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I'm contending that it's possible Aran'gar snesed she'd been shielded darius_sedai Send a noteboard - 22/09/2010 07:20:48 PM
First, she weaves a Gateway. While holding it open, she says "she wove two shields...". That's conclusive, IMO.


it's your supposition that because Aran'gar gasps that means she must have been holding the Power that I question.


If Aran'gar hadn't been holding saidin she never would have known about the shield. It is saidar after all. We've seen this happen to Rand when Lanfear shielded him. It's only detectable when they try reach for the Source and feel the 'glass barrier'.

Delana might have known obviously.

One small possibility is that Aran'gar gasped as she felt all the balefire hurling towards her, much like Nynaeve did when Moghedien balefired her. Depending on how quickly this scene took place.


without Graendal having to have cut her off from the Power. Nothing more.
Domani Drag Queen in the White Tower ... Aran'gar watch out!
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Towers of Midnight : Prologue discussion fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 04:38:40 AM 9364 Views
Me Too! Guess who is alive!! PatAtt - 21/09/2010 04:44:40 AM 2710 Views
A dove, that's weird BlackAdder - 21/09/2010 03:19:10 PM 2538 Views
Re: A dove, that's weird Ryan - 21/09/2010 03:26:39 PM 2462 Views
Yes, that's the point BlackAdder - 21/09/2010 11:49:00 PM 2294 Views
It did feel a bit deus ex machina Ryan - 22/09/2010 12:03:05 AM 2432 Views
What Ryan said. And we only assumed that they can only use those animals *NM* Deadsy - 21/09/2010 06:53:05 PM 1464 Views
Fain is as creepy as ever PatAtt - 21/09/2010 05:06:35 AM 2556 Views
You all can go to heck (and find me a link!) *NM* Deadsy - 21/09/2010 05:10:47 AM 1512 Views
Re: You all can go to heck (and find me a link!) PatAtt - 21/09/2010 05:14:26 AM 2629 Views
It's D/L on B&N now *NM* Deadsy - 21/09/2010 05:15:44 AM 1429 Views
Anyone find the audiobook version? *NM* Yuri - 21/09/2010 10:20:22 AM 1369 Views
If you're in the US, Audible.com. No clue about availability in the UK. *NM* RandAllThor - 21/09/2010 06:29:45 PM 1389 Views
I love the borderlanders PatAtt - 21/09/2010 05:25:29 AM 2494 Views
Best scene of the prologue *NM* Ryan - 21/09/2010 03:28:28 PM 1446 Views
Could somebody post a link to where they got it? I want to go to a site where I can download now *NM* Guava - 21/09/2010 05:39:13 AM 1468 Views
I posted some links here PatAtt - 21/09/2010 06:04:38 AM 2373 Views
My quick summary PatAtt - 21/09/2010 06:02:41 AM 3177 Views
Whoa, whoa, whoa. DREWRULESWOT! - 23/09/2010 02:59:37 AM 2221 Views
It's good, but... Perrin. Ugh. Deadsy - 21/09/2010 07:37:43 AM 2528 Views
Awesome! Ryan - 21/09/2010 09:00:45 AM 2298 Views
Regarding Graendal Sidious - 21/09/2010 10:12:42 AM 2815 Views
Some things... fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 01:18:10 PM 2387 Views
I'm glad. Being right is a good feeling RugbyPlayingAshaman - 21/09/2010 04:12:08 PM 2318 Views
a very weak angreal darius_sedai - 21/09/2010 04:55:15 PM 2345 Views
Even a weak angreal malekithe - 21/09/2010 05:47:26 PM 2294 Views
The Angreal Elayne mentions made her 2x as strong as Nynaeve darius_sedai - 21/09/2010 06:04:21 PM 2180 Views
Graendal watched Aran'gar get nuked. Aran'gar is gone gone gone. Tom - 21/09/2010 10:11:41 PM 2303 Views
The laughter in Perrin's Dream Syraelle - 21/09/2010 02:24:14 PM 2401 Views
Probably Slayer RugbyPlayingAshaman - 21/09/2010 04:29:41 PM 2305 Views
Re: Probably Slayer Syraelle - 21/09/2010 04:39:36 PM 2119 Views
Audio Book Matt_at_Heart - 21/09/2010 06:39:54 PM 2213 Views
Not even Ishamael could shield another male Forsaken and an Aes Sedai at the same time... Shannow - 21/09/2010 06:46:42 PM 2462 Views
It's different (I think?) but I'm certainly no expert and I'm sure someone else will reply Deadsy - 21/09/2010 06:57:18 PM 2327 Views
OK, I haven't read the scene, so I don't know if Arangar was holding saidin at the time or not Shannow - 21/09/2010 07:00:23 PM 2156 Views
Re: OK, I haven't read the scene, so I don't know if Arangar was holding saidin at the time or not. Deadsy - 21/09/2010 07:11:42 PM 2241 Views
Thanks. Was Arangar channeling at the time? Shannow - 21/09/2010 07:13:53 PM 2233 Views
I think so, yes. fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 07:15:44 PM 2185 Views
I don't think so actually darius_sedai - 21/09/2010 07:57:42 PM 2304 Views
I don't think Aran'gar was channeling Ryan - 21/09/2010 11:00:22 PM 2207 Views
I don't think she even closed her Gateway. It think it was BF'd *NM* BlackAdder - 21/09/2010 11:52:01 PM 1213 Views
Re: I don't think she even closed her Gateway. It think it was BF'd Heiko - 22/09/2010 02:57:02 AM 2080 Views
no she wasn't *NM* Deadsy - 21/09/2010 10:25:13 PM 1328 Views
nope, no power newyorkersedai - 23/09/2010 03:05:30 AM 2114 Views
So here's what happens... fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 07:15:03 PM 2634 Views
Thanks. A few comments... Shannow - 21/09/2010 07:27:33 PM 2117 Views
I don't rule out the angreal... fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 07:32:40 PM 2093 Views
Elayne's weakest angreal doubles her strength. Graendal x2 can easily shield Cyndane+Moggy, so... Shannow - 21/09/2010 07:35:06 PM 2252 Views
Graendal's seemed much weaker... fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 07:52:20 PM 2104 Views
Elayne also called the x2 turtle angreal "weak"... Shannow - 21/09/2010 08:00:01 PM 2138 Views
and we know it wasn't enough to overwhlem Verin's circle darius_sedai - 21/09/2010 08:02:13 PM 1987 Views
I disasgree. There is no evidence that Aran'gar was holding saidin at the time darius_sedai - 21/09/2010 07:42:23 PM 2115 Views
Then why did she gasp at the shield? She couldn't have known what Graendal was weaving. fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 07:52:49 PM 2135 Views
because she was surprised that Graendal would put a shield on her in the first place darius_sedai - 21/09/2010 07:58:45 PM 2162 Views
How did she know there was a shield? fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 09:16:59 PM 2100 Views
Fact: Graendal cannot shield a male Forsaken and an Aes Sedai if they are holding the Source... Shannow - 21/09/2010 09:28:17 PM 2076 Views
Who said "they"? fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 09:55:28 PM 2077 Views
Depends on the level of surprise, I guess. If he was only holding a trickle of saidin, then maybe Shannow - 21/09/2010 10:05:37 PM 2149 Views
I don't think strength is the only determinant... fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 10:24:24 PM 2067 Views
I really don't think you have to be holding the source to know you've been shielded Deadsy - 21/09/2010 10:29:20 PM 1994 Views
Provide evidence? fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 10:36:36 PM 2092 Views
Thanks, but like I said, they were both wrapped in air. That's enough for Aran'gar to wonder Deadsy - 21/09/2010 10:44:17 PM 2005 Views
They gasped before Graendal wove Air... fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 11:13:48 PM 2056 Views
Alright, you win *NM* Deadsy - 22/09/2010 02:51:26 AM 1271 Views
*NM* fionwe1987 - 22/09/2010 03:06:22 AM 1112 Views
Siuan was distracted by a number of other things going on, not to mention how suspect darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 02:43:36 PM 1949 Views
And Aran'gar was fully focussed on Graendal? fionwe1987 - 22/09/2010 03:02:16 PM 2208 Views
More so than Siuan was on Elaida when they were shielded. darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 03:33:15 PM 3003 Views
So? fionwe1987 - 22/09/2010 03:48:11 PM 1894 Views
It doesn't matter. There are more Shieldings that go unnoticed when not holding the Source Mik - 22/09/2010 03:55:48 PM 1995 Views
Nice catches! fionwe1987 - 22/09/2010 04:06:52 PM 2135 Views
we don't know that darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 02:35:50 PM 2055 Views
Huh? fionwe1987 - 22/09/2010 03:03:52 PM 1988 Views
Give over, Darius... there's plenty of evidence... Mik - 22/09/2010 03:45:11 PM 2035 Views
Give over what? There is no hard evidence that Aran'gar wouldn't notice a shield put on her darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 05:00:11 PM 1928 Views
What rot... (also, Egwene and Rand) fionwe1987 - 22/09/2010 05:21:08 PM 2059 Views
take a pill Fionwe ... no need to go batshit on me for having an opinion. darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 05:38:21 PM 2025 Views
Re: take a pill Fionwe ... no need to go batshit on me for having an opinion. Sidious - 22/09/2010 05:45:05 PM 2179 Views
if it was JUST one shield ... but she's shielding an AS and weaving a Gateway too! darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 05:48:52 PM 4073 Views
Well... Sidious - 22/09/2010 07:00:26 PM 2057 Views
She says... fionwe1987 - 22/09/2010 07:04:32 PM 2074 Views
no one is arguing that darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 07:09:17 PM 2060 Views
Er... Sidious - 22/09/2010 07:19:09 PM 2005 Views
I'm contending that it's possible Aran'gar snesed she'd been shielded darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 07:20:48 PM 2823 Views
Re: I'm contending that it's possible Aran'gar snesed she'd been shielded Sidious - 22/09/2010 07:26:52 PM 2789 Views
Again, I just find that option completely unlikely since Graendals angreal isn't all that strong darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 07:39:02 PM 2072 Views
You've made a long list of channelers "incompetant" and "untrained". Enough. fionwe1987 - 23/09/2010 01:53:25 AM 2126 Views
Re: You've made a long list of channelers "incompetant" and "untrained". Enough. darius_sedai - 23/09/2010 03:42:31 PM 2020 Views
fionwe1987 - 23/09/2010 03:54:02 PM 2040 Views
Re: . The evidence is that no channeled is that strong! darius_sedai - 23/09/2010 04:04:02 PM 2143 Views
Really? fionwe1987 - 23/09/2010 06:11:00 PM 2119 Views
Re: Really? Sidious - 23/09/2010 09:56:09 PM 1985 Views
That's my point *NM* darius_sedai - 24/09/2010 12:20:45 AM 1259 Views
Dear God! The sheer amount of replies here just blew my mind, and my window (jk). *NM* Bookwyrm - 24/09/2010 07:28:14 PM 1311 Views
Y o u' r e h u r t i n g m y s c r o l l b a r *NM* Marshall - 24/09/2010 11:30:27 PM 1254 Views
Re: She says... Sidious - 22/09/2010 07:12:48 PM 2054 Views
Exactly. fionwe1987 - 23/09/2010 01:54:05 AM 2010 Views
The way it reads she is holding open a Gateway, then slams shields on both darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 07:08:17 PM 2001 Views
Continue being irrational then... fionwe1987 - 22/09/2010 05:46:19 PM 2131 Views
Re: Continue being irrational then... darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 05:53:05 PM 2009 Views
Re: Continue being irrational then... fionwe1987 - 22/09/2010 07:03:02 PM 1996 Views
Nope darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 07:19:30 PM 1899 Views
Re: Nope fionwe1987 - 23/09/2010 02:06:35 AM 2043 Views
Toveine! Now THAT is a good catch, fionwe! Mik - 23/09/2010 07:57:05 AM 2148 Views
Sidious pointed it out, actually. But thanks! fionwe1987 - 23/09/2010 03:55:29 PM 2053 Views
And you ignore all the evidence in the series that definitively makes it impossible for Graendal to darius_sedai - 23/09/2010 03:57:49 PM 1924 Views
Well... Sidious - 23/09/2010 04:31:27 PM 2123 Views
According to Fionwe she isn't using the angreal darius_sedai - 24/09/2010 11:18:30 PM 2285 Views
Re: According to Fionwe she isn't using the angreal Sidious - 25/09/2010 09:38:41 AM 2102 Views
Possible, but he specifically calls out when she ties off other weaves in the scene darius_sedai - 25/09/2010 04:28:48 PM 2064 Views
Re: Continue being irrational then... iHeartGraendal - 24/09/2010 03:20:49 AM 2241 Views
Oh come on.. be real Sidious - 22/09/2010 05:39:51 PM 1982 Views
see that's an argument that makes more sense to me darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 05:47:17 PM 2077 Views
Re: How did she know there was a shield? Gee69 - 24/09/2010 04:42:25 AM 2004 Views
You can sense the source when shielded. Entering a stedding you can't even sense it. *NM* Myrdhyn - 24/09/2010 02:46:09 PM 1350 Views
You'[re missing the part about the bonds of air as well Ryan - 21/09/2010 11:06:04 PM 2021 Views
No. The sequence was shield-gasp-tie off shield-wrap in Air. *NM* fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 11:14:41 PM 1294 Views
We have seen people holding the source caught off guard by a shield *NM* Ryan - 22/09/2010 12:10:48 AM 1247 Views
Well, exactly! fionwe1987 - 22/09/2010 02:01:12 AM 2058 Views
Aran'gar and Delana were caught with their pants down by Graendal Ryan - 22/09/2010 06:40:41 AM 2327 Views
What I think happened Sidious - 22/09/2010 09:19:57 AM 2027 Views
It's not the male/female issue. It's a Forsaken vs Forsaken issue... Shannow - 22/09/2010 10:06:47 AM 1991 Views
Re: It's not the male/female issue. It's a Forsaken vs Forsaken issue... Sidious - 22/09/2010 01:31:52 PM 2101 Views
Fair point. Shannow - 22/09/2010 02:07:05 PM 2089 Views
I think it also bears mentioning that ... Bookwyrm - 22/09/2010 04:17:17 PM 2063 Views
Graendal knew Aran'gar was distracted malekithe - 23/09/2010 07:10:52 AM 2024 Views
About shielding a channeler holding the Source... lilltempest - 22/09/2010 05:51:34 PM 3101 Views
Re: About shielding a channeler holding the Source... Sidious - 22/09/2010 07:04:37 PM 3520 Views
The angreal makes this an unnecessary debate... Shannow - 22/09/2010 07:09:20 PM 2010 Views
she never shielded them darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 07:22:29 PM 2005 Views
True...But it made her strong enough to easily overcome both... Shannow - 22/09/2010 07:28:12 PM 1948 Views
This I can believe ... it's just problematic since the angreal isn't mentioned darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 07:51:19 PM 2061 Views
Re: This I can believe ... it's just problematic since the angreal isn't mentioned Sidious - 22/09/2010 07:54:18 PM 2001 Views
LMAO... nice! darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 08:24:20 PM 2000 Views
I think we need to place Aran'gar lower too.. fionwe1987 - 22/09/2010 07:10:29 PM 2107 Views
A lot of unsubstantiated assumptions there... Shannow - 22/09/2010 07:13:51 PM 1926 Views
I would agree Sidious - 22/09/2010 07:22:50 PM 2119 Views
Re: I would agree darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 07:25:46 PM 1956 Views
Re: A lot of unsubstantiated assumptions there... fionwe1987 - 23/09/2010 03:03:26 AM 1997 Views
Mostly agree darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 07:23:53 PM 2020 Views
Re: Mostly agree Sidious - 22/09/2010 07:28:42 PM 1965 Views
Ever wonder why Graendal was given an angreal in the first place... Shannow - 22/09/2010 07:34:21 PM 2073 Views
Re: Ever wonder why Graendal was given an angreal in the first place... Sidious - 22/09/2010 07:50:55 PM 2117 Views
I am starting to believe that RJ didn't think quite so literally darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 08:07:45 PM 2047 Views
Not sure if you agreed with this before, but I reached this point awhile ago bwahaha RugbyPlayingAshaman - 22/09/2010 08:53:42 PM 2047 Views
I've been on this side for a good long while darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 09:40:43 PM 2155 Views
*NM* alanna aes sedai - 28/09/2010 11:54:54 PM 1208 Views
Well there is one thing to consider about this darius_sedai - 21/09/2010 07:32:44 PM 2286 Views
Yes, that seems the most likely answer. That and the use of the angreal. Shannow - 21/09/2010 07:35:53 PM 2117 Views
Aren't female channelers more dexterous in weaving than male? So her speed could be part of that. *NM* Bookwyrm - 22/09/2010 03:42:56 AM 1237 Views
Re: Not even Ishamael could shield another male Forsaken and an Aes Sedai at the same time... The Angry Druid - 01/10/2010 12:23:57 AM 2057 Views
I'm disappointed that the dove was not hidden in a background description in the tGS scene... Shannow - 21/09/2010 08:22:29 PM 2148 Views
I was thinking the same thing ... was actually just about to go look for it myself! darius_sedai - 21/09/2010 09:01:34 PM 2173 Views
I'm happy there wasn't... fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 09:18:30 PM 2130 Views
Do you have more detail on Graendal's comments about Aginor's extensive use of the True Power? Shannow - 21/09/2010 09:23:48 PM 2089 Views
Re: Do you have more detail on Graendal's comments about Aginor's extensive use of the True Power? fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 09:52:07 PM 2241 Views
Very interesting. Another case of a character never utilised to his full potential in the series... Shannow - 21/09/2010 09:57:42 PM 1982 Views
True... fionwe1987 - 21/09/2010 10:02:59 PM 1966 Views
So there are 6 Forsaken left. Tom - 21/09/2010 10:23:22 PM 2278 Views
For the record Heiko - 21/09/2010 10:53:16 PM 2197 Views
She opened two Gateways, IIRC BlackAdder - 21/09/2010 11:58:29 PM 2051 Views
Re: She opened two Gateways, IIRC Heiko - 22/09/2010 02:21:47 AM 2125 Views
I am so glad Graendal is alive. I (& hopefully other "Graendal's Alive" supporters) feel vindicated. *NM* Bookwyrm - 22/09/2010 03:01:07 AM 1393 Views
Did anyone else feel that the Graendal scene was one big infodump? Marshall - 22/09/2010 03:32:44 AM 2189 Views
That's exactly what I was thinking the entire time. It didn't ruin my enjoyment though. Myrdhyn - 22/09/2010 07:12:00 PM 2054 Views
Wait...so NO ONE has wanted to discuss the Sapphic scene at Graendal's place? Tom - 22/09/2010 03:48:36 AM 2230 Views
yes, totally Lesbian. *NM* darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 03:04:16 PM 1274 Views
No, the other L word. "LesbiAHNS?" *NM* Bookwyrm - 22/09/2010 04:18:55 PM 1389 Views
Yes, it was totally lesbian. Myrdhyn - 22/09/2010 07:09:19 PM 2032 Views
No, not at all. Aran'gar is still a dude at heart. I think. *NM* BlackAdder - 22/09/2010 08:18:55 PM 1254 Views
I tend to agree Sidious - 23/09/2010 05:42:52 PM 2046 Views
Lady parts + Lady parts = Lesbian sex darius_sedai - 24/09/2010 11:24:36 PM 2671 Views
Yes, but its still a little off Sidious - 25/09/2010 09:40:16 AM 2080 Views
Transgender is a little convoluted I suppose darius_sedai - 25/09/2010 04:41:33 PM 2257 Views
Re: Transgender is a little convoluted I suppose Sidious - 25/09/2010 05:25:10 PM 2145 Views
What does Graendal think of Rand? Sidious - 22/09/2010 02:00:28 PM 2220 Views
She was really surprised and scared. Rurouni_Kenshin - 22/09/2010 02:11:28 PM 2174 Views
I take it you haven't read the Prologue. Tom - 22/09/2010 02:16:49 PM 2068 Views
Quite a bit... fionwe1987 - 22/09/2010 02:31:14 PM 2204 Views
Agreed, she's been worrying about him since the begining darius_sedai - 22/09/2010 03:18:48 PM 2278 Views
Thanks for the answers *NM* Sidious - 22/09/2010 05:46:05 PM 1243 Views
Second best prologue ever... lilltempest - 22/09/2010 06:24:44 PM 2441 Views
It's my favorite ever. Only one dark spot tarnished it. Myrdhyn - 22/09/2010 07:18:12 PM 2066 Views
Yeah, tEotW is the best... BlackAdder - 22/09/2010 08:22:12 PM 2130 Views
Aran'gar is a tool Sidious - 22/09/2010 07:31:36 PM 2288 Views
I would think this argues against your contention that she would hold saidin to the max... Shannow - 22/09/2010 07:36:09 PM 2040 Views
Re: I would think this argues against your contention that she would hold saidin to the max... Sidious - 22/09/2010 07:51:53 PM 1962 Views
Remembering the last time male channelers held reversed weaves in the presence of Rand's party... Shannow - 22/09/2010 07:55:12 PM 1931 Views
Yes. s/He was. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 22/09/2010 08:59:16 PM 2072 Views
Shadow invading Kandor and Lan riding trough it. CONNECTION? 4th Dimension - 22/09/2010 08:36:05 PM 2278 Views
Are Fain's resurrected trollocks undead? RandAllThor - 23/09/2010 01:43:01 AM 2065 Views
After 13 books you still can't spell "trollocs"...wow...that's just...wow... *NM* Tom - 23/09/2010 03:41:24 PM 1292 Views
Thanks for taking up space on this board to point out my shortcomings. Always appreciated. *NM* RandAllThor - 23/09/2010 05:23:19 PM 1236 Views
Sidious - 23/09/2010 04:47:11 PM 2165 Views
Nice prologue, but not superb, IMO Etzel - 23/09/2010 05:45:41 PM 2214 Views
Re: Nice prologue, but not superb, IMO Sidious - 23/09/2010 09:54:33 PM 2140 Views
Well, that is one prediction I made correctly! Etzel would find a way to make it look like Slayer darius_sedai - 25/09/2010 05:43:20 PM 2205 Views
I believe that Sanderson concocted the entire Graendal/Rand/Balefire part Marshall - 23/09/2010 10:24:46 PM 2831 Views
I had a similar thought, but... RandAllThor - 23/09/2010 10:40:58 PM 2141 Views
Probably not Sanderson 4th Dimension - 23/09/2010 11:11:54 PM 2145 Views
No way Rurouni_Kenshin - 24/09/2010 07:14:35 AM 2054 Views
I can't see team Jordan allowing any deviation on what RJ would have laid out darius_sedai - 12/10/2010 08:32:50 PM 2228 Views
I agree. *NM* Etzel - 25/09/2010 09:42:46 AM 1276 Views
A few nits Terez - 12/10/2010 10:21:27 AM 2068 Views
Canadian Download site alanna aes sedai - 29/09/2010 12:05:12 AM 2625 Views
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