM
2198 Views
The laughter in Perrin's Dream
- 21/09/2010 02:24:14 PM
2303 Views
Not even Ishamael could shield another male Forsaken and an Aes Sedai at the same time...
- 21/09/2010 06:46:42 PM
2360 Views
It's different (I think?) but I'm certainly no expert and I'm sure someone else will reply
- 21/09/2010 06:57:18 PM
2235 Views
OK, I haven't read the scene, so I don't know if Arangar was holding saidin at the time or not
- 21/09/2010 07:00:23 PM
2052 Views
Re: OK, I haven't read the scene, so I don't know if Arangar was holding saidin at the time or not.
- 21/09/2010 07:11:42 PM
2147 Views
Thanks. Was Arangar channeling at the time?
- 21/09/2010 07:13:53 PM
2135 Views
I think so, yes.
- 21/09/2010 07:15:44 PM
2084 Views
I don't think so actually
- 21/09/2010 07:57:42 PM
2197 Views
I don't think Aran'gar was channeling
- 21/09/2010 11:00:22 PM
2110 Views
I don't think she even closed her Gateway. It think it was BF'd *NM*
- 21/09/2010 11:52:01 PM
1165 Views
Re: I don't think she even closed her Gateway. It think it was BF'd
- 22/09/2010 02:57:02 AM
1993 Views
So here's what happens...
- 21/09/2010 07:15:03 PM
2528 Views
Thanks. A few comments...
- 21/09/2010 07:27:33 PM
2014 Views
I don't rule out the angreal...
- 21/09/2010 07:32:40 PM
2008 Views
Elayne's weakest angreal doubles her strength. Graendal x2 can easily shield Cyndane+Moggy, so...
- 21/09/2010 07:35:06 PM
2157 Views
I disasgree. There is no evidence that Aran'gar was holding saidin at the time
- 21/09/2010 07:42:23 PM
2011 Views
Then why did she gasp at the shield? She couldn't have known what Graendal was weaving.
- 21/09/2010 07:52:49 PM
2019 Views
because she was surprised that Graendal would put a shield on her in the first place
- 21/09/2010 07:58:45 PM
2038 Views
How did she know there was a shield?
- 21/09/2010 09:16:59 PM
2007 Views
Fact: Graendal cannot shield a male Forsaken and an Aes Sedai if they are holding the Source...
- 21/09/2010 09:28:17 PM
1982 Views
Who said "they"?
- 21/09/2010 09:55:28 PM
1971 Views
Depends on the level of surprise, I guess. If he was only holding a trickle of saidin, then maybe
- 21/09/2010 10:05:37 PM
2046 Views
I really don't think you have to be holding the source to know you've been shielded
- 21/09/2010 10:29:20 PM
1903 Views
Provide evidence?
- 21/09/2010 10:36:36 PM
1998 Views
Thanks, but like I said, they were both wrapped in air. That's enough for Aran'gar to wonder
- 21/09/2010 10:44:17 PM
1908 Views
Siuan was distracted by a number of other things going on, not to mention how suspect
- 22/09/2010 02:43:36 PM
1856 Views
And Aran'gar was fully focussed on Graendal?
- 22/09/2010 03:02:16 PM
2108 Views
More so than Siuan was on Elaida when they were shielded.
- 22/09/2010 03:33:15 PM
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So?
- 22/09/2010 03:48:11 PM
1789 Views
It doesn't matter. There are more Shieldings that go unnoticed when not holding the Source
- 22/09/2010 03:55:48 PM
1908 Views
we don't know that
- 22/09/2010 02:35:50 PM
1961 Views
Give over, Darius... there's plenty of evidence...
- 22/09/2010 03:45:11 PM
1942 Views
Give over what? There is no hard evidence that Aran'gar wouldn't notice a shield put on her
- 22/09/2010 05:00:11 PM
1840 Views
What rot... (also, Egwene and Rand)
- 22/09/2010 05:21:08 PM
1970 Views
take a pill Fionwe ... no need to go batshit on me for having an opinion.
- 22/09/2010 05:38:21 PM
1939 Views
Re: take a pill Fionwe ... no need to go batshit on me for having an opinion.
- 22/09/2010 05:45:05 PM
2066 Views
if it was JUST one shield ... but she's shielding an AS and weaving a Gateway too!
- 22/09/2010 05:48:52 PM
3963 Views
Well...
- 22/09/2010 07:00:26 PM
1969 Views
She says...
- 22/09/2010 07:04:32 PM
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no one is arguing that
- 22/09/2010 07:09:17 PM
1958 Views
Er...
- 22/09/2010 07:19:09 PM
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I'm contending that it's possible Aran'gar snesed she'd been shielded
- 22/09/2010 07:20:48 PM
2730 Views
Re: I'm contending that it's possible Aran'gar snesed she'd been shielded
- 22/09/2010 07:26:52 PM
2687 Views
Again, I just find that option completely unlikely since Graendals angreal isn't all that strong
- 22/09/2010 07:39:02 PM
1982 Views
You've made a long list of channelers "incompetant" and "untrained". Enough.
- 23/09/2010 01:53:25 AM
2040 Views
Re: You've made a long list of channelers "incompetant" and "untrained". Enough.
- 23/09/2010 03:42:31 PM
1918 Views
- 23/09/2010 03:54:02 PM
1940 Views
- 23/09/2010 03:54:02 PM
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Re:
. The evidence is that no channeled is that strong!
- 23/09/2010 04:04:02 PM
2046 Views
. The evidence is that no channeled is that strong!
- 23/09/2010 04:04:02 PM
2046 Views
Really?
- 23/09/2010 06:11:00 PM
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Re: Really?
- 23/09/2010 09:56:09 PM
1887 Views
That's my point *NM*
- 24/09/2010 12:20:45 AM
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Dear God! The sheer amount of replies here just blew my mind, and my window (jk).
*NM*
- 24/09/2010 07:28:14 PM
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*NM*
- 24/09/2010 07:28:14 PM
1256 Views
The way it reads she is holding open a Gateway, then slams shields on both
- 22/09/2010 07:08:17 PM
1908 Views
Continue being irrational then...
- 22/09/2010 05:46:19 PM
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Re: Continue being irrational then...
- 22/09/2010 05:53:05 PM
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Re: Continue being irrational then...
- 22/09/2010 07:03:02 PM
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Nope
- 22/09/2010 07:19:30 PM
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Re: Nope
- 23/09/2010 02:06:35 AM
1955 Views
And you ignore all the evidence in the series that definitively makes it impossible for Graendal to
- 23/09/2010 03:57:49 PM
1834 Views
Well...
- 23/09/2010 04:31:27 PM
2016 Views
According to Fionwe she isn't using the angreal
- 24/09/2010 11:18:30 PM
2188 Views
Re: According to Fionwe she isn't using the angreal
- 25/09/2010 09:38:41 AM
1985 Views
Possible, but he specifically calls out when she ties off other weaves in the scene
- 25/09/2010 04:28:48 PM
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Re: How did she know there was a shield?
- 24/09/2010 04:42:25 AM
1910 Views
You can sense the source when shielded. Entering a stedding you can't even sense it. *NM*
- 24/09/2010 02:46:09 PM
1301 Views
You'[re missing the part about the bonds of air as well
- 21/09/2010 11:06:04 PM
1930 Views
No. The sequence was shield-gasp-tie off shield-wrap in Air. *NM*
- 21/09/2010 11:14:41 PM
1241 Views
We have seen people holding the source caught off guard by a shield *NM*
- 22/09/2010 12:10:48 AM
1197 Views
Well, exactly!
- 22/09/2010 02:01:12 AM
1966 Views
Aran'gar and Delana were caught with their pants down by Graendal
- 22/09/2010 06:40:41 AM
2227 Views
What I think happened
- 22/09/2010 09:19:57 AM
1932 Views
It's not the male/female issue. It's a Forsaken vs Forsaken issue...
- 22/09/2010 10:06:47 AM
1898 Views
Re: It's not the male/female issue. It's a Forsaken vs Forsaken issue...
- 22/09/2010 01:31:52 PM
2013 Views
About shielding a channeler holding the Source...
- 22/09/2010 05:51:34 PM
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Re: About shielding a channeler holding the Source...
- 22/09/2010 07:04:37 PM
3427 Views
The angreal makes this an unnecessary debate...
- 22/09/2010 07:09:20 PM
1909 Views
she never shielded them
- 22/09/2010 07:22:29 PM
1903 Views
True...But it made her strong enough to easily overcome both...
- 22/09/2010 07:28:12 PM
1853 Views
This I can believe ... it's just problematic since the angreal isn't mentioned
- 22/09/2010 07:51:19 PM
1966 Views
Re: This I can believe ... it's just problematic since the angreal isn't mentioned
- 22/09/2010 07:54:18 PM
1905 Views
I think we need to place Aran'gar lower too..
- 22/09/2010 07:10:29 PM
2011 Views
A lot of unsubstantiated assumptions there...
- 22/09/2010 07:13:51 PM
1830 Views
Mostly agree
- 22/09/2010 07:23:53 PM
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Re: Mostly agree
- 22/09/2010 07:28:42 PM
1870 Views
Ever wonder why Graendal was given an angreal in the first place...
- 22/09/2010 07:34:21 PM
1970 Views
Re: Ever wonder why Graendal was given an angreal in the first place...
- 22/09/2010 07:50:55 PM
2005 Views
I am starting to believe that RJ didn't think quite so literally
- 22/09/2010 08:07:45 PM
1940 Views
Not sure if you agreed with this before, but I reached this point awhile ago bwahaha
- 22/09/2010 08:53:42 PM
1951 Views
Well there is one thing to consider about this
- 21/09/2010 07:32:44 PM
2188 Views
Yes, that seems the most likely answer. That and the use of the angreal.
- 21/09/2010 07:35:53 PM
2016 Views
Aren't female channelers more dexterous in weaving than male? So her speed could be part of that. *NM*
- 22/09/2010 03:42:56 AM
1181 Views
Re: Not even Ishamael could shield another male Forsaken and an Aes Sedai at the same time...
- 01/10/2010 12:23:57 AM
1961 Views
I'm disappointed that the dove was not hidden in a background description in the tGS scene...
- 21/09/2010 08:22:29 PM
2061 Views
I was thinking the same thing ... was actually just about to go look for it myself!
- 21/09/2010 09:01:34 PM
2076 Views
I'm happy there wasn't...
- 21/09/2010 09:18:30 PM
2042 Views
Do you have more detail on Graendal's comments about Aginor's extensive use of the True Power?
- 21/09/2010 09:23:48 PM
1993 Views
Re: Do you have more detail on Graendal's comments about Aginor's extensive use of the True Power?
- 21/09/2010 09:52:07 PM
2132 Views
Very interesting. Another case of a character never utilised to his full potential in the series...
- 21/09/2010 09:57:42 PM
1878 Views
For the record
- 21/09/2010 10:53:16 PM
2082 Views
I am so glad Graendal is alive. I (& hopefully other "Graendal's Alive" supporters) feel vindicated. *NM*
- 22/09/2010 03:01:07 AM
1331 Views
Did anyone else feel that the Graendal scene was one big infodump?
- 22/09/2010 03:32:44 AM
2105 Views
That's exactly what I was thinking the entire time. It didn't ruin my enjoyment though.
- 22/09/2010 07:12:00 PM
1957 Views
Wait...so NO ONE has wanted to discuss the Sapphic scene at Graendal's place?
- 22/09/2010 03:48:36 AM
2151 Views
No, not at all. Aran'gar is still a dude at heart. I think. *NM*
- 22/09/2010 08:18:55 PM
1211 Views
I tend to agree
- 23/09/2010 05:42:52 PM
1959 Views
Lady parts + Lady parts = Lesbian sex
- 24/09/2010 11:24:36 PM
2573 Views
Yes, but its still a little off
- 25/09/2010 09:40:16 AM
1994 Views
What does Graendal think of Rand?
- 22/09/2010 02:00:28 PM
2117 Views
Aran'gar is a tool
- 22/09/2010 07:31:36 PM
2188 Views
I would think this argues against your contention that she would hold saidin to the max...
- 22/09/2010 07:36:09 PM
1946 Views
Re: I would think this argues against your contention that she would hold saidin to the max...
- 22/09/2010 07:51:53 PM
1868 Views
Remembering the last time male channelers held reversed weaves in the presence of Rand's party...
- 22/09/2010 07:55:12 PM
1844 Views
Are Fain's resurrected trollocks undead?
- 23/09/2010 01:43:01 AM
1972 Views
After 13 books you still can't spell "trollocs"...wow...that's just...wow... *NM*
- 23/09/2010 03:41:24 PM
1234 Views
Thanks for taking up space on this board to point out my shortcomings. Always appreciated. *NM*
- 23/09/2010 05:23:19 PM
1183 Views
Nice prologue, but not superb, IMO
- 23/09/2010 05:45:41 PM
2112 Views
Re: Nice prologue, but not superb, IMO
- 23/09/2010 09:54:33 PM
2048 Views
Well, that is one prediction I made correctly! Etzel would find a way to make it look like Slayer
- 25/09/2010 05:43:20 PM
2116 Views
- 25/09/2010 05:43:20 PM
2116 Views
I believe that Sanderson concocted the entire Graendal/Rand/Balefire part
- 23/09/2010 10:24:46 PM
2735 Views
No way
- 24/09/2010 07:14:35 AM
1961 Views
I can't see team Jordan allowing any deviation on what RJ would have laid out
- 12/10/2010 08:32:50 PM
2138 Views

*NM*

*NM*
*NM*