he is as strong as a Forsaken from almost his first moments touching the Source (he's stronger than Aginor in EoTW and a match for Be'lal and Ishamael in TDR) in all honesty his strength has been inconsistent throughout the series, but he's never been weaker than any Forsaken Male. Egwene and Elayne were both well short of their ultimate strength when he manhandles them and Verin and Alana are probably no more than Mean level Sisters so him overpowering them is a no brainer ... on my scale the stongest they can be is 32 ... Maybe 1 SD above a Mean of 24 or so ... combined they wouldn't be much more than 1/2 of a Forsaken male.
When you consider a Forsaken is going to be at a minimum an Effective strength of 85 it's going to take the most Powerful sisters (Myrelle or higher) to even be a strength match for a single weak Forsaken on a strength basis ... at a minimum they would need 3 of the Strongest Sisters to have a reliable strength match and even that would easily be countered by superior skill. If Nynaeve was ball park 85 in Ebou Dar, Ispan and Falion combined would be around around a 60-65 and their shield would be viable. Even if they lost 10% of their raw power they would gain effectiveness from linking and could hold Nynaeve.
I agree that for most of the series Egwene is around a 65-70 (between 80-90% or her potential), but I don't think she's hit her full potential ( 80 IMO) until maybe TGS when we see some significant increases in her abilities. Even in KoD she briefly considers taking on 5 AS until she realizes she's been forkrooted. And in ToM, after her massive use of Power using Vora's sa'angreal probably pushed her to her full potential, she is confident she can defeat Mesaana in single combat, which lends to her being much closer to Forsaken Strength than AS strength. And let's not forget that RJ noted that Egwene/Elayne/Aviendha are ONE level below the Forsaken.
When you consider a Forsaken is going to be at a minimum an Effective strength of 85 it's going to take the most Powerful sisters (Myrelle or higher) to even be a strength match for a single weak Forsaken on a strength basis ... at a minimum they would need 3 of the Strongest Sisters to have a reliable strength match and even that would easily be countered by superior skill. If Nynaeve was ball park 85 in Ebou Dar, Ispan and Falion combined would be around around a 60-65 and their shield would be viable. Even if they lost 10% of their raw power they would gain effectiveness from linking and could hold Nynaeve.
I agree that for most of the series Egwene is around a 65-70 (between 80-90% or her potential), but I don't think she's hit her full potential ( 80 IMO) until maybe TGS when we see some significant increases in her abilities. Even in KoD she briefly considers taking on 5 AS until she realizes she's been forkrooted. And in ToM, after her massive use of Power using Vora's sa'angreal probably pushed her to her full potential, she is confident she can defeat Mesaana in single combat, which lends to her being much closer to Forsaken Strength than AS strength. And let's not forget that RJ noted that Egwene/Elayne/Aviendha are ONE level below the Forsaken.
Egwene does not believe that she can defeat Mesaana alone. Her initial quote doesn't imply that she would do it alone. She may have planned an ambush or to confront Mesaana on her own terms, or with an angreal.
Later she says... "Egwene gritted her teeth and sent herself away. She didn't dare face the woman directly."
That is once again direct evidence that Egwene feels she can't fight one of the Forsaken directly. This is now after she has felt Mesaana's strength and perhaps seen her skill. Her opinion is unchanged to when she spoke about the Forsaken in Salidar.
Wheel of Time board admin
Fan of Lanfear
Fan of Lanfear
How many standard deviations is Lanfear
- 15/11/2012 06:04:39 PM
2638 Views
Hmm...
- 15/11/2012 07:25:34 PM
1733 Views
see we CAN agree on stuff
- 15/11/2012 07:56:12 PM
1568 Views
- 18/11/2012 08:37:22 PM
1428 Views
- 15/11/2012 07:56:12 PM
1568 Views
- 18/11/2012 08:37:22 PM
1428 Views
Re:
- 18/11/2012 11:07:17 PM
1643 Views
- 18/11/2012 11:07:17 PM
1643 Views
Re:
- 19/11/2012 05:16:00 AM
1480 Views
- 19/11/2012 05:16:00 AM
1480 Views
Re:
- 19/11/2012 03:13:01 PM
1473 Views
- 19/11/2012 03:13:01 PM
1473 Views
They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5%
- 19/11/2012 03:19:19 PM
1527 Views
Re: They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5%
- 19/11/2012 04:01:43 PM
1687 Views
Re: They only reject 37.5%, not 62.5%
- 19/11/2012 09:04:04 PM
1445 Views
Hmmm...
- 20/11/2012 02:08:40 AM
1499 Views
Perhaps, but Egwene is also being a bit dramatic in the scene as she managed
- 20/11/2012 04:28:57 AM
1495 Views
Nope...
- 20/11/2012 03:13:13 PM
1563 Views
I believe she is being over dramatic
- 20/11/2012 03:26:24 PM
1406 Views
Keep believing that...
- 20/11/2012 03:30:14 PM
1561 Views
*shrugs*
- 20/11/2012 03:49:10 PM
1541 Views
Tired and forkroot are the same now?
- 20/11/2012 03:55:22 PM
1432 Views
No it's the literary device
- 20/11/2012 04:04:28 PM
1545 Views
Impossible. Daigian is exactly 0.32SD below the mean
- 19/11/2012 11:06:04 AM
1483 Views
You keep saying that, but it is either a linear or a non-linear distribution
- 19/11/2012 09:09:32 PM
1554 Views
That's the whole point. Thanks for finally seeing it.
- 19/11/2012 09:43:27 PM
1520 Views
keep believing that ... but you making up numbers isn't really relevant *NM*
- 20/11/2012 04:29:44 AM
910 Views
Please show me a number that is made up. The 0.32SD for Daigian is a rule of statistics.
- 20/11/2012 07:15:48 AM
1422 Views
Ugh. I hate power level discussions. For real world applications, it should be kind of meaningless
- 16/11/2012 10:28:49 PM
1414 Views
I don't really agree
- 18/11/2012 08:40:53 PM
1396 Views
Perhaps, but we've seen that a MUCH weaker Channeler can win in a duel
- 19/11/2012 09:13:48 PM
1424 Views
Re: Perhaps, but we've seen that a MUCH weaker Channeler can win in a duel
- 20/11/2012 08:10:01 AM
1419 Views
Since I've proven that it's not a normal distribution in units of absolute strength, SDs don't apply
- 17/11/2012 07:48:21 PM
1502 Views
You have proven nothing, except that you have an opinion *NM*
- 18/11/2012 02:21:35 AM
891 Views
You simply don't get it. It is mathematically a fact. There is no opinion involved.
- 18/11/2012 02:19:40 PM
1264 Views
Only because you've assigned numeric values. That you created.
- 18/11/2012 02:40:51 PM
1439 Views
It doesn't matter what figure you use...
- 18/11/2012 03:01:56 PM
1347 Views
What if Daigian is one third Lanfear's strength?
- 18/11/2012 04:37:58 PM
1494 Views
Sure you can
- 18/11/2012 10:09:31 PM
1480 Views
Re: Sure you can
- 18/11/2012 10:54:50 PM
1453 Views
You're right, though its 37.5%
- 19/11/2012 12:21:29 AM
1433 Views
Oops, typo!
- 19/11/2012 02:54:25 AM
1485 Views
Again, not possible, due to Daigian being just 0.3SD below the Mean
- 19/11/2012 08:37:01 AM
1426 Views
Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 19/11/2012 04:05:12 PM
1348 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 19/11/2012 05:55:02 PM
1286 Views
Egwene is about as strong as Melaine and Amys combined
- 19/11/2012 09:19:50 PM
1413 Views
Re: Egwene is about as strong as Melaine and Amys combined
- 20/11/2012 02:11:26 AM
1494 Views
Forkroot in every case
- 20/11/2012 04:32:26 AM
1402 Views
No!
- 20/11/2012 03:15:16 PM
1419 Views
I'm not going to go re-read the books to you on this
- 20/11/2012 03:39:46 PM
1389 Views
You need to read it for yourself, since you're completely confused.
- 20/11/2012 03:54:26 PM
1414 Views
Not going to argue this with you.
- 20/11/2012 04:09:44 PM
1309 Views
Your own example disproved your point...
- 20/11/2012 04:39:25 PM
1458 Views
let's see, she's both asleep and would need hours to regain her strength
- 20/11/2012 04:43:17 PM
1344 Views
Enough!
- 20/11/2012 05:04:06 PM
1428 Views
LOL ... whatever. You go on believing that ... no one else sees it this way. *NM*
- 20/11/2012 05:20:52 PM
883 Views
Re: Your own example disproved your point...
- 20/11/2012 05:10:15 PM
1429 Views
Barasine + Katerine isn't that much less than
- 20/11/2012 05:26:31 PM
1436 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 20/11/2012 02:26:47 AM
1352 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 20/11/2012 09:03:40 AM
1421 Views
Re: Egwene is definitely not 2x Amys...
- 20/11/2012 02:59:08 PM
1421 Views
None of this is backed by any evidence...
- 20/11/2012 03:24:12 PM
1339 Views
who said Cadsuane was 1.5x Moiraine or more?
- 20/11/2012 04:03:13 PM
1364 Views
Nope...
- 20/11/2012 04:41:35 PM
1365 Views
wrong
- 20/11/2012 04:48:50 PM
1333 Views
Better evidence? LOL!
- 20/11/2012 03:18:55 PM
1403 Views
Huh? How did you come to that conclusion?
- 20/11/2012 04:40:56 PM
1408 Views
BEcause Cadsuane is close on the heels of Egwene?
- 20/11/2012 05:10:50 PM
1296 Views
I'm not arguing that. I agree that Cadsuane is pretty close to Egwene
- 20/11/2012 05:50:34 PM
1458 Views
Interesting, but let's go with your figures...
- 19/11/2012 06:54:54 AM
1485 Views
Indeed
- 19/11/2012 08:16:44 AM
1508 Views
Rand is sort of a special case
- 20/11/2012 04:25:02 AM
1400 Views
Regarding Mesaana...
- 20/11/2012 08:42:56 AM
1399 Views
You continue to mix two things
- 20/11/2012 03:24:44 PM
1315 Views
No
- 20/11/2012 04:54:19 PM
1554 Views
You are mistaken
- 20/11/2012 05:04:40 PM
1367 Views
Probably, but the AS have no idea what 37.5% means
- 19/11/2012 02:59:26 AM
1376 Views
It's irrelevant
- 19/11/2012 03:46:42 AM
1442 Views
Agreed. Daigian is the marker of the absolute bottom of Aes Sedai strength.
- 19/11/2012 06:55:41 AM
1399 Views
Daigian
- 19/11/2012 08:12:19 AM
1397 Views
It is a direct marker due to RJ's quote
- 19/11/2012 08:50:26 AM
1454 Views
You missed my point
- 19/11/2012 09:08:42 AM
1357 Views
Asmodean would never have made the comment about 13 weakest AS
- 20/11/2012 04:41:11 AM
1371 Views
Re: Asmodean would never have made the comment about 13 weakest AS
- 20/11/2012 09:07:49 AM
1347 Views
Re: Sure you can
- 19/11/2012 09:22:09 AM
1512 Views
Care to explain this...
- 19/11/2012 05:06:28 PM
1300 Views
Indeed
- 20/11/2012 07:16:37 AM
1505 Views
Explained far better than I ever could. Bravo.
- 20/11/2012 07:30:29 AM
1378 Views
Well duh.
- 20/11/2012 02:57:24 PM
1471 Views
Incorrect.
- 20/11/2012 04:28:07 PM
1464 Views
No
- 20/11/2012 04:44:16 PM
1437 Views
You're integrating without lower limits...
- 20/11/2012 02:55:06 PM
1410 Views
We are not talking about a normal distribution in any case
- 20/11/2012 04:44:24 AM
1251 Views
Re: We are not talking about a normal distribution in any case
- 20/11/2012 07:02:47 AM
1447 Views
You must tell me of this special math...
- 20/11/2012 03:10:09 PM
1341 Views
Re: You must tell me of this special math...
- 20/11/2012 04:29:40 PM
1405 Views
Morghase is a placeholder...
- 20/11/2012 04:45:42 PM
1489 Views
Well...
- 18/11/2012 08:43:59 PM
1464 Views
Re: Well...
- 19/11/2012 03:40:44 PM
1444 Views
Wow.
- 19/11/2012 03:53:47 PM
1463 Views
Well then you're both wrong I'm afraid
- 19/11/2012 06:09:36 PM
1414 Views
Re: Well then you're both wrong I'm afraid
- 19/11/2012 07:42:58 PM
1308 Views
this is why I think all of the Forsaken are very close in Power
- 20/11/2012 04:51:20 AM
1471 Views
Re: this is why I think all of the Forsaken are very close in Power
- 20/11/2012 02:45:18 PM
1399 Views
I think RJ went out of his way to keep strength a bit of a mystery
- 20/11/2012 08:42:44 PM
1410 Views
Math gurus...Is it possible to find the missing variable...
- 21/11/2012 05:12:24 PM
1404 Views
the problem is that the Mean is not going to tell us much really
- 22/11/2012 02:55:03 AM
1472 Views
Re: the problem is that the Mean is not going to tell us much really
- 22/11/2012 03:15:33 AM
1758 Views
I do not think you can calculate the Mean without knowing the Units of Power
- 22/11/2012 03:53:59 AM
1535 Views
