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So here's what happens... fionwe1987 Send a noteboard - 21/09/2010 07:15:03 PM
Graendal is holding the TP and using a dove to spy on Rand. She sees him take out the Access Key and quickly figures out what he's planning. She releases the TP, and in a panic, almost fails to embrace Saidar.

She then first weaves a Gateway. After that, Aran'gar, who's watching out of the window, makes a comment about how much of the Power Rand was holding. Graendal realizes that since Aran'gar and Delana wove compulsion on Ramshalan, they'd have to die, or else Rand would think Graendal was alive. So she slams a shield into both of them, and ties them off. As she does this, both women gasp. Delana gasping is no surprise, since she can see Graendal weave a shield. Thus, she may not have been holding the source. That Aran'gar gasped implies to me that she was holding the source, and felt it get cut off (and it makes sense that she was holding the source. Rand had just channeled enormous amounts of the OP). After tying off the shields, Graendal now wraps the two women in Air, and flees through her Gateway. At no time is the angreal mentioned.

Some critical things:

Graendal is confident that Aran'gar cannot break through her shield anytime soon. Since she made it really really fast, I doubt she made a complicated knot. That means that Graendal is enough stronger than Aran'gar that the other woman can't easily brush off her shield.

Graendal is a really fast channeler. That even in a panicked state she could do so many things that required so much power implies to me that she is one of the most skilled among the Foresaken. I think only Lanfear could have done the same.

More than anything else, Graendal is an intelligent channeler, which makes her much more dangerous than her strength alone would have. She's certainly been set up as Moridin's counterpart among the females, with her TP access.

Nynaeve has insane skill with Healing. The way Graendal phrases it, someone with the ability to read her compulsions is extremely rare. It might interest you to know that before she figured out that Rand was going to BF Natrin's Barrow, Graendal made a plan to kill Nynaeve.
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Towers of Midnight : Prologue discussion - 21/09/2010 04:38:40 AM 9361 Views
Me Too! Guess who is alive!! - 21/09/2010 04:44:40 AM 2710 Views
A dove, that's weird - 21/09/2010 03:19:10 PM 2536 Views
Re: A dove, that's weird - 21/09/2010 03:26:39 PM 2459 Views
Yes, that's the point - 21/09/2010 11:49:00 PM 2292 Views
It did feel a bit deus ex machina - 22/09/2010 12:03:05 AM 2430 Views
Fain is as creepy as ever - 21/09/2010 05:06:35 AM 2556 Views
You all can go to heck (and find me a link!) *NM* - 21/09/2010 05:10:47 AM 1512 Views
Re: You all can go to heck (and find me a link!) - 21/09/2010 05:14:26 AM 2627 Views
It's D/L on B&N now *NM* - 21/09/2010 05:15:44 AM 1429 Views
Anyone find the audiobook version? *NM* - 21/09/2010 10:20:22 AM 1369 Views
I love the borderlanders - 21/09/2010 05:25:29 AM 2492 Views
Best scene of the prologue *NM* - 21/09/2010 03:28:28 PM 1446 Views
Could somebody post a link to where they got it? I want to go to a site where I can download now *NM* - 21/09/2010 05:39:13 AM 1468 Views
I posted some links here - 21/09/2010 06:04:38 AM 2370 Views
My quick summary - 21/09/2010 06:02:41 AM 3176 Views
Whoa, whoa, whoa. - 23/09/2010 02:59:37 AM 2218 Views
It's good, but... Perrin. Ugh. - 21/09/2010 07:37:43 AM 2525 Views
Awesome! - 21/09/2010 09:00:45 AM 2296 Views
Regarding Graendal - 21/09/2010 10:12:42 AM 2814 Views
Some things... - 21/09/2010 01:18:10 PM 2386 Views
I'm glad. Being right is a good feeling - 21/09/2010 04:12:08 PM 2314 Views
a very weak angreal - 21/09/2010 04:55:15 PM 2342 Views
Even a weak angreal - 21/09/2010 05:47:26 PM 2291 Views
The Angreal Elayne mentions made her 2x as strong as Nynaeve - 21/09/2010 06:04:21 PM 2178 Views
The laughter in Perrin's Dream - 21/09/2010 02:24:14 PM 2400 Views
Probably Slayer - 21/09/2010 04:29:41 PM 2303 Views
Re: Probably Slayer - 21/09/2010 04:39:36 PM 2116 Views
Audio Book - 21/09/2010 06:39:54 PM 2212 Views
Not even Ishamael could shield another male Forsaken and an Aes Sedai at the same time... - 21/09/2010 06:46:42 PM 2459 Views
It's different (I think?) but I'm certainly no expert and I'm sure someone else will reply - 21/09/2010 06:57:18 PM 2325 Views
OK, I haven't read the scene, so I don't know if Arangar was holding saidin at the time or not - 21/09/2010 07:00:23 PM 2153 Views
Re: OK, I haven't read the scene, so I don't know if Arangar was holding saidin at the time or not. - 21/09/2010 07:11:42 PM 2238 Views
Thanks. Was Arangar channeling at the time? - 21/09/2010 07:13:53 PM 2231 Views
I think so, yes. - 21/09/2010 07:15:44 PM 2182 Views
I don't think so actually - 21/09/2010 07:57:42 PM 2303 Views
I don't think Aran'gar was channeling - 21/09/2010 11:00:22 PM 2207 Views
I don't think she even closed her Gateway. It think it was BF'd *NM* - 21/09/2010 11:52:01 PM 1213 Views
no she wasn't *NM* - 21/09/2010 10:25:13 PM 1328 Views
nope, no power - 23/09/2010 03:05:30 AM 2111 Views
So here's what happens... - 21/09/2010 07:15:03 PM 2631 Views
Thanks. A few comments... - 21/09/2010 07:27:33 PM 2114 Views
I don't rule out the angreal... - 21/09/2010 07:32:40 PM 2092 Views
Elayne's weakest angreal doubles her strength. Graendal x2 can easily shield Cyndane+Moggy, so... - 21/09/2010 07:35:06 PM 2249 Views
Graendal's seemed much weaker... - 21/09/2010 07:52:20 PM 2101 Views
Elayne also called the x2 turtle angreal "weak"... - 21/09/2010 08:00:01 PM 2136 Views
and we know it wasn't enough to overwhlem Verin's circle - 21/09/2010 08:02:13 PM 1984 Views
I disasgree. There is no evidence that Aran'gar was holding saidin at the time - 21/09/2010 07:42:23 PM 2115 Views
Then why did she gasp at the shield? She couldn't have known what Graendal was weaving. - 21/09/2010 07:52:49 PM 2135 Views
because she was surprised that Graendal would put a shield on her in the first place - 21/09/2010 07:58:45 PM 2162 Views
How did she know there was a shield? - 21/09/2010 09:16:59 PM 2099 Views
Fact: Graendal cannot shield a male Forsaken and an Aes Sedai if they are holding the Source... - 21/09/2010 09:28:17 PM 2076 Views
Who said "they"? - 21/09/2010 09:55:28 PM 2077 Views
I really don't think you have to be holding the source to know you've been shielded - 21/09/2010 10:29:20 PM 1992 Views
Provide evidence? - 21/09/2010 10:36:36 PM 2090 Views
Thanks, but like I said, they were both wrapped in air. That's enough for Aran'gar to wonder - 21/09/2010 10:44:17 PM 2003 Views
They gasped before Graendal wove Air... - 21/09/2010 11:13:48 PM 2054 Views
Alright, you win *NM* - 22/09/2010 02:51:26 AM 1271 Views
*NM* - 22/09/2010 03:06:22 AM 1112 Views
Siuan was distracted by a number of other things going on, not to mention how suspect - 22/09/2010 02:43:36 PM 1947 Views
And Aran'gar was fully focussed on Graendal? - 22/09/2010 03:02:16 PM 2207 Views
More so than Siuan was on Elaida when they were shielded. - 22/09/2010 03:33:15 PM 3000 Views
So? - 22/09/2010 03:48:11 PM 1893 Views
It doesn't matter. There are more Shieldings that go unnoticed when not holding the Source - 22/09/2010 03:55:48 PM 1993 Views
Nice catches! - 22/09/2010 04:06:52 PM 2134 Views
we don't know that - 22/09/2010 02:35:50 PM 2053 Views
Huh? - 22/09/2010 03:03:52 PM 1987 Views
Give over, Darius... there's plenty of evidence... - 22/09/2010 03:45:11 PM 2034 Views
Give over what? There is no hard evidence that Aran'gar wouldn't notice a shield put on her - 22/09/2010 05:00:11 PM 1927 Views
What rot... (also, Egwene and Rand) - 22/09/2010 05:21:08 PM 2057 Views
take a pill Fionwe ... no need to go batshit on me for having an opinion. - 22/09/2010 05:38:21 PM 2022 Views
Re: take a pill Fionwe ... no need to go batshit on me for having an opinion. - 22/09/2010 05:45:05 PM 2177 Views
if it was JUST one shield ... but she's shielding an AS and weaving a Gateway too! - 22/09/2010 05:48:52 PM 4071 Views
Well... - 22/09/2010 07:00:26 PM 2054 Views
She says... - 22/09/2010 07:04:32 PM 2070 Views
no one is arguing that - 22/09/2010 07:09:17 PM 2057 Views
Er... - 22/09/2010 07:19:09 PM 2003 Views
I'm contending that it's possible Aran'gar snesed she'd been shielded - 22/09/2010 07:20:48 PM 2821 Views
Re: I'm contending that it's possible Aran'gar snesed she'd been shielded - 22/09/2010 07:26:52 PM 2786 Views
Again, I just find that option completely unlikely since Graendals angreal isn't all that strong - 22/09/2010 07:39:02 PM 2069 Views
You've made a long list of channelers "incompetant" and "untrained". Enough. - 23/09/2010 01:53:25 AM 2126 Views
Re: You've made a long list of channelers "incompetant" and "untrained". Enough. - 23/09/2010 03:42:31 PM 2018 Views
- 23/09/2010 03:54:02 PM 2040 Views
Re: . The evidence is that no channeled is that strong! - 23/09/2010 04:04:02 PM 2142 Views
Really? - 23/09/2010 06:11:00 PM 2119 Views
Re: Really? - 23/09/2010 09:56:09 PM 1983 Views
That's my point *NM* - 24/09/2010 12:20:45 AM 1259 Views
Dear God! The sheer amount of replies here just blew my mind, and my window (jk). *NM* - 24/09/2010 07:28:14 PM 1311 Views
Y o u' r e h u r t i n g m y s c r o l l b a r *NM* - 24/09/2010 11:30:27 PM 1254 Views
Re: She says... - 22/09/2010 07:12:48 PM 2053 Views
Exactly. - 23/09/2010 01:54:05 AM 2007 Views
The way it reads she is holding open a Gateway, then slams shields on both - 22/09/2010 07:08:17 PM 2000 Views
Continue being irrational then... - 22/09/2010 05:46:19 PM 2127 Views
Re: Continue being irrational then... - 22/09/2010 05:53:05 PM 2006 Views
Re: Continue being irrational then... - 22/09/2010 07:03:02 PM 1994 Views
Nope - 22/09/2010 07:19:30 PM 1897 Views
Re: Nope - 23/09/2010 02:06:35 AM 2041 Views
Toveine! Now THAT is a good catch, fionwe! - 23/09/2010 07:57:05 AM 2148 Views
Sidious pointed it out, actually. But thanks! - 23/09/2010 03:55:29 PM 2051 Views
And you ignore all the evidence in the series that definitively makes it impossible for Graendal to - 23/09/2010 03:57:49 PM 1924 Views
Well... - 23/09/2010 04:31:27 PM 2123 Views
According to Fionwe she isn't using the angreal - 24/09/2010 11:18:30 PM 2282 Views
Re: According to Fionwe she isn't using the angreal - 25/09/2010 09:38:41 AM 2100 Views
Re: Continue being irrational then... - 24/09/2010 03:20:49 AM 2237 Views
Oh come on.. be real - 22/09/2010 05:39:51 PM 1980 Views
see that's an argument that makes more sense to me - 22/09/2010 05:47:17 PM 2074 Views
Re: How did she know there was a shield? - 24/09/2010 04:42:25 AM 2001 Views
You'[re missing the part about the bonds of air as well - 21/09/2010 11:06:04 PM 2018 Views
No. The sequence was shield-gasp-tie off shield-wrap in Air. *NM* - 21/09/2010 11:14:41 PM 1294 Views
We have seen people holding the source caught off guard by a shield *NM* - 22/09/2010 12:10:48 AM 1247 Views
Well, exactly! - 22/09/2010 02:01:12 AM 2056 Views
What I think happened - 22/09/2010 09:19:57 AM 2026 Views
It's not the male/female issue. It's a Forsaken vs Forsaken issue... - 22/09/2010 10:06:47 AM 1989 Views
Re: It's not the male/female issue. It's a Forsaken vs Forsaken issue... - 22/09/2010 01:31:52 PM 2099 Views
Fair point. - 22/09/2010 02:07:05 PM 2087 Views
I think it also bears mentioning that ... - 22/09/2010 04:17:17 PM 2062 Views
Graendal knew Aran'gar was distracted - 23/09/2010 07:10:52 AM 2022 Views
About shielding a channeler holding the Source... - 22/09/2010 05:51:34 PM 3100 Views
Re: About shielding a channeler holding the Source... - 22/09/2010 07:04:37 PM 3518 Views
The angreal makes this an unnecessary debate... - 22/09/2010 07:09:20 PM 2009 Views
she never shielded them - 22/09/2010 07:22:29 PM 2002 Views
True...But it made her strong enough to easily overcome both... - 22/09/2010 07:28:12 PM 1945 Views
This I can believe ... it's just problematic since the angreal isn't mentioned - 22/09/2010 07:51:19 PM 2060 Views
Re: This I can believe ... it's just problematic since the angreal isn't mentioned - 22/09/2010 07:54:18 PM 2000 Views
LMAO... nice! - 22/09/2010 08:24:20 PM 1996 Views
I think we need to place Aran'gar lower too.. - 22/09/2010 07:10:29 PM 2107 Views
A lot of unsubstantiated assumptions there... - 22/09/2010 07:13:51 PM 1923 Views
I would agree - 22/09/2010 07:22:50 PM 2117 Views
Re: I would agree - 22/09/2010 07:25:46 PM 1953 Views
Re: A lot of unsubstantiated assumptions there... - 23/09/2010 03:03:26 AM 1995 Views
Mostly agree - 22/09/2010 07:23:53 PM 2019 Views
Re: Mostly agree - 22/09/2010 07:28:42 PM 1963 Views
I am starting to believe that RJ didn't think quite so literally - 22/09/2010 08:07:45 PM 2045 Views
Not sure if you agreed with this before, but I reached this point awhile ago bwahaha - 22/09/2010 08:53:42 PM 2045 Views
I've been on this side for a good long while - 22/09/2010 09:40:43 PM 2153 Views
*NM* - 28/09/2010 11:54:54 PM 1208 Views
Well there is one thing to consider about this - 21/09/2010 07:32:44 PM 2284 Views
So there are 6 Forsaken left. - 21/09/2010 10:23:22 PM 2276 Views
For the record - 21/09/2010 10:53:16 PM 2196 Views
She opened two Gateways, IIRC - 21/09/2010 11:58:29 PM 2049 Views
Re: She opened two Gateways, IIRC - 22/09/2010 02:21:47 AM 2124 Views
Wait...so NO ONE has wanted to discuss the Sapphic scene at Graendal's place? - 22/09/2010 03:48:36 AM 2229 Views
yes, totally Lesbian. *NM* - 22/09/2010 03:04:16 PM 1274 Views
No, the other L word. "LesbiAHNS?" *NM* - 22/09/2010 04:18:55 PM 1389 Views
Yes, it was totally lesbian. - 22/09/2010 07:09:19 PM 2030 Views
No, not at all. Aran'gar is still a dude at heart. I think. *NM* - 22/09/2010 08:18:55 PM 1254 Views
I tend to agree - 23/09/2010 05:42:52 PM 2045 Views
Lady parts + Lady parts = Lesbian sex - 24/09/2010 11:24:36 PM 2669 Views
Yes, but its still a little off - 25/09/2010 09:40:16 AM 2080 Views
Transgender is a little convoluted I suppose - 25/09/2010 04:41:33 PM 2256 Views
Re: Transgender is a little convoluted I suppose - 25/09/2010 05:25:10 PM 2144 Views
What does Graendal think of Rand? - 22/09/2010 02:00:28 PM 2218 Views
She was really surprised and scared. - 22/09/2010 02:11:28 PM 2172 Views
I take it you haven't read the Prologue. - 22/09/2010 02:16:49 PM 2066 Views
Quite a bit... - 22/09/2010 02:31:14 PM 2202 Views
Agreed, she's been worrying about him since the begining - 22/09/2010 03:18:48 PM 2277 Views
Thanks for the answers *NM* - 22/09/2010 05:46:05 PM 1243 Views
Second best prologue ever... - 22/09/2010 06:24:44 PM 2439 Views
It's my favorite ever. Only one dark spot tarnished it. - 22/09/2010 07:18:12 PM 2063 Views
Yeah, tEotW is the best... - 22/09/2010 08:22:12 PM 2128 Views
Aran'gar is a tool - 22/09/2010 07:31:36 PM 2286 Views
Yes. s/He was. - 22/09/2010 08:59:16 PM 2071 Views
Shadow invading Kandor and Lan riding trough it. CONNECTION? - 22/09/2010 08:36:05 PM 2278 Views
- 23/09/2010 04:47:11 PM 2164 Views
Nice prologue, but not superb, IMO - 23/09/2010 05:45:41 PM 2213 Views
Re: Nice prologue, but not superb, IMO - 23/09/2010 09:54:33 PM 2139 Views
I believe that Sanderson concocted the entire Graendal/Rand/Balefire part - 23/09/2010 10:24:46 PM 2829 Views
I had a similar thought, but... - 23/09/2010 10:40:58 PM 2138 Views
Probably not Sanderson - 23/09/2010 11:11:54 PM 2145 Views
No way - 24/09/2010 07:14:35 AM 2052 Views
I agree. *NM* - 25/09/2010 09:42:46 AM 1276 Views
A few nits - 12/10/2010 10:21:27 AM 2068 Views
Canadian Download site - 29/09/2010 12:05:12 AM 2623 Views

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