he is as strong as a Forsaken from almost his first moments touching the Source (he's stronger than Aginor in EoTW and a match for Be'lal and Ishamael in TDR) in all honesty his strength has been inconsistent throughout the series, but he's never been weaker than any Forsaken Male. Egwene and Elayne were both well short of their ultimate strength when he manhandles them and Verin and Alana are probably no more than Mean level Sisters so him overpowering them is a no brainer ... on my scale the stongest they can be is 32 ... Maybe 1 SD above a Mean of 24 or so ... combined they wouldn't be much more than 1/2 of a Forsaken male.
When you consider a Forsaken is going to be at a minimum an Effective strength of 85 it's going to take the most Powerful sisters (Myrelle or higher) to even be a strength match for a single weak Forsaken on a strength basis ... at a minimum they would need 3 of the Strongest Sisters to have a reliable strength match and even that would easily be countered by superior skill. If Nynaeve was ball park 85 in Ebou Dar, Ispan and Falion combined would be around around a 60-65 and their shield would be viable. Even if they lost 10% of their raw power they would gain effectiveness from linking and could hold Nynaeve.
I agree that for most of the series Egwene is around a 65-70 (between 80-90% or her potential), but I don't think she's hit her full potential ( 80 IMO) until maybe TGS when we see some significant increases in her abilities. Even in KoD she briefly considers taking on 5 AS until she realizes she's been forkrooted. And in ToM, after her massive use of Power using Vora's sa'angreal probably pushed her to her full potential, she is confident she can defeat Mesaana in single combat, which lends to her being much closer to Forsaken Strength than AS strength. And let's not forget that RJ noted that Egwene/Elayne/Aviendha are ONE level below the Forsaken.
When you consider a Forsaken is going to be at a minimum an Effective strength of 85 it's going to take the most Powerful sisters (Myrelle or higher) to even be a strength match for a single weak Forsaken on a strength basis ... at a minimum they would need 3 of the Strongest Sisters to have a reliable strength match and even that would easily be countered by superior skill. If Nynaeve was ball park 85 in Ebou Dar, Ispan and Falion combined would be around around a 60-65 and their shield would be viable. Even if they lost 10% of their raw power they would gain effectiveness from linking and could hold Nynaeve.
I agree that for most of the series Egwene is around a 65-70 (between 80-90% or her potential), but I don't think she's hit her full potential ( 80 IMO) until maybe TGS when we see some significant increases in her abilities. Even in KoD she briefly considers taking on 5 AS until she realizes she's been forkrooted. And in ToM, after her massive use of Power using Vora's sa'angreal probably pushed her to her full potential, she is confident she can defeat Mesaana in single combat, which lends to her being much closer to Forsaken Strength than AS strength. And let's not forget that RJ noted that Egwene/Elayne/Aviendha are ONE level below the Forsaken.
Egwene does not believe that she can defeat Mesaana alone. Her initial quote doesn't imply that she would do it alone. She may have planned an ambush or to confront Mesaana on her own terms, or with an angreal.
Later she says... "Egwene gritted her teeth and sent herself away. She didn't dare face the woman directly."
That is once again direct evidence that Egwene feels she can't fight one of the Forsaken directly. This is now after she has felt Mesaana's strength and perhaps seen her skill. Her opinion is unchanged to when she spoke about the Forsaken in Salidar.
Wheel of Time board admin
Fan of Lanfear
Fan of Lanfear
How many standard deviations is Lanfear
- 15/11/2012 06:04:39 PM
2604 Views
Hmm...
- 15/11/2012 07:25:34 PM
1700 Views
see we CAN agree on stuff
- 15/11/2012 07:56:12 PM
1547 Views
- 18/11/2012 08:37:22 PM
1400 Views
- 15/11/2012 07:56:12 PM
1547 Views
- 18/11/2012 08:37:22 PM
1400 Views
Re:
- 18/11/2012 11:07:17 PM
1621 Views
- 18/11/2012 11:07:17 PM
1621 Views
Re:
- 19/11/2012 05:16:00 AM
1453 Views
- 19/11/2012 05:16:00 AM
1453 Views
Re:
- 19/11/2012 03:13:01 PM
1448 Views
- 19/11/2012 03:13:01 PM
1448 Views
They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5%
- 19/11/2012 03:19:19 PM
1498 Views
Re: They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5%
- 19/11/2012 04:01:43 PM
1652 Views
Re: They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5%
- 19/11/2012 09:04:04 PM
1425 Views
Hmmm...
- 20/11/2012 02:08:40 AM
1477 Views
Perhaps, but Egwene is also being a bit dramatic in the scene as she managed
- 20/11/2012 04:28:57 AM
1470 Views
Nope...
- 20/11/2012 03:13:13 PM
1536 Views
I believe she is being over dramatic
- 20/11/2012 03:26:24 PM
1383 Views
Keep believing that...
- 20/11/2012 03:30:14 PM
1534 Views
*shrugs*
- 20/11/2012 03:49:10 PM
1514 Views
Tired and forkroot are the same now?
- 20/11/2012 03:55:22 PM
1411 Views
No it's the literary device
- 20/11/2012 04:04:28 PM
1520 Views
Impossible. Daigian is exactly 0.32SD below the mean
- 19/11/2012 11:06:04 AM
1457 Views
You keep saying that, but it is either a linear or a non-linear distribution
- 19/11/2012 09:09:32 PM
1532 Views
That's the whole point. Thanks for finally seeing it.
- 19/11/2012 09:43:27 PM
1495 Views
keep believing that ... but you making up numbers isn't really relevant *NM*
- 20/11/2012 04:29:44 AM
895 Views
Please show me a number that is made up. The 0.32SD for Daigian is a rule of statistics.
- 20/11/2012 07:15:48 AM
1390 Views
Ugh. I hate power level discussions. For real world applications, it should be kind of meaningless
- 16/11/2012 10:28:49 PM
1388 Views
I don't really agree
- 18/11/2012 08:40:53 PM
1373 Views
Perhaps, but we've seen that a MUCH weaker Channeler can win in a duel
- 19/11/2012 09:13:48 PM
1402 Views
Re: Perhaps, but we've seen that a MUCH weaker Channeler can win in a duel
- 20/11/2012 08:10:01 AM
1396 Views
Since I've proven that it's not a normal distribution in units of absolute strength, SDs don't apply
- 17/11/2012 07:48:21 PM
1464 Views
You have proven nothing, except that you have an opinion *NM*
- 18/11/2012 02:21:35 AM
878 Views
You simply don't get it. It is mathematically a fact. There is no opinion involved.
- 18/11/2012 02:19:40 PM
1241 Views
Only because you've assigned numeric values. That you created.
- 18/11/2012 02:40:51 PM
1420 Views
It doesn't matter what figure you use...
- 18/11/2012 03:01:56 PM
1325 Views
What if Daigian is one third Lanfear's strength?
- 18/11/2012 04:37:58 PM
1472 Views
Sure you can
- 18/11/2012 10:09:31 PM
1451 Views
Re: Sure you can
- 18/11/2012 10:54:50 PM
1425 Views
You're right, though its 37.5%
- 19/11/2012 12:21:29 AM
1401 Views
Oops, typo!
- 19/11/2012 02:54:25 AM
1456 Views
Again, not possible, due to Daigian being just 0.3SD below the Mean
- 19/11/2012 08:37:01 AM
1399 Views
Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 19/11/2012 04:05:12 PM
1318 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 19/11/2012 05:55:02 PM
1265 Views
Egwene is about as strong as Melaine and Amys combined
- 19/11/2012 09:19:50 PM
1388 Views
Re: Egwene is about as strong as Melaine and Amys combined
- 20/11/2012 02:11:26 AM
1466 Views
Forkroot in every case
- 20/11/2012 04:32:26 AM
1377 Views
No!
- 20/11/2012 03:15:16 PM
1397 Views
I'm not going to go re-read the books to you on this
- 20/11/2012 03:39:46 PM
1367 Views
You need to read it for yourself, since you're completely confused.
- 20/11/2012 03:54:26 PM
1385 Views
Not going to argue this with you.
- 20/11/2012 04:09:44 PM
1289 Views
Your own example disproved your point...
- 20/11/2012 04:39:25 PM
1434 Views
let's see, she's both asleep and would need hours to regain her strength
- 20/11/2012 04:43:17 PM
1320 Views
Enough!
- 20/11/2012 05:04:06 PM
1396 Views
LOL ... whatever. You go on believing that ... no one else sees it this way. *NM*
- 20/11/2012 05:20:52 PM
869 Views
Re: Your own example disproved your point...
- 20/11/2012 05:10:15 PM
1409 Views
Barasine + Katerine isn't that much less than
- 20/11/2012 05:26:31 PM
1410 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 20/11/2012 02:26:47 AM
1328 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 20/11/2012 09:03:40 AM
1395 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 20/11/2012 02:59:08 PM
1392 Views
None of this is backed by any evidence...
- 20/11/2012 03:24:12 PM
1316 Views
who said Cadsuane was 1.5x Moiraine or more?
- 20/11/2012 04:03:13 PM
1328 Views
Nope...
- 20/11/2012 04:41:35 PM
1344 Views
wrong
- 20/11/2012 04:48:50 PM
1308 Views
Better evidence? LOL!
- 20/11/2012 03:18:55 PM
1379 Views
Huh? How did you come to that conclusion?
- 20/11/2012 04:40:56 PM
1377 Views
BEcause Cadsuane is close on the heels of Egwene?
- 20/11/2012 05:10:50 PM
1271 Views
I'm not arguing that. I agree that Cadsuane is pretty close to Egwene
- 20/11/2012 05:50:34 PM
1438 Views
Interesting, but let's go with your figures...
- 19/11/2012 06:54:54 AM
1458 Views
Indeed
- 19/11/2012 08:16:44 AM
1480 Views
Rand is sort of a special case
- 20/11/2012 04:25:02 AM
1362 Views
Regarding Mesaana...
- 20/11/2012 08:42:56 AM
1368 Views
You continue to mix two things
- 20/11/2012 03:24:44 PM
1286 Views
No
- 20/11/2012 04:54:19 PM
1530 Views
You are mistaken
- 20/11/2012 05:04:40 PM
1344 Views
Probably, but the AS have no idea what 37.5% means
- 19/11/2012 02:59:26 AM
1335 Views
It's irrelevant
- 19/11/2012 03:46:42 AM
1412 Views
Agreed. Daigian is the marker of the absolute bottom of Aes Sedai strength.
- 19/11/2012 06:55:41 AM
1375 Views
Daigian
- 19/11/2012 08:12:19 AM
1368 Views
It is a direct marker due to RJ's quote
- 19/11/2012 08:50:26 AM
1424 Views
You missed my point
- 19/11/2012 09:08:42 AM
1331 Views
Asmodean would never have made the comment about 13 weakest AS
- 20/11/2012 04:41:11 AM
1345 Views
Re: Asmodean would never have made the comment about 13 weakest AS
- 20/11/2012 09:07:49 AM
1318 Views
Re: Sure you can
- 19/11/2012 09:22:09 AM
1483 Views
Care to explain this...
- 19/11/2012 05:06:28 PM
1269 Views
Indeed
- 20/11/2012 07:16:37 AM
1473 Views
Explained far better than I ever could. Bravo.
- 20/11/2012 07:30:29 AM
1347 Views
Well duh.
- 20/11/2012 02:57:24 PM
1446 Views
Incorrect.
- 20/11/2012 04:28:07 PM
1440 Views
No
- 20/11/2012 04:44:16 PM
1417 Views
You're integrating without lower limits...
- 20/11/2012 02:55:06 PM
1387 Views
We are not talking about a normal distribution in any case
- 20/11/2012 04:44:24 AM
1222 Views
Re: We are not talking about a normal distribution in any case
- 20/11/2012 07:02:47 AM
1427 Views
You must tell me of this special math...
- 20/11/2012 03:10:09 PM
1315 Views
Re: You must tell me of this special math...
- 20/11/2012 04:29:40 PM
1378 Views
Morghase is a placeholder...
- 20/11/2012 04:45:42 PM
1464 Views
Well...
- 18/11/2012 08:43:59 PM
1436 Views
Re: Well...
- 19/11/2012 03:40:44 PM
1411 Views
Wow.
- 19/11/2012 03:53:47 PM
1437 Views
Well then you're both wrong I'm afraid
- 19/11/2012 06:09:36 PM
1381 Views
Re: Well then you're both wrong I'm afraid
- 19/11/2012 07:42:58 PM
1275 Views
this is why I think all of the Forsaken are very close in Power
- 20/11/2012 04:51:20 AM
1439 Views
Re: this is why I think all of the Forsaken are very close in Power
- 20/11/2012 02:45:18 PM
1356 Views
I think RJ went out of his way to keep strength a bit of a mystery
- 20/11/2012 08:42:44 PM
1385 Views
Math gurus...Is it possible to find the missing variable...
- 21/11/2012 05:12:24 PM
1380 Views
the problem is that the Mean is not going to tell us much really
- 22/11/2012 02:55:03 AM
1452 Views
Re: the problem is that the Mean is not going to tell us much really
- 22/11/2012 03:15:33 AM
1734 Views
I do not think you can calculate the Mean without knowing the Units of Power
- 22/11/2012 03:53:59 AM
1512 Views
